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1st Gen. Ram - All TopicsDiscussion for all Dodge Rams prior to 1994. This includes engine, drivetrain and non-drivetrain discussions. Anything prior to 1994 should go in here.
The trans shop is so popular that the guy had 7 others in front of mine. Between the holidays and the flu he is just now getting to mine. Don't know the exact problem yet but with their stethoscope they narrowed down the noise to the middle rear of the tranny. What confounds me is my Blackstone report came back clean and perfect.
I told him my motor upgrades and how I used the truck and he is going to give me a quote for a new TC, upgraded flex and valve body. What I didn't ask is what brand(s) he uses. I will find out. I may not have time to order mine but can see about the SFI you and bigragu highly recommend.
I've done a lot of back and forth over the upgrades but agree it makes more sense now while it is already out rather than a week later when it would inevitably fail. I took out an equity loan about 10 years ago, I called the credit union and they said it was still open and I had $38K available so I hope that covers it
KRB, that thicker, SfI rated flexplate is a PRW brand, part# PQX1835910. I bought it thru jet.com. Cost was $128.09, with like a 10% discount for being a first time purchase thru jet. It was shipped from a place called Custom Hitch and Trailer.
You’re going to have to get new flexplate bolts, 8 of, part#3908522 from Cummins, and flexplate to converter bolts, 6 of, part# 6033439 from puredieselpower.com
KRB, that thicker, SfI rated flexplate is a PRW brand, part# PQX1835910. I bought it thru jet.com. Cost was $128.09, with like a 10% discount for being a first time purchase thru jet. It was shipped from a place called Custom Hitch and Trailer.
You’re going to have to get new flexplate bolts, 8 of, part#3908522 from Cummins, and flexplate to converter bolts, 6 of, part# 6033439 from puredieselpower.com
You auto guys get new bolts every time you pull the transmission?
To my delight I found a nv4500 4x4 transmission with 8,000 miles on it that comes with the flywheel, clutch, adapter plate, etc. to do a complete swap. I have a 47 rh in the truck right now so I don't need all that they are selling, but they are unwilling to work on price to leave out stuff I don't need. They are asking $2000 for the whole deal on the transmission, flywheel, clutch, adapter plate, shifter, clutch hydraulics, and shifter boot. They want an additional $600 for the dld transfer case with same mileage. Is this a good price? Also, how much would a core 47 rh be worth with the adapter plate and such? (With and without transfer case? Last question for this post anyway. Does a 205 transfer case for a 47 rh have the same spline shafts as the nv4500? The truck was originally a getrag, but the P.O. swapped it to the 47 due to knee problems. It works, but I would prefer the manual. Gotta love this thread for all around first gen topics. I didn't feel this was quite worth starting another thread for anyway.
To answer a few of your questions
Your adapter plate for the 47rh is the same plate used with the nv4500 as is the starter between the two.
Their was not a 47rh cummins transmission with a np205. What you have is likely one of 2 things a 23 spline or 29 spline output on your 47rh tailshaft. I suspect it's a 23 spline as that would be a oem shaft and if it's a 29 spline it's a custom part. A getrag and nv4500 both share a 29 spline output.
As to his price of $2600 it's a fair price and although you have no use for the dld t-case and some of the other 2nd gen parts as they are not needed in your 1st gen truck he is foolish to separate them as they belong together. Once he separates the 5 speed conversion kit all of the remaining parts have a much lesser value. Think of it as if you were buying a swap kit that had all the parts only to get home and realize your missing a half dozen things that you would spend months trying to find and quite possible don't find some of the needed parts like the shifter boot.
Personally I would skip the thought of the nv4500 and find a getrag and all the correct parts your still going to need like the crossmember, shifter boot, clutch and brake pedals, slave cylinder mount, 4 wheel shifter adapter bracket and linkage rod.
The nv4500 is not a slice of heaven like some seem to think it is. Buy a getrag and don't speed shift it, install the plate coolers on it with a temp gauge fill with the correct oil and it will outlast any nv4500.
I finally finished wiring up my auxiliary power plugs under the dash. There is a 12V switched cigar lighter receptacle for the GPS so I don't have to continually plug/unplug it. Two on all time USB power receptacles for phones. And a Digital voltmeter which is only on with the key and shows the true voltage at the VR which runs through a relay directly to the battery.
There is a stupid blue LED on the USB plugs which I didn't know about. If it gets too annoying a may drill it out and fill the hole with black RTV.
You auto guys get new bolts every time you pull the transmission?
The two times I’ve had to replace my flexplate, I’ve replaced the 8 bolts that connect the flexplate to the crank, and the 6 bolts that connect the flexplate to the torque converter. I read somewhere that is was highly reccomended, just can’t remember where. Cheap insurance, really.
You auto guys get new bolts every time you pull the transmission?
The flexplate and torque converter bolts get replaced each time I do. Why? Small bolts, lots of torque applied to them, and it's less expensive than pulling the trans back out if there's an issue.
I finally finished wiring up my auxiliary power plugs under the dash. There is a 12V switched cigar lighter receptacle for the GPS so I don't have to continually plug/unplug it. Two on all time USB power receptacles for phones. And a Digital voltmeter which is only on with the key and shows the true voltage at the VR which runs through a relay directly to the battery.
There is a stupid blue LED on the USB plugs which I didn't know about. If it gets too annoying a may drill it out and fill the hole with black RTV.
Nice scratch on the arm, Edwin.
Wife beating the snot out of you again?
Bright lights facing the driver in the cab can be annoying, no doubt. Black electrical tape temporarily works too
Your adapter plate for the 47rh is the same plate used with the nv4500 as is the starter between the two.
Their was not a 47rh cummins transmission with a np205. What you have is likely one of 2 things a 23 spline or 29 spline output on your 47rh tailshaft. I suspect it's a 23 spline as that would be a oem shaft and if it's a 29 spline it's a custom part. A getrag and nv4500 both share a 29 spline output.
As to his price of $2600 it's a fair price and although you have no use for the dld t-case and some of the other 2nd gen parts as they are not needed in your 1st gen truck he is foolish to separate them as they belong together. Once he separates the 5 speed conversion kit all of the remaining parts have a much lesser value. Think of it as if you were buying a swap kit that had all the parts only to get home and realize your missing a half dozen things that you would spend months trying to find and quite possible don't find some of the needed parts like the shifter boot.
Personally I would skip the thought of the nv4500 and find a getrag and all the correct parts your still going to need like the crossmember, shifter boot, clutch and brake pedals, slave cylinder mount, 4 wheel shifter adapter bracket and linkage rod.
The nv4500 is not a slice of heaven like some seem to think it is. Buy a getrag and don't speed shift it, install the plate coolers on it with a temp gauge fill with the correct oil and it will outlast any nv4500.
Hmm... interesting. I know the nv4500 has the 5th gear nut fix, but there seems to be a fix for that now. I guess Getrags just make me nervous with all the horror stories I've heard.
Can you still put a clutch on a getrag that will hold 800 ft. lbs. like you can with a nv4500? It seems as though these ve pump 12 valves make a LOT of torque even though they don't necessarily make tons of hp. Not saying can't, but I've seen several dunks on first gens where people were making mid 200's on the horsepower and over 700 on the torque. That's with a stock turbo and injectors with just pump mods.
I don't have gauges yet so I haven't messed with the pump really. I think I might turn the pre-boost screw one turn to get a little more deliverability, but then I will wait until I get gauges to touch anything else. I plan to get Autometer z-series pyro and trans temp with a 2 gauge pillar pod, but I have to save up a little more money.
Any who, today I got the 4" Diamond Eye turbo back exhaust and started on that. Before it got too late I got the old one cut off and the new downpipe put on loosely. I decided to take the truck for a quick drive after I have cut the exhaust off to just behind the cab as it then had no muffler.
When I first started it I didn't really notice much difference at idle. It had a little throatier sound, but didn't seem any louder. As soon as I started to give it throttle it changed, however. It was then noticeably louder and seemed to run better and be more responsive. I liked it, but I had had my fun after flooring it down the highway for a few hundred yards and headed home.
I really hope NJTman appreciates my efforts to hopefully separate things into paragraphs correctly.
I then got back and cut the pipe that connects to the downpipe and goes past the transmission off. Next I took the bellhousing hanger off and rested that piece of pipe on the frame. Now the dangerous part happened. I had cut one finger on sharp pipe already, but it was minor. It was a different story when I tried to take the next hanger off. ***NOTE: I recommend removing the second hanger before the bellhousing hanger to anyone swapping exhausts. This will prevent the hanger from twisting in the rubber and causing your wrenches to slip.*** The My one wrench slipped off the bolt and my finger slid right across the sharp edge of cut pipe and cut deep. I told myself it wouldn't bleed too bad and kept going.
A while later while I was taking the downpipe off I started having blood run off my hand. I kind of cleaned the area and threw a band aid on it for the time. That thing was bleeding a surprising amount though.
After patching myself up I tried taking thee downpipe the rest of the way off and ended up fighting v-band clamp for a good 20 minutes. I finally got it off and then put the new downpipe on loosely.
That's about as far as I got, but the rest should go pretty quick other than modifying the bell housing hanger to work with the new exhaust. I might end up just using strapping hold it there now as the angle is off and it is made for 3 inch pipe. We'll see how much more I can get done tomorrow after school before I have to go to fire training. Window guide seals and tint are soon to come. Oh, and I'm definitely happy with the exhaust so far. Well see what it does when I have to put the muffler on.
You can get any clutch for the getrag just the same as the nv. The 5th gear in the nv4500 is a design flaw, their are numerous bandaid "upgrades" but they do not address the cause of the problem. The problem being 5th gear does not have the proper support needed as it is not inside the transmision case where it belongs.
Their is lock mechanism that will keep the nut in place but it only works on the 4x4 model and does not address the cause just the effect. This is also something not very old that has just been brought to the market. Their is a reason that new venture is no longer in business and getrag is. The nv is simply a 4 speed that they incorporated 5th gear into the tailshaft, ingenous but it didn't withstand the cummins engine output.
One thing the nv4500 has going for it is it's smooth shifting but it's at the expense of some spendy spendy oil and fancy coated synchronizers.
The horror stories you hear about the getrag can usually be attributed to operator errors like, filling with gear oil, overheating the oil while towing in 5th gear, speed shifting and numerous other preventable mistakes. The getrag also came with a factory Sachs 13" cast iron clutch much like the heavy duty trucks use. The nv came with a cheap stamped steel 12.25" clutch in 1994 and up.
You can put in either trans but in reality the nv4500 isn't an upgrade from the getrag it's just a different route to take with its own set of different flaws.
You can get any clutch for the getrag just the same as the nv. The 5th gear in the nv4500 is a design flaw, their are numerous bandaid "upgrades" but they do not address the cause of the problem. The problem being 5th gear does not have the proper support needed as it is not inside the transmision case where it belongs.
Their is lock mechanism that will keep the nut in place but it only works on the 4x4 model and does not address the cause just the effect. This is also something not very old that has just been brought to the market. Their is a reason that new venture is no longer in business and getrag is. The nv is simply a 4 speed that they incorporated 5th gear into the tailshaft, ingenous but it didn't withstand the cummins engine output.
One thing the nv4500 has going for it is it's smooth shifting but it's at the expense of some spendy spendy oil and fancy coated synchronizers.
The horror stories you hear about the getrag can usually be attributed to operator errors like, filling with gear oil, overheating the oil while towing in 5th gear, speed shifting and numerous other preventable mistakes. The getrag also came with a factory Sachs 13" cast iron clutch much like the heavy duty trucks use. The nv came with a cheap stamped steel 12.25" clutch in 1994 and up.
You can put in either trans but in reality the nv4500 isn't an upgrade from the getrag it's just a different route to take with its own set of different flaws.
Hmm. Why does it ruin the Getrag simply to bang through the gears? I wouldn’t mind having a Getrag if I could just get rid of the 47rh. Truck just doesn’t shift like it seems it should. Not sure I could help myself to not bang through the gears quickly on freeway on ramps and such though. Wouldn’t I have to find a Getrag bellhousing and adapter plate?Also, if I don’t have a np205 transfer case, what would I have? How do I tell? I wouldn’t be surprised if the47rh in the truck now has a different output shaft. The previous owner did he swap though so I don’t know. I’m guessing there would just be a plate somewhere on it that said what transfer case it is?Also, would this transmission solve all the flaws of the nv4500? https://spprecision.com/products/dod...-for-sale.html
01-10-2018, 10:36 AM
