Not impressed with 6.7
#46
Yep 6.4 is performaing well already.
New TSB posted this week.
__________________________________________________ ______________
TSB 07-8-9
6.4L DIESEL ENGINE - LACKS POWER, LEAKS FLUID FROM EXHAUST PIPE, ABNORMAL TAILPIPE SEDIMENT, WHITE SMOKE, EXHAUST SMELL, AND MIL ON
ISSUE:
Some F-Super Duty vehicles equipped with the 6.4L diesel may exhibit one or more of the following concerns: lacks power, leaks oil, fuel or coolant from the tail pipe, abnormal tailpipe sediment, white smoke or ash, exhaust smell, knock or rattle, elevated idle, surge, crankcase oil level over-full, MIL On, DTC's P0087, P2291, P0263-P0284, P0300-P0308, P1336, P132B, P2262, P2263, P244C or P244D.
ACTION:
To diagnose and correct the concern, refer to the following Service Procedure.
SERVICE PROCEDURE
NOTE:
DO NOT START ENGINE
Evaluation, Inspections, And Checks
1. Retrieve KOEO diagnostic trouble codes (DTCs).
2. Check oil level. Remove and clean dipstick. Reinsert into dipstick tube only until dipstick handle reaches top of dipstick tube (Figure 1).
NOTE:
FIGURE 1 DEMONSTRATES DIPSTICK POSITIONING FOR OVER-FULL CHECK. KEEP DIPSTICK HANDLE OFFSET OF CENTRE TO PREVENT IT FROM FULLY SEATING. IF OIL LEVEL IS BELOW THE MAX MARK, OIL IS NOT OVER-FULL.
3. Check coolant level.
4. Check fuel quality.
5. Inspect tailpipes for abnormal sediment; for example black soot, white ash, oil, coolant, or fuel.
6. Inspect vehicle for coolant, oil and fuel leaks at the following locations:
• Tailpipes
• Up-pipe joints
• Exhaust manifolds to cylinder heads
• Exhaust manifolds to up-pipes
• Charge air cooler system and air inlet system
NOTE:
PROCEED ONLY IF ENGINE OIL TEMPERATURE (EOT) IS LESS THAN 150 °F (66 °C).
NOTE:
VALIDATE INTEGRITY OF ALL EXHAUST GAS TEMPERATURE (EGT) SENSORS WITH POWERTRAIN CONTROL/EMISSIONS DIAGNOSIS (PC/ED) PINPOINT TEST (PPT) RC5 AND RC6 BEFORE PROCEEDING.
NOTE:
IF REPAIRS ARE PERFORMED AS A RESULT OF THIS TSB, CHECK DIESEL PARTICULATE FILTER OPERATION. SEE PC/ED, SYMPTOM CHARTS, NO DTCS, CHART 8.
Repair Directions
• Section A - If the following DTCs are present P0087, P2291, P0263-0284, P0300-P0308, or P1336 or if observation of external fuel leaks, for example, wetness around exhaust manifolds or over-full oil level indication.
• Section B - If the following DTCs are present P132B, P2262, or P2263 or observation of oil leaks (aside from over-full oil level) or oil level is low.
• Section C - If coolant low or observation of coolant leaks.
• Sections A, B, and C - If only abnormal sediment in tailpipes.
SECTION - A
Fuel System Diagnostics
NOTE:
IN CASES WHERE ENGINE OIL HAS BEEN DILUTED WITH DIESEL FUEL AND ALL REPAIRS ARE COMPLETE, RELEASE THE OIL FILTER CAP ALLOWING OIL TO DRAIN TO OIL PAN AND KEEP FILTER, DRAIN THE OIL FROM OIL PAN AND FILL WITH NEW OIL. TIGHTEN OIL FILTER CAP AND RUN ENGINE FOR 10 MINUTES. FINALLY, CHANGE OIL FILTER AND OIL AGAIN.
1. If oil is not over-full - go to Step 9.
2. If oil is over full, drain and fill crankcase with new oil setting the level to the middle of the hash marks.
3. Remove valve covers; refer to Workshop Manual (WSM), Section 303-01.
4. Remove lower charged air cooler CAC hose. Inspect for fuel and oil contamination. Clean as required and reinstall.
5. Start engine and use caution when looking for fuel leaks around supply tubes and injectors.
6. If no leak is found run the IDS high pressure fuel system test and inspect for a leak during the test.
7. If no leak is found turn the engine off and use a hand held mirror to inspect for cracks on the underside of the fitting boss. (Figure 2)
8. Replace any leaking components and verify leak has been repaired while running IDS high pressure fuel system test - KOER.
9. Perform WSM, Section 303-04D - Turbocharger Bearing Clearance Check.
10. If fuel quality is poor, drain all fuel and replace with known good ultra-low sulfur diesel fuel.
11. If no DTCs were stored in pending or continuous memory go to Step 13.
12. Is there abnormal sediment in tailpipes or fuel evident?
A. No - Complete PC/ED worksheet and applicable PPT tests for the codes retrieved.
B. Yes - Go to Step 13.
13. Is there abnormal sediment in the tailpipes?
A. No - See WSM for diagnosis.
B. Yes - Go to Step 14.
14. Perform IDS Relative Compression Test.
A. Problem Identified - Repair as required.
B. No Problem - Go to Step 15.
15. Perform fuel supply system pressure check (low pressure system) - KOEO.
A. Problem Identified - Repair as required.
B. No Problem - Go to Step 16.
16. Observe IDS injector fuel trim.
NOTE:
FUEL TRIM WILL DEFAULT TO ZERO WHILE EXHAUST AFTER TREATMENT SYSTEM REGENERATION IS ACTIVE. (Figure 3)
17. Observe IDS Power Balance. (Figure 3)
18. Perform Enhanced Power Balance. (Figure 3)
19. Compare results in Steps 16-18.
A. Low fuel trim may indicate leaking injector.
B. High contribution may indicate leaking injector.
C. Elevated contribution in comparison to other cylinders while cancelled may indicate leaking injector.
D. Excessive pull-up by subsequent injector may indicate leaking injector.
E. An engine knock that is lessened when a cylinder is cancelled may indicate a leaking injector.
20. If no root cause is determined in Steps 1-18, perform IDS high-pressure fuel system check and repeat Steps 1-18.
21. If no root cause is determined, replace horizontal fuel conditioning module (HFCM) and on-engine fuel filters.
SECTION - B
1. Do not crank engine. Perform KOEO and observe turbocharger actuator. Does the actuator move at key on?
A. No - Ensure turbocharger is above 32 °F (0 °C). Move truck to a warm location and repeat test. If turbocharger actuator does not move and is above 32 °F (0 °C), perform PC/ED diagnostics.
B. Yes - Step 2.
2. If no DTCs are present, go to Step 4.
3. Is oil or abnormal sediment evident in tailpipes?
A. No - Complete PC/ED worksheet and applicable PPT tests for the codes retrieved.
B. Yes - Perform WSM, Section 303-04D - Turbocharger Bearing Clearance Check and repair as required.
4. Is oil or abnormal sediment evident in tailpipes?
A. No - Perform WSM, Section 100-04 - Noise Diagnostics.
B. Yes - Perform WSM, Section 303-04D - Turbocharger Bearing Clearance Check and repair as required.
5. Remove lower CAC hose. Inspect for fuel and oil contamination. Clean as required and reinstall.
SECTION - C
Perform WSM, Section 303-03 - Diagnostics for EGR cooler and engine internal coolant leaks.
WARRANTY STATUS:
Eligible Under Provisions Of New Vehicle Limited Warranty Coverage And Emissions Warranty Coverage
New TSB posted this week.
__________________________________________________ ______________
TSB 07-8-9
6.4L DIESEL ENGINE - LACKS POWER, LEAKS FLUID FROM EXHAUST PIPE, ABNORMAL TAILPIPE SEDIMENT, WHITE SMOKE, EXHAUST SMELL, AND MIL ON
ISSUE:
Some F-Super Duty vehicles equipped with the 6.4L diesel may exhibit one or more of the following concerns: lacks power, leaks oil, fuel or coolant from the tail pipe, abnormal tailpipe sediment, white smoke or ash, exhaust smell, knock or rattle, elevated idle, surge, crankcase oil level over-full, MIL On, DTC's P0087, P2291, P0263-P0284, P0300-P0308, P1336, P132B, P2262, P2263, P244C or P244D.
ACTION:
To diagnose and correct the concern, refer to the following Service Procedure.
SERVICE PROCEDURE
NOTE:
DO NOT START ENGINE
Evaluation, Inspections, And Checks
1. Retrieve KOEO diagnostic trouble codes (DTCs).
2. Check oil level. Remove and clean dipstick. Reinsert into dipstick tube only until dipstick handle reaches top of dipstick tube (Figure 1).
NOTE:
FIGURE 1 DEMONSTRATES DIPSTICK POSITIONING FOR OVER-FULL CHECK. KEEP DIPSTICK HANDLE OFFSET OF CENTRE TO PREVENT IT FROM FULLY SEATING. IF OIL LEVEL IS BELOW THE MAX MARK, OIL IS NOT OVER-FULL.
3. Check coolant level.
4. Check fuel quality.
5. Inspect tailpipes for abnormal sediment; for example black soot, white ash, oil, coolant, or fuel.
6. Inspect vehicle for coolant, oil and fuel leaks at the following locations:
• Tailpipes
• Up-pipe joints
• Exhaust manifolds to cylinder heads
• Exhaust manifolds to up-pipes
• Charge air cooler system and air inlet system
NOTE:
PROCEED ONLY IF ENGINE OIL TEMPERATURE (EOT) IS LESS THAN 150 °F (66 °C).
NOTE:
VALIDATE INTEGRITY OF ALL EXHAUST GAS TEMPERATURE (EGT) SENSORS WITH POWERTRAIN CONTROL/EMISSIONS DIAGNOSIS (PC/ED) PINPOINT TEST (PPT) RC5 AND RC6 BEFORE PROCEEDING.
NOTE:
IF REPAIRS ARE PERFORMED AS A RESULT OF THIS TSB, CHECK DIESEL PARTICULATE FILTER OPERATION. SEE PC/ED, SYMPTOM CHARTS, NO DTCS, CHART 8.
Repair Directions
• Section A - If the following DTCs are present P0087, P2291, P0263-0284, P0300-P0308, or P1336 or if observation of external fuel leaks, for example, wetness around exhaust manifolds or over-full oil level indication.
• Section B - If the following DTCs are present P132B, P2262, or P2263 or observation of oil leaks (aside from over-full oil level) or oil level is low.
• Section C - If coolant low or observation of coolant leaks.
• Sections A, B, and C - If only abnormal sediment in tailpipes.
SECTION - A
Fuel System Diagnostics
NOTE:
IN CASES WHERE ENGINE OIL HAS BEEN DILUTED WITH DIESEL FUEL AND ALL REPAIRS ARE COMPLETE, RELEASE THE OIL FILTER CAP ALLOWING OIL TO DRAIN TO OIL PAN AND KEEP FILTER, DRAIN THE OIL FROM OIL PAN AND FILL WITH NEW OIL. TIGHTEN OIL FILTER CAP AND RUN ENGINE FOR 10 MINUTES. FINALLY, CHANGE OIL FILTER AND OIL AGAIN.
1. If oil is not over-full - go to Step 9.
2. If oil is over full, drain and fill crankcase with new oil setting the level to the middle of the hash marks.
3. Remove valve covers; refer to Workshop Manual (WSM), Section 303-01.
4. Remove lower charged air cooler CAC hose. Inspect for fuel and oil contamination. Clean as required and reinstall.
5. Start engine and use caution when looking for fuel leaks around supply tubes and injectors.
6. If no leak is found run the IDS high pressure fuel system test and inspect for a leak during the test.
7. If no leak is found turn the engine off and use a hand held mirror to inspect for cracks on the underside of the fitting boss. (Figure 2)
8. Replace any leaking components and verify leak has been repaired while running IDS high pressure fuel system test - KOER.
9. Perform WSM, Section 303-04D - Turbocharger Bearing Clearance Check.
10. If fuel quality is poor, drain all fuel and replace with known good ultra-low sulfur diesel fuel.
11. If no DTCs were stored in pending or continuous memory go to Step 13.
12. Is there abnormal sediment in tailpipes or fuel evident?
A. No - Complete PC/ED worksheet and applicable PPT tests for the codes retrieved.
B. Yes - Go to Step 13.
13. Is there abnormal sediment in the tailpipes?
A. No - See WSM for diagnosis.
B. Yes - Go to Step 14.
14. Perform IDS Relative Compression Test.
A. Problem Identified - Repair as required.
B. No Problem - Go to Step 15.
15. Perform fuel supply system pressure check (low pressure system) - KOEO.
A. Problem Identified - Repair as required.
B. No Problem - Go to Step 16.
16. Observe IDS injector fuel trim.
NOTE:
FUEL TRIM WILL DEFAULT TO ZERO WHILE EXHAUST AFTER TREATMENT SYSTEM REGENERATION IS ACTIVE. (Figure 3)
17. Observe IDS Power Balance. (Figure 3)
18. Perform Enhanced Power Balance. (Figure 3)
19. Compare results in Steps 16-18.
A. Low fuel trim may indicate leaking injector.
B. High contribution may indicate leaking injector.
C. Elevated contribution in comparison to other cylinders while cancelled may indicate leaking injector.
D. Excessive pull-up by subsequent injector may indicate leaking injector.
E. An engine knock that is lessened when a cylinder is cancelled may indicate a leaking injector.
20. If no root cause is determined in Steps 1-18, perform IDS high-pressure fuel system check and repeat Steps 1-18.
21. If no root cause is determined, replace horizontal fuel conditioning module (HFCM) and on-engine fuel filters.
SECTION - B
1. Do not crank engine. Perform KOEO and observe turbocharger actuator. Does the actuator move at key on?
A. No - Ensure turbocharger is above 32 °F (0 °C). Move truck to a warm location and repeat test. If turbocharger actuator does not move and is above 32 °F (0 °C), perform PC/ED diagnostics.
B. Yes - Step 2.
2. If no DTCs are present, go to Step 4.
3. Is oil or abnormal sediment evident in tailpipes?
A. No - Complete PC/ED worksheet and applicable PPT tests for the codes retrieved.
B. Yes - Perform WSM, Section 303-04D - Turbocharger Bearing Clearance Check and repair as required.
4. Is oil or abnormal sediment evident in tailpipes?
A. No - Perform WSM, Section 100-04 - Noise Diagnostics.
B. Yes - Perform WSM, Section 303-04D - Turbocharger Bearing Clearance Check and repair as required.
5. Remove lower CAC hose. Inspect for fuel and oil contamination. Clean as required and reinstall.
SECTION - C
Perform WSM, Section 303-03 - Diagnostics for EGR cooler and engine internal coolant leaks.
WARRANTY STATUS:
Eligible Under Provisions Of New Vehicle Limited Warranty Coverage And Emissions Warranty Coverage
#47
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The quad cab with box 6.7 feels like it has more power then the cab and chassis. I think its because of the way the gearing is setup. It pulls really hard in 1-3 then tapers 3-6 At about 50mph it doesn't have much pull when u step on it. The tranny doesn't down shift it just slowly pulls. I don't know if maybe the deck on it is to heavy? The jake break on it is pretty sweet tho. Also the cab and chassis has PRND123 where the reg 3500 has PRND then shifter on shift leaver.
#50
Would have to modify the engie to trans adapter, and flexplate for sure. Biggest thing would be the controls. New modules share info over a fast CAN bus and are not hard wired in to the various sensors like older transmission controls.
#52
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I came over to Dodge from a late '99 Ford F350 Lariat Crew Cab 4x4 Dually after my 4R100 died in 63K with no chip or hard pulling, costing me 3K, tie rods bad, ball joints always out, eating front tires, alignment never true, carrier bearings out, vibration problems no one could figure out. It was comfy though with Lariat trim, and nice to look at. Just cost me too much money. Have had great luck with my 04.5 Dodge, 80% of miles towing. All I have done is rear u-joints at 45K.
#53
Quite frankly, I dont think we will EVER see a stock trans that will hold the power these modded diesels can produce.
#54
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i for 1 love my truck 77k on the ode and not 1 problem this has been the most truble free truck i have ever had . it pulls anything i hook to . i doupt you beat one anyharded than i do . . i go where ever i want to with it through the woods it doin't matter . love my truck .
#55
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Guess I'm getting in on this late, but I just went over 36,000 miles yesterday in my cab and chassis with 0 problems, the only thing I've done is change fluids. All I do is run in the oilfield, hotshot, pulling a big heavy gooseneck. The difference is I own my truck and when it goes down I don't make any money. Believe me, I won't be jumping any logs or whatever is done up there in my truck. We have some roads in Texas that are pretty rough, but we take our time and get there. You want a Ford, go for it. We've had them in our yard and before long they are gone. Hate to say it, but it sounds to me like there are some people that don't really care if they tear up equiptment. We have had a few company drivers like that, but before long they end up getting run off. Good luck with your Ford, will look forward to reading your posts on the Dieselstop complaining about your Ford.
#56
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I personally think that some of you guys are being a little rough on pg. He is right, every truck out there has its plus's and minus's. Here in Grande Prairie we see the rough stuff that trucks can go through. A good indicator as to what trucks work and which ones dont is to look at what the oil patch guys are driving. I have to tell you, there is a lot of fords out there. Ford makes a much stronger front end then our dodges, I think that with the extra weight of the cummins and rough roads the front ends will prematurely wear out on our trucks. That being said, I know of a few companies that have went away from the fords because of engine problems, but are willing to take a chance on the 6.4 because they miss the rest of the truck. Alot of these same guys wish that Chev would build a real truck that had a real tough front end in it, cause to be honest the duramax is a good engine, and well the allison is just an awesome tranny (dont we all wish we could have an allison behind our 5.9?)
So I guess what I am saying, is listen to what he is saying, give him a break, and wish him luck with that 6.4
Kevin
So I guess what I am saying, is listen to what he is saying, give him a break, and wish him luck with that 6.4
Kevin
#57
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Its ok, your not bursting my bubble. Ford has allways ran a live front end on the 350's and greater. And yes the springs have always been of a slightly smaller diameter. But what makes them stronger is the way that they put them together. Coming from an oil town I get to see what falls apart first, and it works like this, chevy, dodge, ford. (For front end parts)
Now I wasnt talking manual to auto, I was refering to auto verses auto. The allison is an awesome automatic transmission, but they arent a manual tranny. I hope for Dodges sake that they have it right with the new 68rfe and the new aisen. They were so far behind on transmission technology that people would look elsewhere just due to the 48re and its problems. Sure they work good after you spend some money on them, but even after 6 grand on mine, it still only has 4 gears....
Kevin
Now I wasnt talking manual to auto, I was refering to auto verses auto. The allison is an awesome automatic transmission, but they arent a manual tranny. I hope for Dodges sake that they have it right with the new 68rfe and the new aisen. They were so far behind on transmission technology that people would look elsewhere just due to the 48re and its problems. Sure they work good after you spend some money on them, but even after 6 grand on mine, it still only has 4 gears....
Kevin
#58
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IMO the 48re is a decent auto tranny if the truck is stock, certainly a lot more stout than the 4R100 in my last Ford (which had seized front wheel bearings/hubs at 38K). Mine has been fine and I have a friend with 130K on his 48re, still shifts like new. Again, these are stock trucks, you do the mods and all bets are off. I have worked in the oil patch and know how those trucks get abused. Personally, if I were suppling trucks to oil rig hands, they'd be driving manual gassers.
#59
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The stock tranny is stronger then the torque converter. Gas motors dont seem to last as long when they pack weight and get abused all the time. Plus dyed diesel is alot cheaper then gas.