3rd Gen Engine and Drivetrain -> 2003-2007 5.9 liter Engine and drivetrain discussion only. PLEASE, NO HIGH PERFORMANCE DISCUSSION!

When to Shift and What's that sound?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 12-28-2007, 09:11 PM
  #1  
Registered User
Thread Starter
 
javven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
When to Shift and What's that sound?

The manual has specific speeds / shift points. However, I'd like to know what RPM you guys use to shift. I'm very, very new to my dodge ctd and am getting used to the shifting.

I hear a slight ticking that sounds like valvetrain (or maybe fuel injection) but it could be completely normal AFAIK. I've had diesels that were louder (Toyota) and quieter (MB).

The tick is RPM-dependent but either goes away or becomes inaudible above about 1300 rpm.

Rig's got less than 1K miles and I'm sorting out the trans shift points, etc - no there's really probably nothing wrong. Just helps to get a 2nd opinion.

I have a 3.73 rear end.
Old 12-28-2007, 09:22 PM
  #2  
Registered User
 
Fisherguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Surrey BC Canada (it's not that bad eh!)
Posts: 3,640
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
You've never had a standard before I'm guessing?

When I shift depends on many things:, uphill; flat; downhill; taking it easy; driving hard to prevent a rice rocket passing on the right; etc etc.

Mostly you go by feel, you should 'feel' when the time is right for the next gear rather than waiting for some pre-determined mark...
Old 12-28-2007, 09:27 PM
  #3  
Registered User
Thread Starter
 
javven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I've had more than a few standards but shifting a 6 sp (first-tho basically it's a 5 +granny) on a diesel that redlines at 3100 and doesn't like much above 2300 is new to me.

Not quite the same as the Subaru I had that could rag out to 4500 and slam-shift every time. Too, I'm older now and wouldn't mind having this transmission more than 3-4 years.

The problem tonight may have been that I'm tired and not paying attention to it.

I'd still like to know what's up with the tick/tap. I doubt it's a problem but I'd like to know. It's really subtle but it's there. Almost like tapping on a window with a small pencil.
Old 12-28-2007, 10:14 PM
  #4  
Registered User
 
DiEseLjunKy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Winchester, TN
Posts: 1,118
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Driving easy I'll usually be shifting where the rpms will drop right back down to peak torque 1600rpms that way you're not overreving and wasting fuel.
Old 12-28-2007, 10:28 PM
  #5  
DTR's Volcano Monitor, Toilet Smuggler, Taser tester, Meteorite enumerator, Quill counter, Match hoarder, Panic Dance Choreographer, Bet losing shrew murderer
 
Bark's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Kenai Alaska
Posts: 965
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
When Im not hauling or towing I never look at the tach. When I am towing, I start down shifting when it starts being a little sluggish and try not to go under 1900. I really need to install an EGT (exhaust gas temperature) guage. Doing an advanced search and typing in "RPM shift EGT" will get you a bunch of good posts. The following are just a few:

https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...=rpm+shift+egt

https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...=rpm+shift+egt

https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...=rpm+shift+egt
Old 12-28-2007, 10:40 PM
  #6  
Registered User
 
Buffalo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Glendale(Phoenix),AZ.
Posts: 337
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
According to Cummins, these third gen. engines were designed to operate most fuel efficiently between 1800 & 1900 rpm's. That is directly from Mr. Dennis Hurst, the top man at the engine plant in Columbus, IN. He told us that at a couple of seminars at May Madness in Parumph, NV.

With my '03 HO, 6-speed, 3.73 rear-end, when towing (7000 lbs.), I usually try to shift at about the 2000 rpm range unless I have to accelerate much faster. Seems to work well for me.

Joe F.(Buffalo)
Old 12-28-2007, 10:45 PM
  #7  
Registered User
Thread Starter
 
javven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Good info, thank you. I was driving in the 1400 to 1700 range shifting. I still do this if I 'arrived' at speed 'topping out' and don't further accellerate. I may have been lugging a bit - hope I didn't hurt the engine but doubt it since I've been completely unloaded.

Besides it's gonna lug some off the line. Every time. You can't go from 800 to 1800 and dump it... well I suppose you can.

I guess I'm doing OK by it. Just paranoid. New truck. New truck payment. Bank says the truck must outlive me.

I really think the issue tonight was I was so friggin tired I didn't give the drivetrain the attention it need.

BTW_ what transmission do I have? I don't even know. Rear axle would help, too.

Here's GM's take on a similar noise:

http://www.duramaxforum.com/forum/ge...ing-noise.html
Old 12-28-2007, 10:50 PM
  #8  
Registered User
 
DiEseLjunKy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Winchester, TN
Posts: 1,118
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
g56 trans, 3:73 rears, 11.5" ring, AAM axles
Old 12-29-2007, 06:13 AM
  #9  
Registered User
 
Jeff in TD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Oregon
Posts: 3,519
Received 16 Likes on 16 Posts
When I got mine, I e-mailed Cummins with a question about proper RPM operating range. I got a pre-canned, but very nice reply which I'll just paste in....

In summary, they do not recommend running the engine with load below 1600 rpm, or up a hill in a gear so high that the rig won't accelerate when floored...

Anyhow, here is what Cummins Powermaster had to say:

In the Dodge application, the rpm of the advertised or maximum rated power of the engine is 2500 rpm (prior to 1996 models), 2600 for 1996 and newer models with 12-valve manual transmission and 2700 rpm for 24-valve. Peak torque is reached at 1600 rpm on all models. The Maximum Full-Load Governed Speed is 2800 rpm for 12 valve and 3200 for the 24-valve. The Maximum No-Load Governed Speed is 2950-to-3300 rpm (3500 for 24-valve).

Therefore, your normal operating range for the engine is between 1600 (peak torque) and rated rpm (2500-to-2700, depending on your model). These engines should not exceed 2800 or 3200 rpm downhill (depending on model year), under load, since that is the governed speed of the engine. At no load (i.e., if you were to push the accelerator to the floor and hold it, sitting still in neutral), the no-load governed rpm is about 10 percent over the full-load governed rpm.

The engine is designed for maximum torque or twisting power at lower RPM (1600 rpm), for hard pulls on long grades. The torque curve of the engine is nearly flat from peak torque (1600 rpm) to rated power (2500-to-2700 rpm), however, torque does drop off slightly near the rated power rpm. Typically, the 'sweet spot' rpm for cruising would be about midway between peak torque and rated engine rpm, however, any rpm between peak torque (1600 rpm) and rated speed is fine and will not harm the engine. Overspeeding above rated speed and lugging the engine under load below peak torque is not recommended.

Also we mention that on downhill operation, the weight of the truck and any load you have on it, or towing, will cause the rpm to exceed governed rpm. Even though the engine is governed while under power, the load can push the engine beyond its rated speed. We would not recommend going too much over the no-load governed rpm or you could cause valve/piston contact, which can cause major engine damage.

Any rpm between peak torque (1600) and full-load governed rpm is acceptable and will not harm the engine. However, if you are concerned about fuel mileage and long engine life, then the lower rpm is recommended. At higher rpm's, the engine uses more fuel and all internal components turn faster and wear out quicker, which will shorten the life of your engine. There is less horsepower and torque at maximum rpm and the only reason to run the engine at maximum rpm would be for higher road speeds.

For the best fuel mileage, Cummins engines should be operated between peak torque and rated speed. Do not lug the engine when running in this RPM range. What is "lugging"? Lugging the engine is when, at cruising speed, the engine is accelerated and it will not increase the vehicle speed. Also, lugging is operating the engine, under full load, below peak torque rpm.

We do not have information about shifting into or out of overdrive in the Dodge application, since Dodge designs and supplies the transmissions for their products.

If your engine is still within the Dodge warranty period or you need information about the Dodge Ram truck, please feel free to use the Dodge dealer locator or contact Dodge: (http://www.4adodge.com/frameset_main.html?dealers/index) on the Dodge website (http://www.4adodge.com/).

We thank you for your interest in Cummins products. Please let us know if you need assistance in locating the nearest Cummins-authorized Dealer or Distributor Service Provider. For assistance in locating a Service Provider, feel free to use Cummins North America Dealer Locator, which can be found on Cummins website:
http://www.cummins.com/service_locator/index.cfm

Please let us know if you have other questions and if away from your computer or have a time-critical request that needs more urgent attention, feel free to call us toll-free (from North America) at 1-800-DIESELS (343-7357). Customers may also call Cummins switchboard 1-812-377-5000 (worldwide toll call) and ask for the "800-DIESELS Call Center" for assistance.

Email direct: powermaster@cummins.com
Old 12-29-2007, 10:41 AM
  #10  
TAS
Registered User
 
TAS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 160
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
During daily driving I shift around 2K.
Old 12-30-2007, 01:27 PM
  #11  
Registered User
Thread Starter
 
javven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
OK - I think my ctd and I understand eachother now.

Can't even feel shifts anymore unless I'm accellerating hard - even then barely noticeable.

No-I'm not watching the tach.

thanks @ responses - I really appreciate them.
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
samiam4
1st Gen. Ram - All Topics
7
12-19-2012 12:08 PM
itr.#1446
3rd Gen High Performance and Accessories (5.9L Only)
5
11-09-2008 09:03 PM
MoparRiggan
3rd Gen High Performance and Accessories (5.9L Only)
29
11-09-2008 12:02 AM
dewclaw
24 Valve Engine and Drivetrain
1
07-17-2006 05:03 AM
CASMOKIN
Competition / Pulls / OffRoad
8
12-30-2005 01:28 PM



Quick Reply: When to Shift and What's that sound?



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:22 AM.