Automakers sue over California emission rules
02:52 PM CST on Tuesday, December 7, 2004


Associated Press



FRESNO, Calif. – Automobile manufacturers on Tuesday sued to block the world's toughest vehicle emissions standards, adopted by California regulators in September to cut greenhouse gases.

The manufacturers argued in their lawsuit that the standards, which could set a precedent for other states, must by law be the responsibility of the federal government.

"Federal law is designed to ensure a consistent fuel economy program across the country," Fred Webber, president and chief executive of the Alliance of Automobile Manufacturers, said in announcing the lawsuit.

The suit had been expected ever since the regulations were adopted.

State air regulators did not immediately respond to telephone messages seeking comment.

The regulations are scheduled to be phased in beginning in 2009. The California Air Resources Board estimates they would cut exhaust emissions in cars and light trucks by 25 percent and in larger trucks and SUVs by 18 percent.

They would require automakers to use better air conditioners, more efficient transmissions and smaller engines. Manufacturers argued the result is a hypothetical vehicle that doesn't exist and can't practically be built.

The alliance and several automobile dealers in California's San Joaquin Valley filed the lawsuit in federal court in Fresno, where previous similar challenges have been filed to the state's clean air efforts, the most stringent in the nation. The arguments in the latest suit are similar to previous challenges.

The suit contends that only the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has the authority to set fuel economy standards.

State regulators sidestepped the issue by regulating carbon dioxide emissions, not fuel economy. But the alliance argues that "carbon dioxide and fuel economy are synonymous," noting the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency uses carbon dioxide emissions to gauge the vehicles' fuel efficiency.

The alliance said complying with the California standards would increase the cost of a new vehicle an average $3,000. It also said the regulations would reduce consumer choices because manufacturers would likely dump vehicles with higher emissions, such as full-size pickups with large engines. Air regulators estimated the cost at about $1,000 per vehicle.

Consumers already can choose from more than 30 vehicles that achieve more than 30 miles per gallon, the alliance noted, but aren't buying them.

The Union of Concerned Scientists in San Francisco released a statement reacting to the lawsuit, saying the manufacturers' trade group is following "its decades-old tradition of sending lawyers, not engineers, to address the auto industry's environmental shortcomings. Sue, not solve, has become standard operating procedure for the industry."

 

Who cares what California mandates?! Manufacture the vehicles to be 49 state legal and let the enviroMENTALists walk or ride a bike.

 

Hey now!!!! were not all dumb asses here. Always wanted to know how much smog one of them cargo ships puts out bringin over the volvos and jap cars they drive.(typical enviro gear here) Unfortunatly I have one of them hypocrite enviros in my family, rant on enviro issues, and own a suv go figure.

 

Exactly,, Im all for clean air to an extent. When useablity becomes an issue ( the smaller engines and loss of full sized trucks) Then its gone too far for the times. Best thing ive read about was this lil device, Cant remeber what they called it. But it went in the exhaust. and reburnt the exhaust, Didnt run it back to the engine. But the proto type had an i wanna say 93 cummins L10 operating and surpasing the 07 emmision standards. That lil thing by itself should bring back the days when power was power. Ill see if i can find an article on the net

 

Yeah, I pity the auto industries at times too, especially considering all the underpowered vehicles on California's roads.

Then again, anybody ever notice that no matter how much the auto companies complain, they always manage to meet emissions standards anyways, and remain plenty profitable while doing it. I'm not Greenpeace, but environmental taxes do need to exist to a degree.

 

If Kali is so concerned about the enviroment why don't they just raise the gas tax to like $5 a gallon?

MikeyB

 

Dont give em any ideas!!! I gotta stay here for a few more years.

 

Our soon to be out of office governor is gonna try **** everyone off one last time before our new elect is in office Gary Locke he wants to adopt c.a.r.b. laws and regulations in our state of WA.

 

"State regulators sidestepped the issue by regulating carbon dioxide emissions, not fuel economy. But the alliance argues that "carbon dioxide and fuel economy are synonymous," noting the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency uses carbon dioxide emissions to gauge the vehicles' fuel efficiency. "

So, the enviros are essentially saying that you aren't allowed to burn as much fuel as you used to? What if I have a big V-8 gasser engine truck that I only drive 3 days a week and my gas consumption equals somebody who drives a little 4 cylinder car 7 days a week? hhhhhhhmmmmmmm...communism???

On the other hand, I don't wanna sound like I'm on the enviro's side but, the great space race was fueled by the Cold War and we got a lot of nice things we use every day from the technology we were "forced" to develop.

 

i left california for a reason. if they want more efficient vehicle let them and their "scientists" develop them. todays vehicles are clean enough, i agree just dont sell em there and when they cry for new vehicles do like the gun laws "sorry you have a california drivers licence, or ca. credit card we cant sell to you". my buddy cant even order boots there cause they have kangaroo leather in them for crying out loud sorry ill stop now

 

If they only regulate Carbon Dioxide emissions, Diesels are trouble free; we generate about a quarter as much as a gasser of the same size.

NOx, SOx and particulates on the other hand...

I love to bring up that fact with all my eco-liberal buddies. Your Diesel's killing the environment! But it's having a less affect on global warming than your POS Hybrid.
I then demand that gasoline engines have their emissions brought to Diesel levels. That gets them talking.

 

Do they have flatulence detectors in L.A. too?

 

They sure do. They're called lawsuits- you can't fart without getting sued out here.

My father builds pollution detectors for I living. I had the truck in the shop the other day, with the doors closed. Big ware-house, fixing the tailgate. We let the thing idle for no longer than a minute, watched the NOx analyzers jump all over the place. Open air has about .1 PPM, after a minute with the Diesel we had it up to 4.0 PPM. A gasser doesn't even make a difference.

But no matter what way you look at it, emissions controls are making the environment a lot cleaner, and we can still cruise along the freeway faster than we'd want to. Air is SO much cleaner today that 30 years ago, and thats no dreaming.

 

Smog laws still suck, but I gotta admit the air is way cleaner in LA than when I moved away 15 years ago.