dieselho

Hey everybody! I'm a newbie here. I know you all are prolly tired of seeing questions about lift pumps (i'm getting tired of reading them myself). Anyhow, I put a new filter in and filled the cannister 3/4 up with fuel, tightened and fired. Ran for about 4 seconds then died. I then cracked the rear banjo and turned key to the on position. I heard nothing, and there was no fuel present at the banjo. I then proceeded to bump the starter thinking that this would help. Still I heard nothing and there was no fuel present at the banjo. I then took the cannister cap off only to find an empty bowl. The whole time I'm thinking (lift pump?) I then filled the cannister back up with fuel and tried again. Still no fire. I then turned the key for prolly 18 seconds, and she fired up. The truck runs fine, has 95,000 miles since i bought it new. My question is, because i cannot hear the pump running while the key is on, is this an indication that the lift pump is bad? I know that a fuel pressure gauge is the answer, and I do intend to get one soon. I'm just wondering if this is an obvious sign that it is bad so i can get it replaced under warranty before i reach 100,000.
I appreciate all the useful info I have gathered from this board. I have learned alot about diesel engines here. I've been a gasser for half my life until i discovered what a real engine is all about. I'll never go back!
Any info appreciated. Thanks.

Borush

Welcome to DTR. You don't say what year your truck is, but the older style l/p's had problems with the electrical plugs. The newer pumps have an updated plug that protects the connection better. You might check to make sure you are getting power to the pump first.


Boyd.

dieselho

Thanks for the advice bigblackdodge. Never heard of O'Reily out here in Utah. Wondering where the best local shop in the salt lake valley might be for one of these? Phox Mulder? Any suggestions?

dieselho

Thanks for the welcoming. Sorry, I'ts a bone stock 01, with an Auto I'll head out to the garage now and check my connectors. Thanks for the info!

phox_mulder

You can make a temporary guage out of some tubing, a shraeder connection (think Air Conditioning pressure tester), and a pressure guage.

I haven't seen him much on here lately, but user Chuck3 has a Briarhopper guage that he let me try out a while back.

Can't remember where he got it.
maybe here. http://www.smokindiesel.com/Dodge/BriarHopper.htm


phox

dieselho

Thanks for the info guy's

J BODY

On the line from the filter housing to the VP44 is a line with a rubber piece connecting it together. You can remove the banjo fitting at the pump and take that end off with the rubber piece mentioned earlier. Attach a line, 3/8 clear vinyl my choice, and run this into a pan. Turn the key on and bump the starter. Lift pump should run for 20 sec. At the end of this cycle I'll pinch the line so that it won't run back or let air in. Bump the starter again only this time into a container with measurements on it. Your lift pump should put out 1.3 liters on a 20 sec run cycle. Anything below fails. This is basically the updated test procedure for testing the volume of the lift pump.

bentwings

I hijacked this text from another forum I deal with. It is from my own post but it was a time saving measure. The smiles did't transfer but that's ok. I'm putting this here mostly for y'alls information on what I found inside my junk LP.
Hot rod electric fuel pumps are exactly the same. Carter, Holly and a few others. There are 3 bolts that hold a cover over the rotor cavity and a 3/8" inlet and outlet opening (metric actually). A banjo type fitting is used in either end to connect the lines. The pump cavity and the motor housing are crimped together so cutting them apart is a big job. No need yet. Anyway upon removing the cover I found a 1/4" ball bearing wedged between the vanes and the wall where the fuel enters the cavity. Not only that, there was hole wallowed out big enough to stick your pinky in. Also there was a screen about like window screen with a matching hole ripped in it. The ball bearing apparently is part of the check valve system from what the local diesel guy said. He had never taken the cover off one and does 10-15 a week!!! for years!! Since I haven't cut the d...m thing apart yet I would guess that there is/was a passage cast into the pump body where ball bearing is dropped into and staked over at the top. This would prevent a leak back situation. Now this is a really hoakey way to do this. Probably ok on a hot rod that doesn't see the vibration of the diesel. But man after making diesels as long as Cummins has and with as many of these they have had problems with I sure would think they would do something better than this. For ex. tap the hole and screw in a plug with a hole in it. You can buy Allen set screws like this cheap. Secondly, surely don't mount this pump on the side of the diesel motor. These things hammer all the time not gently roll like a hot rod motor. I can just see this ball bearing flying around inside the housing. No wonder it wallowed out the wall. This pump should be mounted on the frame in rubber isolators. again cheap like 6 bucks for 3 of them list price. I tried hooking up the pump to the batt charger and it spins like mad it will pump volume but no pressure. Obviously due to the big gash in the vanes from the ball bearing. There were no fine particles anywhere in the pump or the filter so they had to be pretty small...hopefully they passed through my VP without damaging it. LOL
There are at least 2 places that make better lift pumps however both are pretty pricey like 600 bucks. both mount on the frame and come with a complete bolt in kit. Today I just couldn't afford one but next May (1yr warr ends)
I called the Dodge dealer to see if they might help me out on warrentee......was I dreaming or what. So as I was awakening I called Cummins.... right along side the ear. I don't know which one told me to take a flying leap farther.
ps it is not possible for this ball bearing to come from the tank as the fuel passages around the banjo fittings are too small for it to pass through...I checked this. This pump is mfg for Cummins by Carter in the U.S. of A.
pss The dealer wanted $266 for this pump and the diesel shop $185 so there is a bit of mark up here!!!
Well I now have a h....va fish tank pump laying in my shop. I guess it is a live box pump for you fish guys LOL Probably last a life time in a bass boat . I'll probably add it to my small parts washer.

bentwings

AlpineRAM

The LPs can fail in two ways- A: Electrical- Won't turn, either it gets no juice (ECM problem) or won't run with juice (LP dead)
B: Mechanical failure- Most prominent check ball getting hammered through its seat. This is IMHO not caused by the vibrations of the engine, but by the fuel pressure spikes caused by the VP44. I think that the Carter design is crap. I'm using a holley blue pump (actually cheaper than the stock LP over here) with good results- no problems for more than 100 000 kms.
Simple way to test the LP imho is to put a longer hose to the water purge line on the fuel filter and with the engine running open the water drain valve slowly a bit- if fuel gushes into the canister at the end of the line you have positive pressure- if it sucks in air and kills the truck you have a definitely bad LP .

Just my 2c

AlpineRAM

dieselho

Well Guys, I ended up taking my truck to the dealer and recieved my free replacement with no questions asked. Thanks for all the tips.