KustomAutoBody

I have a 99 2500 automatic w/147,000mi. I took a 600 mile trip and as I pulled in the driveway at home my truck died and will not start now it just turns over (very happy it happened when we got back). The lift pump can be heard running under the hood but no fire. I have not had any of the lead up problems that seem to be associated with and injector pump failure(dead peadal loss of power etc). The truck ran great before it quit. I get a 0216 code on the scan tool which I see usually means the pump is bad. Do they ever just quit working like it seems to have done in my case or might there be some other problem? I am no diesel expert for sure so any help would be appreciated.

scottsjeeprolet

Welcome to the DTR!!
Sorry to hear about your dead VP44. RIP.
Some go out slowly and some go like yours did.
Make sure when you replace it you also replace the LP.
Do a search on here and there is lots and lots of reading on them. Might want to upgrade to the HRVP44.

dodgeguy71

Yeah, welcome and stay away from anything called "Dodge dealer" they will tell you that the P0216 means that is has low fuel pressure and sell you an intank conversion. Then when you talk to pump shops and Cummins dealers they'll tell ya your VP44 is done. Go with what Kustom said, VP44 and lift pump. Mine just took a dump this weekend and it has warranty and the dealer is installing the intank conversion and said the injection pump "should" be alright. Not a great boost of confidence with the "should" part.

Sorry for you loss.

J BODY

Wow!!!....and to think I've been misguiding people all these years. Thank you oh knowledgable one!!!

...I guess I'll just be like those smart Cummins shop guys you mentioned and throw a VP at every p0216 I see. Come to think of it that will make me and the shop more money. Thank you Thank you!!

J BODY

P0216 IMHO can be a warning sign, but then again, there a few codes that get stored here and there and really have no bearing on how the truck runs. I'll often see p0216 codes stored, but the customer has no drivability issues. Why fix it if it aint broke? We see quite a few 216's when it gets hot out here. 120+ blazing heat tends to "thin" the fuel some. Years ago tech recommended adding 2 cycle oil to the fuel to aid in maintaining lubricity. Can low fuel psi cause a 216? In my experience, yes. In the scope of things only a small percentage of people keep an eye on their lift pump condition. I've seen many times over the years where trucks come in with lift pumps that are doing nothing and often their will be a 216. Put a new lift pump on it, road test it and see if it pops up. I often find that if I leave the trans in second and drive a ways with the engine rpm above 2500, if a 216 is going to set, that is the best way I've found to replicate it. Give the customer their truck back, tell them what you found, and what it might mean, and turn em loose.

....and another thing. Not sure how the Vato-zone scanners and other places that offer the "free" scan are set up, but the DRB has an ignition counter. This will give you a rough idea how long the code has been in the system. If a guy comes in and there are 255 starts (which is max) I'm not going to be overly concerned with an issue. Now if I clear it and he comes back a few days later and the code has re-occured, then you are leaning toward replacement even if no drivability issues occured. In that scenario, if it's warranty, it gets a pump. If it's cp (cus pay) I'll give them the choice. Most choose to run it as is, and for many, there are no probs for a long time. Been a long day. There are alot of good dealer techs out there and some know where they are.

...And the previous post was in no way derogatory to Cummins dealer techs. The ones I've talked to like what they do....but tend to think the Dodge p/u guys are a bit of a pita. It just looks to me like if Mr Dodgeguy went to a dealer with an old p0216 and they told him he needed a pump he would cry foul and come here to post on how some dimwitted dealer tech tried to sell him a pump. On the flip side he would drive to Cummins, they would see the code, tell he he needs a pump, and he would immediately drop to his knees and bow to their supreme knowledge while they pick over 1K out of his pocket. I'm quite certain there's good and bad on both sides of the fence.

dodgeguy71

I would not bow down to anyone for any supreme knowledge. I am simply stating what I heard from, (A) ASE master/Chrysler Master with around 15 years experience on Dodge, who is also a friend from the college days so I know his word is good and would not lead me astray. He said he would have replaced the VP because if the code set it has already starved the VP enough to cause damage. (B)The Cummins place here in our little town has an excellent reputation and most farm trucks end up there for any service. They are also certified to rebuild the VP and have a bench to test the VP. So I believe they will have a bit more intiment knowledge on the inner workings of the VP44 and what happens when you have low fuel pressure or flow.

I have had this truck for one year. Fuel pressure guage has been on there for about 11 months and this weekends drive, 1200 miles was the first time I ever had this problem. So the "old code" I doubt. I am also a tech/mech. Worked on Cadillacs for the last 4 years and became ASE/GM master myself. The reason I am no longer a tech is because I like getting paid for what I do and the truck my new company gave me to ride around in is a nice perk as well. So I know all about dealers and good techs and bad techs. You also have to consider that dealer techs get paid .3 for diag under warranty and obtaining clock time can be nearly impossible.....I know.

I was not flaming dealer techs, but finding a good one....and hearing what my friend told me made me wonder if I was not just getting the basic fix til I get out of warranty. I have seen this happen at the cadillac dealer and have been apart of such "repairs", not that I wanted to, but that is what I was instructed to do....or pack my things and go home as I have been told. Yes, the P0216 can pop due to low flow/fuel pressure, states in right in the service manual under the code description.

Another thing, I never said dimwitted tech, just talked to the tech and he seemed to know his stuff, one tech to another. I can respect any auto tech. Anybody that can starv for weeks at a time waiting for the business to pick up again so they can make a decent paycheck has my respect.

I guess will find out what happens on my next 1200 mile trip to pick up another truck, plus next weekends festivities at the dyno. And if it holds up for many many miles after I am out of warranty I'll remember the techs name and gladly take it back or recommend him to people, but you have to earn my trust and with so much on this site about the VP44 and so many people talked to about this......he really has to earn it. Or maybe it's just because this is the most I have ever paid for a vehicle and things like that.

Anyhow, good luck with whatever you do Kustom!! Sorry to rant on your thread.

PChouinard

Just because you hear your lp running doesn't mean it's pumping. I would invest in a hand-held guage or crack the banjo on the vp. Bump the starter and see if you get fuel to the banjo. Have you replaced your fuel filter? Do that too.
I have the same code. My truck runs like a striped-a$$ ape. When I talked to the Cummins dealer here in Phoenix on the phone, the man I talked to wanted me to do all possible troubleshooting before he would sell me a pump. I did have to replace my LP, replace my fuel filter canister upperhalf due to a heater leak and change the Vp44 check valve. I'm back to good starts and good running without getting on my knees or having the Cummins guy sell me a pump..

24vCTD

Sorry about my long-winded reply, but...

J BODY,
I'm not trying to sound like I'm against dealer techs here, but when I took my truck in to my Dodge dealer, they made me pay $81.00 for them to take a guess at the cause of my problem being a bad APPS. I asked the tech to leave his DRB hooked up so he could check the APPS voltage from the passenger seat while I took the truck for a drive (so he could watch it while the dead pedal set in), and he refused. I had the P0216 code (which I thought meant failure of the FPCM to communicate with the ECM) and dead pedal, and he almost had me convinced it was the APPS. He wouldn't even acknowledge the inherent problems with the Bosch VP44. Told him I'd come back when I had the extra $470 or so to replace the APPS, BUT...posted my symptoms on this website, and per the recommendations of the majority of those that responded, I (NOT the dealer) replaced my VP44 and installed a FASS system (FASS was more or less an "insurance policy" for the new VP44, as my old lift pump was still OK.) Truck runs better than ever now. Now I know just as well as anybody else that humans do make mistakes, but $81.00 + $470.00 = very expensive guesswork, and I still would have had the VP44 and lift pump left to deal with. So sometimes if you try and work around the problem so the customer doesn't cry foul, it could backfire and look very bad to the customer. Now don't get me wrong; I know where you're coming from as I'm also a dealer tech (HVAC industry) and I hate having to break bad news of costly repairs to my customers. I know what you mean about wanting to keep them from crying foul, but I NEVER say "well, let's try this first..." and then "well, guess we'll have to try this next..." In the customer's eyes, I'd then be considered a "parts changer" like my (former) Dodge "tech" apparently is. In conclusion, I don't think anybody's trying to take a stab at dealer techs in general here (and certainly not you), just sharing their thoughts of why many people are leery of service techs like you and me. Geez, I forgot where I was going with this--guess I mainly just wanted to blow off steam about that guy at my local Dodge dealer...