It doesn't make any difference. All the weight of the trailer comes down to the earth in two basic places (when towing). 1) Through its axles and tires, and 2) through the tow vehicles axle(s) / tires via tongue weight.

It doesn't make any difference of how its spread out. It will still be measurable at the axle(s) / tires.

The only thing that I can think of that is throwing you off is that maybe in the instance or instances that you are remembering, the person who weighed their rig didn't know what they were doing, didn't have access to axle-by-axle scales or something. stezlaki is doing it correctly.

Lastly - This is what I didn't know about Class IV hitches.

"Class IV hitches is very similar to Class III hitches except for the weight ratings. Class IV hitches are weight carrying (WC) and weight distributing (WD) hitches depending on the vehicle and hitch specifications. Not all Class IV hitches are rated to be both. The hitch specifications will alert you to a hitch that is not weight distributing. Class IV hitches used as weight carrying is rated up to 10,000 lbs. gross trailer weight (GTW) with a maximum trailer tongue weight (TW) of 1000 lbs. Hitches that are used for weight distributing are rated up to 14,000 lbs. gross trailer weight (GTW) with a maximum trailer tongue weight (TW) of 1400 lbs. This style of hitch typically uses a 2" square receiver opening. The use of a ball mount and hitch ball of the same rating or higher is required for weight carrying. To use the weight distribution side of the hitch a weight distribution system is required. Class IV hitches attach to the vehicle frame only. Always consult your owner's manual for vehicle rating."

 

It doesn't make any difference of how its spread out. It will still be measurable at the axle(s) / tires

Really? What if the majority of the trailer weight is on it's rear? It's still going to be measured across the axles when only axles arer weighed. So all your getting here without the one tounge weight measurement is a combined weight. You will never know the percentage of how much of the trailer weight is on the tounge without measuring it. Drop by any rv forum and ask the same thing. They will all tell you to weight the tounge. And lets just assume that we think the weight is on the tounge, but when we try to pull it, it sways. Anyone that has pulled any trailer for any kind of time can tell you that sway is induced by not enough tounge weight.

In this situation, you have a sway issue, and you do not know the actual tounge weight. Hmm. And you still can't find the cause of the sway.

Smoking gun maybe? Will an apple fall out of the sky soon?

 

JyRO.

Yes, that's exactally what I AM saying. I questioned my local Dodge dealership about the hitch and it's rating and THEY TOLD ME that the hitch is rated/it's ratings ARE BASED on using a weight distributing system with the standard factory installed hitch. The hitch by itself IS NOT capable of the rating, only by using the WD in conjunction.

After digesting that information the stock hitch was on it's way off my truck, and I went to something different. When I took it off and got a chance to look at the construction, I would have put myself at risk, other vehicles at risk, and my precious cargo at risk EVEN WITH a WD system as I see it. The stock hitch is a piece of junk and we all paid dearly for it. The fellow that does my welding and construction work took a look at it and just laughed. His comments were a little stronger than mine but he pretty much said the same thing. Next time I am at the dealership where I bought my truck I am going to be in their face for a refund on a brand new, never used piece of junk.

CD

 

charlie - I probably don't follow your exact meaning. You're not making it very clear. But I'll give it a try. "What if the majority of the trailer weight is on its rear?" Do you mean a case where there is very little weight on the hitch, and more on the trailer's own axles? If so:

When stezlaki did his measurements he would have found something like the following:

Unloaded
Front = 4540#
Rear = 3260#
Gross truck wt. = 7800#

Loaded
Front = 4540#
Rear = 3460#
Trailer = 7240#
Gross truck/trailer = 15240#

In the above scenario - The tongue weight is 200 lbs. The trailer still weighs 7,440#. The truck still weighs 7,800#. This is (for example) what the CAT scale would have measured axle-by-axle if the weight was more in the rear as per what you said.

If you do the measurement 2 times (once with the truck & no trailer (unloaded) and once the truck with the trailer (loaded)) on an axle-by-axle scale, LIKE STEZLAKI DID, you MOST CERTAINLY WILL know the percentage of the trailer weight that is on the truck. By my example : 2.688% (200# / 7,440#) of the trailer's total weight is being placed on the truck via tongue weight.

In stezlaki's actual measurements : 15.86% of his loaded trailer's weight is being placed on the truck (tongue weight).

"Drop by an RV forum" ... I've been dropping by them for 5 years.

"Anyone that has pulled any trailer for any kind of time..." That's me! I have pulled many a trailer, with many a truck, for way many a mile. I'm not a tower wanna-be.

"Will an apple fall out of the sky soon?" Will a clue fall out of the sky soon?





CD - That quote that I put in my reply (a few replies back) makes it about as clear as mud (to me ). It seems to say that Class IV hitches are good to 14,000# / 1,400# if using W.D. But I guess there is more to it than that. Maybe WD is clarified on our individual hitches. I'll check mine at home when I get a chance. But I was thinking (maybe I was wrong) that our Dodge Class IV hitches were good to go to 10,000# / 1,000# without W.D.

 

Ok so you do not and are not using a weight distribution hitch w/sway control.
You talk as you are not If you say " with the Dodge I'm looking for a place to pull over and buy one!"

#1 trucks change and they are making softer springs for a better ride.
#2 think they say to use WD and Sway for over 500 lbs
#3 new truck is a lot taller and will have more sway then the old one.
You are over the hitch weight with out WD.
Try a good WD hitch and see what that does for you.
Also when you weigh it get a weight of the trailer axles separate so you can see what each axle has on it.
Does you trailer have springs, or torque tube type?
I have steel springs and eq between them but if you raise the toung it will not be a 50/50 split one axle will drop of and toung weight will pick up.
Some trailers you can raise or lower 4-6" and still come close to spliting the weight on each trailer axle and others 2" will load one axle more then the other.
Look at it this way, one trailer I have will go over the curb and not float a tire and the other will lift the two tires not on the curb putting all the weight on the one axle. I see cargo trailers at Lowes ot HD when they go over a speed bump always lifting tires off the ground.
J

 

I will add to this....

I can pull my 11k, 26 foot race car trailer with two different vehicles... my 1994 GMC 2500 and my 2001 CTD ram 2500.
I had pulled that trailer no less than 20,000 miles in all conditions with my GMC, and had no problems, ever. I had experimented with tongue weight to get a nice rear ride height on the GMC, while maintaining a stable ride at speed, and then I made a line in the trailer where to stop the reacecar when I pulled it in. And so life was fine with the rig for 4 years....

Then I got the 01' ram, but nothing in the trailer changed, and the first time I pulled the trailer, I almost totalled the whole deal on the highway. I thought I was going to have a heart attack... I merged onto the highway and was banging gears loving how the cummins was yanking that trailer, but when I hit about 70 MPH, a sway started that continued to amplify, and within 10 seconds I was completely out of control. Nothing short of divine intervention got the rig slowed and stopped without hitting the barrier or going off the road.

I had the hitch ***** at the EXACT same height between the two trucks, and have checked every other thing imaginable, and the bottom line, is that when I tow with the dodge, I MUST move the car 2 feet (yes FEET not inches) further forward in the trailer than when I tow with the GMC to avoid the sway. Moving the car two feet forward in the trailer is a huge amount of additional tongue weight over what works fine with the GMC, and as such makes no sense at all, but nothing else will cure the sway with the dodge. You would think that once you have your trailer set the way you want, it wouldnt matter what you pull it with, but I have learned otherwise.

Kp

 

600 Megawatts - That is extremely insightful information. Seems like you need to get together with stezlaki and trade notes. Wow, it almost seems like stezlaki's problem is just the opposite.

*I* think he has too much tongue weight. When I say too much, I mean too much as per the ratings of his hitch. I am suggesting that he reposition his "stuff" in his trailer to reduce his T.W. to bring him back to a T.W. within his ratings ... and see what happens with his sway.

I could go on about this all day long because I have a 33 foot 5th wheel and a 24 foot enclosed car trailer. When I load a car in my trailer, I purposely pull the car far enough forward that it is about one tire diameter forward of being centered with the trailer's wheel wells. I don't center the car over the axles, I move it forward to put some of the weight on the hitch.

The reason I do this is: My trailer is 4,130 pounds empty. Let's assume it has a 415 pound tongue weight empty. If I hypothetically perfectly center a car over the axles, all of the weight of the car will be carried by the trailer's axles, none would be added to the tongue weight. Let's say its a 3,000 pound car. I would then be towing a 7,130 pound trailer, with only 415 pounds of tounge weight. IMHO, I think that would be too light in the hitch. I want more like 700 to 800 lbs on the hitch. That's why I pull the car about one tire diameter forward. So far, every time I've towed a car, it has towed great.

This makes me wonder: 1) With your GMC was your car more centered, or was it forward or rearward of the trailer's axles? And with your Dodge, I would imagine the car was forward of the trailer axles after everything was said and done, but was it?

It makes me wonder if your GMC didn't like a lot of weight on the hitch and would squat ... and would tow just fine with a very light hitch weight. But your Dodge, you have to have more hitch weight, but not too much (like I think stezlaki has). Curious, curious, curious.

The only time I had a sway issue was when I had a big reel mower that would not fit between the wheel wells. I backed it in as far as I could, but most of the weight was rear of the trailer axles. It would sway if I tried to run much over 65 mph. So, I kept it to 65 mph and had very little sway problem with it. (Sorry for the long reply).

- JyRO