Raspy

wyo,

The reason we get flu shots every year is because the flu is a different strain every year. A different flu.

Are you actually saying it's all just an experiment?

I don't know what part of "that's not true" you mean. Do you mean that people are not really dying of H1N1? Or not from the seasonal flu or it's complications?

Maybe you can cite how many have died from the vaccine. Or just answer the question I asked about the dead ones parents and families regrets about their decision not to immunize.

The arrogance of allowing your contageous children to go to school with mine or for people to go to work sick and infect others because they don't want the government "telling" them they should get a flu shot is just nuts. I have to get my children immunized, if for no other reason, to protect them from this kind of thinking. As Camper mentioned, look at polio and small pox. The flu is just milder, so I guess we can declare our independence, take a shot of Jack, or thumb our nose at a government conspiracy. Right. Maybe, if you and your family avoid the flu, it will be because all of the people you come in contact with did the right thing for themselves, their families and for you, while you got a pass to protect your independence. Somehow, you're exempt.

Oh, by the way, have you ever heard of the 1918 flue pandemic?

6cylinders

I get the flu shot every year and will get both of them this year, one for the regular flu and the swine flu vaccine.
Once a week they stuff all of is into a small sweltering hot room for a 1 hour safety meeting, guys in there hacking and coughing, blowing their nose while some red hat drones on and on. I can almost picture all the germs floating around the room.
We have no "sick days" so guys come to work sick and spread the joy

CamperAndy

How about this as a good reason to get the shots??

76 US children died from swine flu this year so far

chaikwa

No, not at all. Please don't put words in my mouth because my opinion has nothing to do with freedom, government intervention or conspiracies.

I think that's a bit harsh. People with sick children shouldn't be sending their kids to school in the first place, vaccination or not. That's called being responsible, but most people have either forgotten how to do that or were never taught it in the first place. And people that have received the vaccination may not show any signs or symptoms of the virus, but they can still carry it and transfer it to other people.

Yes, I have. And here it is 91 years later and we still have the flu virus. When they make a vaccination to eradicate the flu, like they did with polio and small pox, then I'll be in line to get it.

It isn't even known that this new vaccine to fight the H1N1 virus will be effective. The last time I had a new vaccine was when they came out with the Lyme disease vaccine. They didn't know if that would be effective, nor did they know what, if any, side effects it would bring with it. Well, I assume it did what it was supposed to do, because despite being bitten by ticks of all types, more often than I could keep track of, I never had any symptoms of the disease. Now however, my knee, elbow and wrist joints are continually inflamed, stiff and sore. Ten years after the release of that vaccine they announced it would be removed from the market due to it's contribution to joint degradation. Kind of soured me on 'new' vaccines.

chaikwa.

CamperAndy

A little lite reading from wikipedia, you think they wish they had any vaccines, even experimental ones??


The 1918 flu pandemic (commonly referred to as the Spanish Flu) was an influenza pandemic that spread to nearly every part of the world. It was caused by an unusually virulent and deadly influenza A virus strain of subtype H1N1. Historical and epidemiological data are inadequate to identify the geographic origin of the virus. Most of its victims were healthy young adults, in contrast to most influenza outbreaks which predominantly affect juvenile, elderly, or otherwise weakened patients. The flu pandemic has also been implicated in the sudden outbreak of encephalitis lethargica in the 1920s.

The pandemic lasted from March 1918 to June 1920, spreading even to the Arctic and remote Pacific islands. It is estimated that anywhere from 50 to 100 million people were killed worldwide. An estimated 500 million people, one third of the world's population (approximately 1.6 billion at the time), became infected.[

wyododge

You stated that it is a different flu every year, so what? There has been a different flu every year for millions of years. Human have done quite well up till now. No shots, no drugs. Now I will admit that occasionally an excessively nasty bug come along. But this years version of H1N1 is no where near what the 1918 flu was. It may never be.

Yes I am actually saying that it is an experiment, what else can you call it??? It is a scientific experiment that has data and results. You inject an individual with a serum and there is some sort of probability that they will, or will not, get an infection or have a side effect. That sir is an experiment. What may work for you, may not work for me. The only way to find out is to do an experiment to find out. This is the entire basis of drug and vaccine disbursement. You seem to have some sort of meaningless and angry response to the word experiment. I have no idea why, but you should get that checked out. It is simply a word which describes the way drugs are prescribed every day. Your doctor will give you a dose of a drug and adjust it based upon your bodies reaction to said drug. He is, in fact, experimenting on you, or with you if you prefer. And this is an experiment that I choose not to participate in. Thank you for your offer but I DECLINE.

The part that is not true is in bold in the quote I cited in my post. Just because you get a vaccine and are no longer affected by the virus, does not mean your are not contagious. You can still carry and spread the antibodies with possibly higher efficiency due to your arrogant "I am better that you I can not get infected" attitude. You still carry the antibodies and because you do not recognize this you are in fact MORE dangerous than me who recognizes what is going on.

I don't know how many have died from the vaccine, and quite honestly I do not care. I DON'T WANT IT. I feel very sorry for the parents that have lost loved ones to disease, it is however part of life. Should I feel more sorry for troops that have lost their lives to IED's, or for parents who lost their children to DUI??? No I should not. To loose a child is a horrible, awful thing which I hope I never have to personally deal with.

First of all, Personal attacks and baseless accusations only make you look a fool and don't add to your argument.

I don't allow my children to go to school when they feel sick. But why would I even consider defending myself against such an obvious and unwarranted emotionally based attack. Grow up.

Have I ever heard of the 1918 flu pandemic??? Leave your emotion on the couch. Relax, grab a beer or beverage of your choice and lets have an honest and open debate about two obviously different perspectives on what could turn out to be a very important issue. By the way I think that a large portion of deaths caused by the 1918 virus were due to a lack of understanding of common health practices which are followed today. Unless of course you believe that the medical community has not increased it's awareness and understanding of the human body and disease in nearly a hundred years.

I never expect to avoid the flu, In fact I welcome the opportunity to get the flu as it makes my body and immune system stronger. I do not cower behind the mask of a vaccine to live my life. I know I have been exposed to the flu, I have not come down with it so far. If I do, well guess what, I will get sick, whine and complain for a couple of days, throw up, get a fever and move on. NO BIG DEAL.

By the way sir, we still live in a free country. If you choose to impose your beliefs, and conclusions upon everyone I suggest you run for office in your local community and do so. Otherwise, stay the heck out of my life, keep your nanny state to yourself, impregnate yourself with anything you want, just don't expect me to blindly follow you into a world of oneness because you are scared and have some news story to post about the horrors of government conspiracy freaks like me.

There is no conspiracy as I stated in my previous posts. I simply do not agree with the science of an annual vaccine.

I will do what is best for my family, you do what is best for yours. If they are different approaches neither may be correct, but you have NO RIGHT to impose your 'ideas' on me.

cbrahs

There goes the wikipedia reference again.

NOT ONE UNIVERSITY WILL ALLOW WIKIPEDIA AS A RELIABLE SOURCE FOR ANY WRITING ASSIGNMENTS! FIND ANOTHER SOURCE!

cbrahs

if we get down to apples to apples, each time you go to the doc it is an experiment as they are "practicing medicine" and most of the time guessing until they find something that works (at first anyways until actual CBC tests, biopsy's ect are taken). I was told a few weeks ago when my daughter was sick with flu symptoms that they ARE NOT testing for H1N1 unless you are IN THE HOSPITAL because of costs involved with the test. This thing is so NEW that the vaccine is an experiment to see if it works.

WHO CARES if it killed the virus on a stainless steel table. That table was sterile and in a controlled environment, being in the human body is TOTALLY DIFFERENT! (read the press release first paragraph http://www.rgf.com/press_release_det...m?ArticleID=50 )

Heck with that fact, lysol kills 99.9% of the aids virus, are you going to inject that into your body to kill aids?

6spd05Dually

Amen brother! Thumbs up to that. Lets use some good ole common sense here everyone. Regardless if you take the shot or not, if your a$$ is going too get the flu, it was meant to happen. Majority of the people who have died didn't actually die from the H1N1 virus itself, there was an underlying medical condition involved and this just happened to come along and made it worse.

I heard these tips to help boost the ole immune system. Eat a lot of oranges which most know to do, but there was something you could do to your nose that would help prevent the virus from getting in that way. Anyone know?

Oh yeah, drink something warm to push the virus down in stomach. The virus won't survive in the stomach. I found that interesting. Last, gargle with warm salt walter a couple times a day was the other medical recommendation.

Darrell

CamperAndy

That response is either putting your head in the sand or maybe your fingers in your ears and going LALALALALALALALAL to make it go away. The all caps, bold and underlined was a nice touch.

The issue is a historical event within living memory and is accurate. Is there one part of the information that is verifiable as wrong???

BTW - When do we get our BS degree from DTR, just asking when the standards for accuracy here got to the point we need to use sources that are better then Wikipedia in the eyes of any university.

CamperAndy

Just for CBRAHS for credit towards my DTR BS degree, wouldn't want to use non supported reference for this forum.

Stanford paper

CDC Historical summary of 1918 flu

kthiemann

I used to get the flu shot every year until my body reacted to it in a way that caused a chronic nervous system condition that almost destroyed my peripheral nerves and left me paralyzed from the neck down for several months, now due to both that experience and the meds that I have to take to semi-control the nervous system issues I avoid that stuff like the plague.

chaikwa

Would you feel any better if they were dying of gunshot wounds?

Yes, you are correct. It is pneumonia. And there IS a proven effective vaccine for it. If those few certain people who are standing up on their soapbox would do some research instead of telling us what lousy people we are for not getting a shot, they might actually do themselves some good.

Man! Will you lighten up a bit? I've never seen this side of you before! Take a pill. Or a breath. Or SOMETHING! You keep this up Andy, and you'll be teaching that course, not taking it!

chaikwa.

CamperAndy

Not really and I doubt their parents would either but I am not getting your connection between Flu shot recommendations to help prevent unnecessary death and dieing from guns shots. Maybe I need more coffee to see your angle on this?

chaikwa

My point was, who cares what they're dying from? ONE child death is too much and nothing has been proven that the shot will cure that. Maybe it will, maybe it won't. Seeing as how most of the deaths were from pneumonia, it seems like a gamble either way to me.

chaikwa.