General Diesel Discussion Talk about general diesel engines (theory, etc.) If it's about diesel, and it doesn't fit anywhere else, then put it right in here.
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by: CARiD

Is this the new low sulfur diesel?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old May 14, 2006 | 12:37 AM
  #31  
edwinsmith's Avatar
Registered User
20 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 4,312
Likes: 1,063
From: Commerce, OK
Originally Posted by displacedtexan
I should have been a little clearer... I was posting what I bet they would use as justifiation they would use. Not that I agree with it...
DISCALIMER: I am not a lawyer.

But I do work for a lot of them and I do know the law.

The fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution states:
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
The term probable cause is key. It is more than reasonable suspicion which is required for the cop to stop you in the first place.

If you are stopped, your first question should be "Why did you stop me?" and the cop is required to provide a valid reason to have done so. Driving a non-commercial diesel pickup is NOT a reasonable suspicion that you are doing something illegal. There may be some different law concerning commercial trucks however and if so will someone please enlighten me?

If you were speeding or weaving erratically he would have solid proof of a crime or reasonable suspicion that you were drunk. I know of no way he could get reasonable suspicion that you were running red untaxed diesel, other than he saw you put it in or he had a witness that saw you put it in, since it is exactly the same as taxed diesel except for the dye. It doesn't smell or smoke any differently than taxed diesel.

He can't order you to take a field sobriety test unless he smells alcohol, sees beer bottles in the car or has some other reasonable suspicion to suspect you are drunk. Just because you are driving at 11 pm on Saturday night does not give him reasonable suspicion to even stop you.

If he heard a rumour that you were running untaxed fuel he'd better be able to produce a witness in court who will swear that he saw you put it in your truck. Just because he has an attitude about diesel pickups and stops and dips everyone isn't reasonable suspicion for him to do so. Just because you are a farmer who regularly buys red fuel for your tractor isn't reasonable suspicion for him to stop you.

After you are stopped, you are not required to get out of your vehicle unless you are LEGALLY ordered to do so with PROBABLE CAUSE or for an obvious safety issue. If you were speeding then he already has evidence of that crime and he lacks probable cause to poke around for any other evidence. He may shine a flashlight in your window to see if anything illegal is in PLAIN SIGHT but he may not enter your vehicle without your permission unless he has probable cause. You should stay put and only roll down your window enough to converse or to receive a citation.

If he orders you out of the vehicle, LOCK YOUR DOORS. If he asks why or asks for your keys you should respond with, "I do NOT consent to any searches."

If he says something like "I want to check your tank." or "Do you mind if I check your fuel?" or "search your vehicle?" or "look in your trunk?" it is a tipoff that he DOES NOT HAVE PROBABLE CAUSE. You should respond with, "I do NOT consent to any searches."

Repeat with "I do NOT consent to any searches." everytime he requests to search. If he orders you to hand over the keys or dips your tank anyway you want to be on record as having said, "I do NOT consent to any searches."

DO NOT PHYSICALLY RESIST, OR EVEN TOUCH THE OFFICER. This is called, "Battery on a LEO." and is a felony. Stay calm and do not become verbally abusive or try to lecture the officer on the law. Just continue to say, "I do NOT consent to any searches."

When you get to court, the officer will have to first prove he had reasonable suspicion to stop you, then he will have to prove probable cause to do a search. Otherwise any evidence he found will be thrown out in most cases.

Just because he found red fuel during an ILLEGAL SEARCH does not extend back in time and give him probable cause. Just because you say, "I do NOT consent to any searches." does not give him probable cause to do a search.

Edwin
Reply
Old May 14, 2006 | 08:01 AM
  #32  
displacedtexan's Avatar
Banned
 
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,337
Likes: 0
From: Place with no quail:(
Nice write up Edwin... Great explanation. And great arguement to back up Infidel's suspision that it could be outlawed, with an exemption if they see you fill up with red. I don't run red so I had never really thought about it except the various discussions on here.

And thanks for helping me understand probable cause better. I guess I would fall in the category of people that never really question LEOs. Though maybe we should sometimes.
Reply
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
WIcowgirl
3rd Generation Ram - Non Drivetrain - All Years
18
Jan 5, 2011 12:39 PM
shoe diesel
3rd Gen Engine and Drivetrain -> 2003-2007
36
Jan 14, 2008 09:45 PM
rbrettctd
Fuels / BioDiesel / Diesel Prices
10
Apr 23, 2007 01:23 PM
Joe T
General Diesel Discussion
4
Jan 16, 2007 12:43 PM
pet05
3rd Generation Ram - Non Drivetrain - All Years
14
Oct 16, 2006 08:13 PM




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:06 AM.