The drive home was fun... thin layer of wet snow/ice. Good and slick.
In the parking lot I got to play a little and I'm thinking that my truck has dramatically less braking capability in 4wd than 2wd? Am I imagining this?

If I lock the ABS in 4wd I just skid and skid. Same conditions in 2wd the ABS seem marginal, but better. I tried pumping manually like the pre-ABS days and that was the best stopping I could do. Anyone know what's up?

 

Get on a good completely snow covered road or parking lot and do the same thing
, then post your results. I think you'll be impressed.

 

i think he just did?

britt

 

Whoops, read it wrong.

 

A guess would be that the engine braking is breaking loose all the tires in 4wd in the situation described. The engine braking and pumping the brakes with ABS would help where plowing would help to slow you down, like snow, mud, gravel, etc., but on ice you'll just slide. With the ABS on while you slide on the ice thru the red light the ABS light blinking at you will provide some more entertainment :^)

Just a guess though.

 

All I know, mine can stop on a dime when I slammed them. Found out by a red light runner.

 

Key thing is on ICE it just doesn't matter what you have. If you are in 4X4 then guess what you have a 4X4 s l i d i n g on 4X4 just like 2X4. ABS will only allow you to possible steer in a safer direction as long as remember to put your foot down and keep it down until you hit somthing or stop
As far as the difference when in 4X4 or 2X4 I could not tell any difference when stopping but OH what a feeling when I wanted to go

 

Hi Guys,

Many people have a misconception about ABS. ABS was never designed to allow a vehicle to stop faster. ABS was designed to allow an inexperienced driver the ability to steer away from a hazard. An experienced driver (meaning a good, knowledgable driver) can stop faster and steer better without ABS. This is not my opinion, it has been tested, and is a fact. I'm also from South Dakota originally and spent half my adult life driving on ice & snow.

ABS was designed to make sure the tires do not lock up during hard braking. If the tires lock up, then the vehicle can no longer be steered. ABS was designed to permit the driver to steer during hard braking and avoid collision with a hazard.

If you are not attempting to steer away from a hazard and you are driving on snow or mud or gravel, it is better to lock the brakes (not use ABS) which causes the snow, mud, gravel to build up in front of the tires thus stopping you faster. Of course, you will be stopping straight ahead and you will not be able to turn. ABS will not allow this build up in front of the tires and will instead roll over the snow, gravel, etc. extending your stopping distance, but giving you in return steering control over the vehicle.

On a very icy surface, there is very little friction between the tire and ice. Consequently, in ABS braking, the tires should continue to roll and feel like you are skidding when in actually the tires are probably rolling over the slippery ice. If the tires are not rolling over the ice and are locked, then it is most likely not ABS causing this, but instead the torque of the engine won't let the tires rotate. Consequently, in 2-wheel drive, the front tires will continue to turn giving you steering control, but the rear wheels will probably not rotate due to engine torque causing them to slide. When in 4-wheel drive and taking your foot off the gas peddle quickly (engine deceleration), all four tires will not continue to rotate on the ice due to engine torque thus causing loss of traction and loss of steering control (skidding) of all four tires. This is most likely why you feel you have less skidding in 2-wheel drive, than when in 4-wheel drive. It's because under hard engine deceleration (not braking, but hard engine deceleration) in 2-wheel drive the front tires continue to rotate and have better traction, but the rear tires don't rotate causing you to skid; hard engine deceleration in 4-wheel drive all four tires won't have traction thus all 4 tires skid. Try taking it out of gear the next time you do your ice experiment and you'll see your tires won't lock up and you won't skid as much as in 4-wheel drive under hard engine deceleration.

You also need to remember this principle when you're on the highway and going around a curve. Tires (hard tires, soft slick tires, snow tires, etc.) each have their own finite amount of friction available, lets say 4000 lbs of friction just to pick a number. When you either accelerate or decelerate, you are trading the friction forces of traction for the friction forces required to accelerate or decelerate. So, if you decelerate abruptly on a slippery curve it may take 2000 lbs of friction to slow the tire, you will loose this amount in traction so now you only have 2000 lbs of friction left for traction and most likely will cause your truck to skid. Be very careful how you apply or remove your foot from the gas peddle when driving on ice or very fast because you could find yourself in the ditch if you don't do it smoothly. I also road race cars and use this traction/friction principle everytime I'm on the track.

 

ABS dont work when all four tires slide... found that out just before I tested the off road capabilities of a 97 Cavalier.

 

I always tell southerners that getting their first SUV/4x4 that while they can go lots better than regular cars, they have the exact same braking ability. Less, actually, because of the momentum/weight of the bigger truck. After they think about it for a while, you see the glimmers of understanding slowly light their eyes.

4WD means you go better but does nothing for stopping better!

 

I agree on this as far as stopping fast. 4WD is very good to have, though, when manuevering and slowing down in slippery conditions.

 

I'm still not sure I understand the reason behinc this...

I didn't think 4wd would stop me better, I just didn't expect it to be worse.

 

ABS is dumb mkay, what ever happened to the good old sreaming tires sound letting the person that pulled out in front of you know they are about to be torpedo'd

 

Put it in Nuetral to avoid the engine pulling against the brakes and it'll stop alot better on ice. I know that it isn't possible in emergency situations, but it works if you have time to do it. Manuals come it handy on ice. Mine won't hardly slide at all. Could be the Nitto's though, excellent winter tires!

 

Joel, Thanks for educating us dumb Southeners. Glad to see you are happy up there in RI and not in Texas anymore.