Few Rebuild Questions...hop on in
My 03 with 225,000 miles has been broken for almost 2 years now after a spun bearing and then found 3 cracks in the crank.
Well I am about to start putting it back together and am so happy for it. I used to get "upset" whenever I would see a diesel dually drive by.
I would like some input and opinions here as I would rather have too many ideas than not enough when I am spending the time and money on something.
The truck is basically stock except for the 05 turbo, 4" elbow into 5" stacks, 100 hp quadzilla box, and open air filter.
As of right now I am getting the rotating assembly balanced, installing all new bearings, gaskets, and seals, new rings, new head bolts, DDP50hp tips and probably a Hamilton 181/210 cam.
Now the questions:
Why dont I ever here guys changing their oil pumps? Is it okay to spec it for clearance and run it? I ask because I am running out of money and if I don't NEED to spend the extra $$ I won't. (unless someone here has a lower mileage one to sell cheap) :-)
On a basically stock engine, if the DDP50's usually add a lil smoke, and the Hamilton 181/210 gets rid of some, will that mean it will equal out and the amount of smoke will be about the same it was before the rebuild?
Also, with a cam that "gets rid of smoke" , can I make it smoke "when I want it to"? If I ever Need to? lol
What would be the next step up in turbos? Not spending the $$ now, but would like to keep my eyes out for deals in the future. I just don't know what ones to watch for. Just looking for a healthy 550 or so hp.
Thanks guys, and I look forward to some input.
Well I am about to start putting it back together and am so happy for it. I used to get "upset" whenever I would see a diesel dually drive by.
I would like some input and opinions here as I would rather have too many ideas than not enough when I am spending the time and money on something.
The truck is basically stock except for the 05 turbo, 4" elbow into 5" stacks, 100 hp quadzilla box, and open air filter.
As of right now I am getting the rotating assembly balanced, installing all new bearings, gaskets, and seals, new rings, new head bolts, DDP50hp tips and probably a Hamilton 181/210 cam.
Now the questions:
Why dont I ever here guys changing their oil pumps? Is it okay to spec it for clearance and run it? I ask because I am running out of money and if I don't NEED to spend the extra $$ I won't. (unless someone here has a lower mileage one to sell cheap) :-)
On a basically stock engine, if the DDP50's usually add a lil smoke, and the Hamilton 181/210 gets rid of some, will that mean it will equal out and the amount of smoke will be about the same it was before the rebuild?
Also, with a cam that "gets rid of smoke" , can I make it smoke "when I want it to"? If I ever Need to? lol
What would be the next step up in turbos? Not spending the $$ now, but would like to keep my eyes out for deals in the future. I just don't know what ones to watch for. Just looking for a healthy 550 or so hp.
Thanks guys, and I look forward to some input.
Chapter President
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 9,375
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From: misplaced Idahoan stuck in Albuquerque, Roughneckin on RIG 270
are you doing studs or OEM bolts? if you have it torn down now and looking to do turbo later when $$ comes back around, you might want to do the studs now and save time?
I know you are trying to save some $$$. But if this is a long term deal for you some of the best money spent is on coating. Ceramic coat the piston crowns, moly coated skirts and even better is the coated rod/main bearings (guards against oil starvation and provides anti-friction benefits) I like swain personally for this stuff.
I did change my oil pump and even the pick up tube. Peace of mind more than anything.
Now is a good time to gasket match your exhaust manifold if you have that capability.
There is an awful lot you can do, it only costs money... But if you are keeping at lower power levels then mostly stock is fine. If you are looking at 550, you are borderline for studs instead of bolts dependent on various conditions. The next turbo step up would be a 62mm turbo. A really good compromise turbo right now is the Engineered Diesel 63/68... but not likely you will find one used for "a good deal".
If you are looking at the Hamilton 181/210 cam, may I suggest you check out Peak Performance's version of that. (Colt cams in Canada was grinding for both Hamilton and Peak) Peak's version runs on a 105.5 LSA and Hamilton's is on a 107LSA. The only difference is spool up. The narrower (105.5) helps spool just a tad sooner and the wider helps on the top end... Where you are at power level wise, I'd opine that the narrower LSA could suit you better. Now to be sure, the differences anyone would see between the two is slight if at all. The claim about "gets rid of smoke" is horsefeathers. The truth is some cams profiles will lend themselves to helping to lessen smoke over some of the others, that is true. But trust me that you'll be able to smoke if you wanted to. Not that anyone wants you to in todays times, mind you. A good tow cam profile would provide more smoke control than the 181/210 IMO if that is what you want.
I did change my oil pump and even the pick up tube. Peace of mind more than anything.
Now is a good time to gasket match your exhaust manifold if you have that capability.
There is an awful lot you can do, it only costs money... But if you are keeping at lower power levels then mostly stock is fine. If you are looking at 550, you are borderline for studs instead of bolts dependent on various conditions. The next turbo step up would be a 62mm turbo. A really good compromise turbo right now is the Engineered Diesel 63/68... but not likely you will find one used for "a good deal".
If you are looking at the Hamilton 181/210 cam, may I suggest you check out Peak Performance's version of that. (Colt cams in Canada was grinding for both Hamilton and Peak) Peak's version runs on a 105.5 LSA and Hamilton's is on a 107LSA. The only difference is spool up. The narrower (105.5) helps spool just a tad sooner and the wider helps on the top end... Where you are at power level wise, I'd opine that the narrower LSA could suit you better. Now to be sure, the differences anyone would see between the two is slight if at all. The claim about "gets rid of smoke" is horsefeathers. The truth is some cams profiles will lend themselves to helping to lessen smoke over some of the others, that is true. But trust me that you'll be able to smoke if you wanted to. Not that anyone wants you to in todays times, mind you. A good tow cam profile would provide more smoke control than the 181/210 IMO if that is what you want.
During a rebuild, there's a lot of things you can do to make the engine run better and last longer. But, you also have to balance that with the cost. If you can buy an upgraded part for an extra $300, but i doesn't add any measurable power or durability, is it worth it?
As you buy parts, it's important that they all match. Do you really need triple valve springs with 500 pounds of seat pressure? Sure, it's an "upgrade", and probably a higher quality part than the stock replacement. But that doesn't mean it's better. Especially if it has a "Racing" stickier on it.
Balancing the rotating and reciprocating assemblies is valuable for engines that consistantly run >5,000 rpm's or so. If you're not going to be pushing those kinds of rpm's, you're wasting your money. If you can do it yourself, it's pretty cheap, and probably worth doing. But it's tedious and time consuming, and not worth paying some one else to do it.
Thermal coatings on the piston crown are a good idea for any forced induction engine. It's not that expensive, and well worth the money to keep all that heat where it belongs.
Similar coatings can be put on the chamber and the valves. But I'v not seen enough data that says it's worth the money unless you're racing for dollars.
Friction coatings on the skirt could go either way. Lots of people swear by them. But I'v not seen any hard data that says it's worth it. The stock pistons and cylinders last 200K miles+ without the coatings. How much longer do you want?
I have not seen or heard from anyone that recommends additional coatings on bearing surfaces. Some race engine builders specifically say do not coat the bearings, because it shortens their life (Keith Craft, Smeding, Laniers). And, it add thickness to the bearing that's not needed, it's an uneven layer, and tends to come off in flakes, which can be very damaging to the rest of the engine.
The place that really pays money is meticulous assembly procedures. This is what makes the differance beyween a race winner and a DNF; or between a 250K mile engine and a 100K mile engine. Use a spring micrometer on every valve and seat. Make sure every spring installed height is exactly right. Set the valve train geometry exactly right on every valve. plastigauge every possible bearing surface. Hand gap every ring. etc, etc, etc.
Take your time. Do it right the first time. Make sure you understand each and every assembly step, and that it's exactly right, before moving on to the next step. Spend the money on the right tools; they pay for themselves in the long run.
Close enough, isn't.
I really enjoy the engine assembly on my street/track car. It's time consuming, tedious, and requires concentration and a very carefull attention to detail. It's also relaxing, calming, very satisfying.
As you buy parts, it's important that they all match. Do you really need triple valve springs with 500 pounds of seat pressure? Sure, it's an "upgrade", and probably a higher quality part than the stock replacement. But that doesn't mean it's better. Especially if it has a "Racing" stickier on it.
Balancing the rotating and reciprocating assemblies is valuable for engines that consistantly run >5,000 rpm's or so. If you're not going to be pushing those kinds of rpm's, you're wasting your money. If you can do it yourself, it's pretty cheap, and probably worth doing. But it's tedious and time consuming, and not worth paying some one else to do it.
Thermal coatings on the piston crown are a good idea for any forced induction engine. It's not that expensive, and well worth the money to keep all that heat where it belongs.
Similar coatings can be put on the chamber and the valves. But I'v not seen enough data that says it's worth the money unless you're racing for dollars.
Friction coatings on the skirt could go either way. Lots of people swear by them. But I'v not seen any hard data that says it's worth it. The stock pistons and cylinders last 200K miles+ without the coatings. How much longer do you want?
I have not seen or heard from anyone that recommends additional coatings on bearing surfaces. Some race engine builders specifically say do not coat the bearings, because it shortens their life (Keith Craft, Smeding, Laniers). And, it add thickness to the bearing that's not needed, it's an uneven layer, and tends to come off in flakes, which can be very damaging to the rest of the engine.
The place that really pays money is meticulous assembly procedures. This is what makes the differance beyween a race winner and a DNF; or between a 250K mile engine and a 100K mile engine. Use a spring micrometer on every valve and seat. Make sure every spring installed height is exactly right. Set the valve train geometry exactly right on every valve. plastigauge every possible bearing surface. Hand gap every ring. etc, etc, etc.
Take your time. Do it right the first time. Make sure you understand each and every assembly step, and that it's exactly right, before moving on to the next step. Spend the money on the right tools; they pay for themselves in the long run.
Close enough, isn't.
I really enjoy the engine assembly on my street/track car. It's time consuming, tedious, and requires concentration and a very carefull attention to detail. It's also relaxing, calming, very satisfying.
Thanks guys, I appreciate the feedback. Does anyone know about how much swain charges to do the pistons? I would need to act quick if I decide to do that since I just dropped the stuff off the other day to get balanced. I did tell him to put my stuff at the bottom of his to do list though. He's only charging me 165 to balance everything.
Figure I can swap these out later if I desire.
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Thanks guys, I appreciate the feedback. Does anyone know about how much swain charges to do the pistons? I would need to act quick if I decide to do that since I just dropped the stuff off the other day to get balanced. I did tell him to put my stuff at the bottom of his to do list though. He's only charging me 165 to balance everything.
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