Mick-e

I couldn't start my truck this morning.
The starter in it is only a couple of months old.
I'm using this one

http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/de...1920&ppt=C0330

So the question is: Is my truck doing something to kill the starters or am I just getting crap starters.

The back story is a couple of years ago my starter went out. At that time I thought it was the battery so I bought a new battery.
Dumb. When the new battery didn't fix the problem I replaced the starter.
2 months ago I was having a hard starting issue.
The truck would take a couple of revolutions to start, and we all know it should fire right away. It had the sound of a dying battery. To add fuel to the fire if I jump started the truck it would fire OK.
So I took the batteries (I have a spare that didn't behave any differently) into the O'reillys and the batteries test good.
Lucky for me they had my info on file and they warrantied the old starter, and I got a new one.
So today I turn the key and I get that slow turn over, and then nothing.
I now know not to leave the key engaged as that will weld the brushes in place.
Here I am again in need of swapping starters.

Is my truck doing something that is killing these starters or are they just cheap starters, and I should look into going a different direction?

simplysmn

I want to say Cheap starter the contact's are thin and everything else is just cheaply made .

j_martin

Battery sufficient? Not only size, but oomph. Should be at least 1100 CCA

Connections tight? Don't forget the other end, as in block connection.

Wires been replaced? Originals are quite heavy. 4 or 6 gauge replacements won't be adequate.

If the voltage applied to a new starter is a little low, it'll spin OK, but draw excessive current. That, of course, accelerates brush wear and erosion of solenoid contacts. If the starts are slow, it causes overheating. Sounds like that's what's happening.

Mick-e

Battery is good. Had it tested and I think it was over 1200cca.
My negative on the battery is tight, but it's all chewed up.
I've ordered a replacement off of ebay.
It's just an OEM replacement.
Long term I'd like to replace both cables. Maybe from this guy.
http://custombatterycables.com/appli..._2500_5p9L.htm
I think I'll take my used cable, and make a starter to chassis ground from it.

What does it tell me that a jump start will help get it started. Does that mean I'm not getting good voltage to the starter? (hence a low voltage high amperage condition that has killed this starter)
How can I test that? Put a volt meter on the starter side of the cables, and have someone turn it over?

gyman98

Hook your battery tester right to the starter and see if you still get your 1200cca. I would lean towards cheap starters, there are heavy duty contacts made by Larry B. that are much beefier

j_martin

High current draw by the starter. Basically, jumping it with another good battery and heavy cables would cut the battery voltage drop in half. I got fooled into junking a perfectly good marine battery and buying a lesser one at top dollar at a lakside marina by that same thing. Turned out to be the starter.



That, and getting a rough estimate of starter draw by holding an inexpensive magnetic meter against the starter cable.

Another one I've noticed over the years is that even nominally hard to start engines will go through starters at an alarming rate. A starter motor will run maybe 10 hours, a few seconds at a time. Most of us just bump the key for a fraction of a second to start our engine. If you take 3 seconds, you're wearing out your starter 6 times as fast.

Mick-e

that makes sense.

I will replace the starter, and look into replacing battery cables, and cleaning grounds etc...

Jim Lane

OEM cables should be 3/0 and nothing you can buy at the local auto parts comes close.
I made my own using welding cable.

I just replaced a corroded end on my aux battery.

You could crimp on a copper lug and use a military battery terminal.

Usually cheap rebuilds only replace brushes, contacts and a paint job.

I take mine to a truck electric shop where it is completely gone through, armature checked on a growler and all windings tested with a megger.

Most people including the auto parts does not realize the 5.9 6bt Cummins is an industrial / agricultural engine built for the real world where everything was designed heavy and overkill, they are only thinking light duty gas applications as well as the aftermarket industry's cheap replacement junk.

I have worked on diesels with 80+ pound starter motors and 4/0 battery cables for years.

Jim

Mick-e

I'm going to buy a cheap negative replacement just because I have a worn negative terminal to get try and minimize the damage.

I will take some measurements tonight and create a little drawing that I can send to the guy in my previous post and have him make me some 3/0 cables.
Then those would be available to anyone.

j_martin

Even the clamp on repair ends come in different cable sizes. Ask for the bigger ones.

Mick-e

FAAACCKK!!

I get a new starter from Oreilly's on warrany, and slap the bad boy in. (I'm getting good at changing starters) and give the key a turn expecting it to fire up just like last time I changed starter. click. Nothing
???
I grab my voltage tester and give it a quick test.
5.6v :eek
I get out my old spare battery (the one I swapped out 5 years ago when I thought I had a bad battery) clipped it on, and still no start.
OK I grabbed the girlfriends car hook it up, and still no start.
Out with the current battery in with the old battery, hooked up to the car and it starts.
My assumption is the battery was drained so low it wasn't passing current.
But why? It didn't make any sense. I drove the truck on Saturday. Then on Monday no go.

This morning at 5am I got up to visit the restroom, and wandered by my front window to watch the fog blow past the street lights, and when I looked down I could see my cargo light on in the back of the truck. (I have a shell)

The switch on the light broke a couple of weeks ago, but my driving on Saturday must have jostled it into place, and it was in the on position so it turned on.
I tried starting the truck this morning, but of course it didn't start because the f-ing light was on all night.
AAGGGHHHH

So I'm ordering a new Napa big boy battery. It's in stock and I can get it today.
http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/Ca...235_0399064922

I feel I have to pay this as a penance for being stupid and not testing the battery first thing.
5 years ago I bought a new battery because the starter was bad. This time I bought a new starter (traded really) because the battery was bad. Maybe eventually I'll get it right.

j_martin

The fastest and least expensive path to a repair is proper diagnostics.

Napa et al loves everybody that doesn't believe that.