The jeep Ujoint consists of forged yokes and a relatively large Ujoint. (Larger than the Borgenson) One NOTABLE thing to recognize is that Borgenson does NOT offer U joint / shaft "upgrades" nor replacements for the Jeep XJ/ZJ/WJ/TJ/JK platforms. It is because these vehicles already come with a high quality OEM piece. (and probably much more expensive and fail tested than any borgeson unit) The borgeson ujoint is billet from mild steel. (or stainless) Billet machinings are generally inferior to forgings as is common metallurgical knowledge.

Furthermore and based on capitalistic priniciples Borgeson does not offer a solution for the jeep platforms named above because there seems to be no demand for these units that come with the ujoint from the factory. I have pulled 5+ different joints from jeeps with 150 - 350K+ miles. There was slight radial play in the ujoint that was pulled out of hte jeep with 350K+ but still definitely serviceable and safe.

I'd run the Jeep and not worry about it. Also - since you are going to a higher geared box - the feedback force from the box to the shaft/steering wheel is effectively decreased by mechanical de-leveraging from stock.

 

T

Just order a redhead gear box. shipped today

This chip clown has thrown more red flags out there for me to make like Pink Floyd and RUN LIKE HELL.

First off 8 weeks to rebuild === 1 week ship 8 weeks sitting 1 week ship === 10 weeks. Talking on the phone & sending Emails is not Bench time.

warranty life time??????????????? what good is that?????

When it takes 10 weeks to build it and he gets paid. Warranty work he does not get paid.

Run Run Run

 

Thansks for the help guys. Will be doing some "field testing" on one of the 3 jeep shafts I have in my shop. Will let you know how it turns out




EDIT:



Did I say field testing.... sorry, I meant torture testing...

 

PapeCat

How about a pic of that courier you just dont see them any more.

 

I actually have two couriers.

Stock Courier:

IMG00238-20120117-1204.jpg?t=1326830956

IMG00239-20120117-1204.jpg?t=1326830956

Modified Courier:

IMG00235-20120116-1516.jpg?t=1326830308

IMG00236-20120116-1517.jpg?t=1326830309

 

I dont know which one I like better. The modified is sharp. But that stocker is sweet.

 

Yeah I bought that stock courier with a blown motor but it has around 50K original miles. It is going to be my parts pig if I need sheetmetal basically. I already robbed the doors actually. but there is a sweet fresh kill white 73/74 first gen courier in teh JY right now I'm going to rob some parts whenever I get a chance to get back there. It would be nice to eventually get both up and running. The stocker would be a great parts chaser and tool around rig.

 

Nice Rig. I've never seen one o those trucks before you posted pix of it. Didn't even know they existed..


Nice off roader....

 

Since I try not to make decisions based upon opinion of others, without some evidence presented, I decided to take matters into my own hands, and prove to myself whether or not that the jeep joint / shaft is safe.Today, I took one of the jeep shafts and tested it for strength of the joint.

I took the spline end of the steering gear that I had lying around, and installed it into an impact socket by grinding the base to fit the hex. After doing so, I put the 1/2 shaft from the jeep into my workbench in my shop. I set my torque wrench to the maximum it would produce which is 160 FT LBS of torque. I proceeded to then put all of my 235lb body weight downwards on the torque wrench to attempt to twist the shaft till torque registered in the wrench.

Results ?


The torque wrench didn't make it to the 160 ft lbs.

Upon testing, the 1/2" double "D" shaft, that's welded to the top of the joint which heads upwards towards the steering column, twisted upon itself and prevented the torque wrench from registering it's setting of torque. I nearly killed myself, because my workbench, which weighs upwards of 300 lbs (due to all the machinery on it) lifted up @ the rear of the bench, and was going to topple over on me, if I kept wrenching down on the torque wrench.

So, let's review

• 235 lb guy using a torque wrench set to 160 FT LBS
• Twisted upper shaft (like a torsion bar on a chrysler front end)
• lifted a 300 lb bench while attempting to reach the 160 ft lbs setting on the wrench
• No effect on the joint.

You guys decide whether or not it's safe....

BTW...

Borgeson doesn't use any "bolt or roll pin" to attach itself to the steering gear, as it uses a "set screw" pressured up against the flat spot of the gear input shaft. When I asked them about this, they said "it was perfectly safe, and after decades of using this system, they don't see any issue with it at all " I'm sure this may be true, but the simple fact that Chrysler engineers use a 5/16" Equivalent bolt to "lock" the joint to the input shaft, I feel more confident that it's a better setup that a simple set screw pressured up against the flat spot of the input shaft.


I like to make my decisions based upon real world testing, and reviewing best options at the time, whenever possible.

 

Well thank you Adam Savage I'll be waiting for this episode on mythbusters.

Ok Adam you proved the Jeep Joint can handle a torque load with pressure applied slowly.
Although Im 6'2 @ 295ish lbs and can stand on a beer can without crushing it. Pressure applied slow and careful.

I think what we need is sudden impact action.

Since the use of C4 should not be used in your shop. We should resort to the simple tool of a 10lb sledgehammer.
Allways wear your safety goggles & hearing protection when performing these tests.

 

My first thought, it requires very sophisticated machinery to load test stuff. Then again, I think that very many things are over engineered. I believe in using up that automatic 50% tolerance that is engineered into stuff, that's what it's for, isn't it?...Mark

 

One of my girl friends had a courier, IIRC, it had a mtsubishi engine, or other Japanese engine. Am I right or is my memory garbled on this?...Mark

 

Hi Mark

You are correct the courier is made by toyo kogyo aka Mazda. With the Mazda 1.8 liter ??

 

Well, Daisy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63h_v6uf0Ao&feature=fvst

After doing my test, I think I'm ok with the "strength" of the joint, which to me was what was the only thing in question.

The Impact that was the advised "concern" previously, doesn't really mean anything to me now (after my test of strength) , as it would require a "perfect storm" scenario where the steering wheel was locked while driving. As far as I can remember, I can't hold a steering wheel locked in place, as I'd have to move the key back to lock the column, ..... which would make it difficult to drive..


If it didn't break with a 3' long steel bar bearing down on it, it's not going to break during an impact with an immovable object, such as a curb. The tire would deflect, and I'd lose one of my mudders first.

 

Have finally assembled all the components necessary to do this modification and am now concerned about the Kelderman airbag. Will installing the reverse rotation box change the angle of the steering shaft enough to interfere with the airbag? There is currently about 1.875" of clearance between the shaft and the steel airbag mount.



TIA.