94ram

when i bought my truck, the owner before had an exhaust brake on it but removed it prior to the sale. i didnt think about asking him at the time, but do you guys thinks that it might still have the upgraded exhaust springs on it?

if so, how can i check if they are in there or not? thanks

Ronco95

I am not sure. But I think the factory intake and exhaust springs were probably identical. With that in mind, you can try compressing and intake spring in place and compare it with an exhaust spring in place.

Aren't the heavier springs rated at like 60#?

Ronnie

GAmes

I can't imagine taking the springs out, they don't cost that much and reusing them makes no sense. What brand of EB did he have? My Jacobs brake came with 60 lb springs, but as far as I know, the other brands did not. Cummins (who own Jacobs) recommended no EB on trucks with autos and did not sell a kit for them. A freind of mine has an EB and has not changed the springs. The stockers are 40 lb so I would guess you could remove a couple and check their tension.

94ram

i think he had a pacbrake on it. he took the brake itself out only.

all the wiring and hoses are still hooked up, so i was thinking about getting a used EB but ive read it that the exhaust springs should be replaced with 60 lbs springs

GAmes

That is true, but not an absolute. As stated, a friend of mine has an EB with the stock springs (5-speed) and he is satisfied with it. Do you have a means to keep the TQ converter locked up when decelerating? If not, the EB is about worthless. The D/A combo in GM pickups claim to fame is it's lock up TQ converter. It would be great if they had EBs to actually use the engine for braking, instead they only have engine friction and wrongly proclaim how great their engine braking is.

I digress. You need to look into why the EB is not recommended for the early auto trans.

94ram

wouldnt downshifting cause the TQ converter to lock up?

or how would i be able to manually lock it up?

ill look into why EB might not work on early trannies,
thanks

GAmes

I don't know, about downshifting. I have heard on another forum about a "mystery switch" used to increase line pressure for lock-up, but I can't tell you how that works either.

MikeR

Sorry, that is false information being given out. You could probably get away with stock springs using a Jacobs brake, because Jacobs develops the lowest back pressure of all the available brakes on the market. However A properly set BD or Pacbrake will create more back pressure (better braking power) than the 40 lb springs can take.
Your friend is simply considered a luck guy here that he hasn't damaged anything, and no way would I go around telling folks it's okay.

94ram,
The only way to tell what springs you have is remove a couple of valve covers. The 40 lb springs are consistantly the same diameter as the top spring retainer caps, the 60 lb springs are fatter and bulge out in middle like barrells, so the diameter is going to be bigger than the spring retaining caps.

The brakes on auto's weren't recommended by Cummins, simply because Cummins had no idea how to force lock up in the converter. Get a BD Autolock or Torqloc kit...they will keep your converter working properly with the brake, and are set to kick-out when you slow to a desired mph.
You cannot down shift to force lockup, anytime you take your foot off the throttle the TPS tells the computer to unlock, simple as that.

94ram

thanks MikeR, thats some good info to know.

ill check them out this weekend

GAmes

Let's see. A. It is not false information. He has an EB (either a pac or BD, not a Jacobs for sure), has not installed 60 lb springs and he is satisfied. That was a true statement. FWIW he tows a very heavy Montana 5er (full time RVer), mostly in the western states.

B. I find it ironic that you consider it OK to use a Jacobs without HD spings and they are the only ones who include the springs in the EB kit. I asked my friend about that and he told me that according to his installation instructions the 60 pound springs were not required.

C. Based on my friend's truck and what he told me I stated to the OP that what he heard was true (according to what I know about mine) but not absolute (based on my friend's info).

D.In summary, there is no guarantee that there are 60 lb springs in the OP's engine. I didn't say it was OK, I just stated the obvious.............which you missed.

GAmes

That's funny, since every automatic transmission shop in the country had at least one tech who knew how to get the TC to lockup. I believe it was for the same reason that the early 3rd gens did not have approval for an EB. Dodge knew there was an internal weakness somewhere and did not have an EB option. I don't know what that weakness is, and it is pretty obvious you do not either.

Not a good copy, but here is a link with diagram and other info for a mystery switch.
http://www.turbodieselregister.com/f...ire-where.html

dodgeman01

my 96 auto has pac brake and I ran a tc lock up swith for a long time. it worked ok. I made it into a 5spd last year and love it now. I talked to dave gorend about it when the tranny went out and he said that inorder to run a EB on a auto you have to have a custom valve body built for the tranny. someting about one of the rods in the VB would get bent over time if not upgraded. maybe give him a call and ask him what he thinks.
DM01

Harold-Pacbrake

An orginal fixed orfice brake without the heavy valve springs was ok to use, however the braking was so/so and in an automatic it was a little worse then so/so (depending on how heavy you towed) we did reconmend heavy springs and locking up the TC for the best braking effect. Not everyone chose to have the springs install or use a mystery switch. As for our PRXB you have to have the heavy spring in the engine and the TC locked up.

MikeR

You sure took my post out of text, I don't think you read it all the way....
I never said it was okay to run a Jacobs or any brake with stock springs, you were the one who said it was okay because your 'buddy' had no problem with his. You said and I quote "but not an absolute" in OP's question to spring swap.
I've installed countless exhaust brakes over the last nine years...always always always use 60 lb springs! I know Jacobs includes them, but in every BD instruction manual I've seen since 1999, they say 60 lb springs are required, not optional.

I know you based your answer on your buddy's truck...one truck, but no way would I gamble with the 30-40 folks I helped out.

See here again you didn't read my post correctly. I said Cummins is the ones who didn't know how to force lockup. I know that transmission shops know how, but I wasn't talking about tranny shops, I was talking about Cummins.

Gee thanks. I've only been good friends of the Kondolays for the last nine years.
I'm not allowed to say where I work (forum rules), but I can say that I do this everyday.

94ram

whoa there fellas

no need for anyone to get mad at anyone else. we are here to help each other out right?

its all good we put up good info but theres no need to argue