PaulDaisy

Ok, I have another piece of information on high elevation towing setup. The difference is, it is 50* outside and I have all gauges.
This trip was with the same load - 10k lbs trailer and about 700 lbs in the bed, total weight about 18,000 lbs. The weather was nice, started out at near 70* and saw everything down to 45* along the way. Elevation started at 5,000 at home; most of the drive was along CO Hwy 14 from 7,000 to 10,200 and down to 9,000 feet.
Immediately, I turned VA off, remembering my summer experiences (smoked and got too hot with VA turned even to 50%). On flat land I-25, I was keeping 65 mph easily and EGTs were anywhere from 700 to 900. On uphills in 5th gear, it would climb up to 1100 but that's it. I did not do any faster; good fuel mileage was my other goal.
On Hwy 14 (for non-CO people, it is a 2-lane road winding through the mountains along the river), max speed was probably 55 mph, and it is all uphill to Cameron pass from 7,000 to 10,200, some 60 miles. It being a Friday evening in the fall, I had to pull over only a couple of times to let cars pass, and one Ford 150 passed me, just for me to gain on him in half a mile to pass him - whatever he was doing, must have been staring at the aspens. In 4th gear, the EGTs were about 800-900 all the time, staying at 45-50 mph. It was hard to go faster on this road. I noticed that a few times I could get into the 5th gear, I could accelerate and the EGTs would hit 1,200 but would not go above it, the truck just would hum and go faster. Boost pressures did not go above 18-19 psi. I don't have a boost elbow, but I did get the boost once to 21 psi on a rapid acceleration; the wastegate must open above that.
Going back, there is a steeper climb from the west side of Cameron, and I was in 3rd a lot, with EGTs around 800. In 4th, they would hit about 1,000 and it was difficult to speed up uphill.
I concluded that unless you are lugging the engine a lot, causing smoke, the EGTs stay in the safe zone (this is for people who don't have EGT gauges). As long as the RPMs are in 1750-2000 area, the EGTs were in 1,200-800 area.
Fuel mileage overall was 13.3 mpg. Given the slow speed and winding road, I am not displeased.
Hope this is useful for people who plan to mod trucks for high elevation towing. I love the 1.6s for this, I end up using just boost fooling and injectors and I am quite happy pulling in the mountains.
Cheers,
-P

jmd025

You're gonna love it with a boost elbow!!

Nice report.

Josh

GFB

Ya a boost elbow will also help those egts going up the hill.

MikeyM

Paul, that's great info! Thanks alot. Infact, I was just getting ready to PM you again to see if you had a chance to install guages to see what was happening. I find it interesting that even without a boost elbow but with the 1.6s installed, your boost was no higher than 21psi.. that's about normal for stock injectors from what I hear but more fuel should equal more boost, right?? And with more boost (added with the "more fuel") should be more git up, right? I wonder if it has to do with your elevation.

I would be very interested to see what the difference is / towability, if you will, on hills and in general with the boost elbow installed. I think you'll see lower EGTs but I wonder how the power will be if you could take the turbo right up to about 10% shy of it's max efficiency range.. like 33psi or so. You have the HX35, right?

Again, thanks for the write up.. so far, it has been the most informative, comprehensive info with specific regards to towing. If you recall, I was thinking of going with the Mach 1s but reading your posts makes me think I'll be more than fine with the 1.6s especially since my elevations are around 0-2000 ft. max.. unless we go up to the Sierras and that gets to 7k max.

Good stuff, Paul. Please let us know how the boost elbow mod does. It's only 15 bucks!!

Mike.

PS - at anytime, did you ever turn on the VA?? And how was the smoke level at lower and higher RPMs?

Big Blue24

Paul, just pinch that wastegate line for a few miles to test out how it would be with a boost elbow. I guarantee you will order a boost elbow same day, or just leave the wastegate entirely deactivated.

MikeyM

Hey Blue, what kind of gains would you say he'd get?

Thanks, Mike.

mrclean

Where would you get one of these? I've heard about people using them, never seen them advertised.

And for Paul.....I finally put my Smartbox on the truck.....I'm liking it alot. The engine seems louder now, did you experience this?

Krob

This is what your lookng for
http://www.xtremediesel.com/bd-power...ce1040310.aspx

But i think you can get it cheaper else were. Call Lary he probably has them, alot of the stock hes got is actually not advertised on the stores page.

I cant really remeber my gains from a boost elbow but it will keep egts down.

Hope it helps
Rob

EBunger

Just plug the hose and be done. If you add more fuel later dont forget its plugged though.

PaulDaisy

MikeyM - I'm quite sure that I am not seeing more than 21 psi because of the wastegate, it opens near 20-21 and won't let the truck build more pressure. This is what BigBlue and others are suggesting - deactivate the wastegate or increase the pressure that opens it (that is what boost elbow does).
But I have to say, in the practical mountains towing I am yet to see the need in higher boost. Only once I hit 20 psi towing normally. The rest of the time I would feel the need to downshift when the boost hits 18 psi as the EGTs would hit 1200* at about the same time. I suppose I will try clamping the hose to see if I could then simply floor her and boost to 25-30 psi and that might cool the EGTs but somehow I doubt it.
And yes, I did pull the trailer home with VA on 100% (I forgot to turn it off). It wasn't even in the mountains and once I was past 1st gear, I would make smoke any time I would try to accelerate faster than a kid pushing a lemonade cart. I had to watch the go pedal very closely, even cruising in 4th gear I could accelerate easily but would start trailing haze. So I turned VA off to boost fooling only. It seems that with VA the truck does build boost faster but not fast enough to eliminate the smoke.
And I just made another trip, same road, same trailer. Very enjoyable towing experience. I highly recommend 1.6s or 1s to people towing at high elevations. Contrary to others, I would recommend injectors 1st, box 2nd. And the box can be really mild as long as it boost fools (the only time you will turn it up is when not towing). Yes, I owe my good experience to Rip and Bob, thank you both! Your advice was invaluable. And - I did not bust the clutch (yet) even though I managed to almost fall off into a ravine in the slick wet snow...

2500Ram

Hey Paul send me a line if your interested. I "think" I've got a boost elbow from my EZ I'll send you. Didn't work with my turbo.

MikeyM

Good stuff Paul. But do you think that once you either A) block off the wastegate or B) install the boost elbow that the result will be more air with your light haze/smoke and hence - more power and less EGTs since you would probably burn most if not all of the fuel?? Just curious.

I mean, at any time were you lacking for power? Or were you driving more by pyro?

Also, I find it quite odd (possibly due to your elevation as opposed to mine) that your VA smokes when you want it to and mine wont. I mean - even if I floooooor it from dead stop unloaded or towing - no smoke. I would expect to see some sort of real light haze if the VA provides fueling but I have the V5 not the R.. same thing from what I've found but just different connection points (maybe I'm wrong??). Maybe I need an APPS reset or something.

At any rate, glad it's working out for you.. I'm itching to see what the boost elbow or blocking off the waste gate does for you.

Mike.

2500Ram

I'm not Paul but will reply, my setup is only an EZ see sig not a VA. At altitude I can fog out an intersection pulling our 7k trailer from a stop if I get on it, different turbos hx vs hy as well. Back at sea level MN so maybe ~500 ft I don't get a puff. It's all about the thin air up here.

PaulDaisy

MikeyM, try to shift early into 3rd and give it some gas while still at 1,000 RPM. If it does not smoke like a tank hit by a rocket, I will be very surprised. My truck smokes more readily with it because of injectors but I know for a fact that V5 will do that too with stock injectors, my friend and I set up trucks at the same time and his is stock with V5. It will smoke if he's not careful with the gas pedal.
I am sure though that the altitude is key here. As it got colder my truck does not smoke as readily and as much as in the summer.
If I get the boost elbow I will give another update on high altitude truck performance. It won't be quite the same truck though - I am shopping for new tires now, ouch...

MikeyM

Thanks Paul, good luck with the test. Not to turn this into a tire discussion but I've run BFGs forever on my Jeep when I had it and loved them.. however, this whole load range E thing makes tires pretty darn pricey. After a ton of research and forums, I went with the Cooper Discoverer STs like many here have, primarily for the reviews compared to price. So far, about 10k and very little wear. Quiet, too, and great tread pattern for combined on/off road. Anyway, for what it's worth.

Cheers, Mike