small block ford
This probably isn't what you want since you're looking at overdrive transmissions, but I just happen to have a turbo 400 with an ultrabell for a ford smallblock. It has a transbrake and one of those bolt on shields around the narrow part of the case. Since I'm putting a 440 chrysler in my mustang, I won't be needing it after all...
I vote for a stroker windsor in your case. I'm probably biased, since my mustang had one and ran really well with it, but also because of the weight advantage. I'm parting my 393 out since I decided to go with big block chrysler power. Nothing wrong with the 393, just that the oil pressure dropped. I was afraid the block had developed the infamous main saddles to valley crack they get when you make a bunch of power with them, but it turned out to just be bearings. I caught it quick enough that the crank only needed polishing. It ran pretty well-9.70's at 137-138 on a 200 shot. This was in a street driven fox body mustang that runs fine on pump gas when not being sprayed. Still had power windows/locks/mirrors, stock dashboard, etc. Now you see why I lean toward a stroked windsor. If I didn't have a ton of big block chrysler parts, and more faith in the long term durability of the chrysler, I'd have stayed with the windsor. Also, I just wanna be different. You don't see a whole lot of mustangs with a 440 in them.
I vote for a stroker windsor in your case. I'm probably biased, since my mustang had one and ran really well with it, but also because of the weight advantage. I'm parting my 393 out since I decided to go with big block chrysler power. Nothing wrong with the 393, just that the oil pressure dropped. I was afraid the block had developed the infamous main saddles to valley crack they get when you make a bunch of power with them, but it turned out to just be bearings. I caught it quick enough that the crank only needed polishing. It ran pretty well-9.70's at 137-138 on a 200 shot. This was in a street driven fox body mustang that runs fine on pump gas when not being sprayed. Still had power windows/locks/mirrors, stock dashboard, etc. Now you see why I lean toward a stroked windsor. If I didn't have a ton of big block chrysler parts, and more faith in the long term durability of the chrysler, I'd have stayed with the windsor. Also, I just wanna be different. You don't see a whole lot of mustangs with a 440 in them.
I can say of all the shows and races I've been to I've never seen a 440 in a mustang, I usually see a chevy, SB or BB. I really like stroker engines for street driven cars, especially for cruising a big boat; you can get a substantial amount more cubes without going big block and the torque curve is a lot wider/flatter stroked.
you mentioned the block cracking, is that just a problem with high power? I'm not looking to get a bunch of power out of this. for a 351W I'll use 1.94/1.60" valves, stroked I'll use 2.02/1.60" valve heads, 180cc intake runner size, 58-64cc combustion chambers and something similar to a performer or performerRPM intake, pretty mild as far as an engine build goes. I just want it to be a stump puller that can put that car up a grade effortlessly in 3rd gear and cruise down the freeway at 70 in 4th gear around 1300-1600rpm, I don't think that's asking too much.
you mentioned the block cracking, is that just a problem with high power? I'm not looking to get a bunch of power out of this. for a 351W I'll use 1.94/1.60" valves, stroked I'll use 2.02/1.60" valve heads, 180cc intake runner size, 58-64cc combustion chambers and something similar to a performer or performerRPM intake, pretty mild as far as an engine build goes. I just want it to be a stump puller that can put that car up a grade effortlessly in 3rd gear and cruise down the freeway at 70 in 4th gear around 1300-1600rpm, I don't think that's asking too much.
That kind of block cracking is totally irrelevant to what you're talking about. 302's seem to do it starting around 550 hp, 351w's will take somewhat more. A stroker doing what you describe could use any decent stock block and last practically forever. What happens is, the main bearing saddles crack. The crack runs front-back, and gradually works its way up, until it sometimes reaches the valley. For practical purposes, the block has cracked in two. Maybe not literally, but there's no structural integrity there. One of the first signs of it is a reduction in oil pressure, since the bearing saddles open up behind the bearing shells and bleed off oil pressure. I was afraid that had happened to mine, but it did not.
well I think all of the stroker plans are scratched. I believe I'll be doing a 460/E4OD. Is the ford EFI for the big blocks worth putting on or would I be better off with a Performer and a good carb? If I go carb I've found companies that offer trans controllers for the electric trans on a carb'd engine.
the funniest thing I've heard on some of the ford forums are die hard ford guys that don't know much about diesels tell me I should put a powerstroke in the lincoln! BAH-HAHAHAHAHA!
Um, I'm pulling this 462 out of the lincoln tonight...the power steering pump is on the crankshaft BEHIND the dampener! wha?! why?! it's not like there wasn't room on the front of that engine. also, I believe the A/C compressor was a structural part of the block as it was anchored on there by three different HUGE brackets and 10 7/16" bolts into the compressor(18 bolts total including bracket bolts). I was impressed.
the funniest thing I've heard on some of the ford forums are die hard ford guys that don't know much about diesels tell me I should put a powerstroke in the lincoln! BAH-HAHAHAHAHA!
Um, I'm pulling this 462 out of the lincoln tonight...the power steering pump is on the crankshaft BEHIND the dampener! wha?! why?! it's not like there wasn't room on the front of that engine. also, I believe the A/C compressor was a structural part of the block as it was anchored on there by three different HUGE brackets and 10 7/16" bolts into the compressor(18 bolts total including bracket bolts). I was impressed.
Wow, ps pump behind the damper? That's a new one on me. I don't know the specifics of the 460 injection setup, so I just have some general thoughts. Here they are:
The injected 460 was only available on trucks. That being the case, it is calibrated from the factory for low rpm torque. The manifolding is probably designed that way from the start, and will probably reward attempts at good midrange/upper rpm performance by becoming a big restriction. I don't know how easy it would be to recalibrate the computer in this case-it might be as simple as swapping a chip. I also don't know whether the 460 efi setup is speed density or mass airflow. That makes a pretty big difference in how adaptable it is to performance-enhancing parts. Mass airflow is much more tolerant, but both can be made to work with proper programming.
All that said, if I remember your goal correctly, you would probably not need much high rpm power. I'd think your performance goals would have you focusing on low-mid rpm torque, which works nicely with the stock setup. A good place for specific info on this would be some sort of ford truck board, since they'll have experience with the efi 460 already.
I'd personally just put a 750 vacuum secondary carburetor on it and be done with it. My personal opinion of the 460 is that it's a good motor waiting to be freed from the chains of crappy factory heads. If you can possibly afford it, put something like the edelbrock performer package on it. Not just cam/intake, but heads. Watch torque and power shoot up while retaining stock idle quality and probably getting a mileage improvement.
The injected 460 was only available on trucks. That being the case, it is calibrated from the factory for low rpm torque. The manifolding is probably designed that way from the start, and will probably reward attempts at good midrange/upper rpm performance by becoming a big restriction. I don't know how easy it would be to recalibrate the computer in this case-it might be as simple as swapping a chip. I also don't know whether the 460 efi setup is speed density or mass airflow. That makes a pretty big difference in how adaptable it is to performance-enhancing parts. Mass airflow is much more tolerant, but both can be made to work with proper programming.
All that said, if I remember your goal correctly, you would probably not need much high rpm power. I'd think your performance goals would have you focusing on low-mid rpm torque, which works nicely with the stock setup. A good place for specific info on this would be some sort of ford truck board, since they'll have experience with the efi 460 already.
I'd personally just put a 750 vacuum secondary carburetor on it and be done with it. My personal opinion of the 460 is that it's a good motor waiting to be freed from the chains of crappy factory heads. If you can possibly afford it, put something like the edelbrock performer package on it. Not just cam/intake, but heads. Watch torque and power shoot up while retaining stock idle quality and probably getting a mileage improvement.
Ford racing has some good aluminum heads for the 460 as well as a few others. it'd be some coin and for what I'm building it for wouldn't be necessary...I may just have the stock heads ported. I'm just going for a reliable cruiser with some stump pulling power to get away from those pesky stop signs.
You're correct about speed density and mass air flow. from what I've found out most of the California trucks were MAF systems for some reason. But that's good because I'd much rather use a MAF over speed density, quite a bit more accurate and better mileage(also more complicated and picky).
I've gotten some pretty good info after digging and asking a lot at a few ford forums...just not as much as I'd liked to have found. I've come to realize that I'm really spoiled here at DTR because there are a lot of guys that actually know what they're talking about here(granted there's a lot that don't as well).
You're correct about speed density and mass air flow. from what I've found out most of the California trucks were MAF systems for some reason. But that's good because I'd much rather use a MAF over speed density, quite a bit more accurate and better mileage(also more complicated and picky).
I've gotten some pretty good info after digging and asking a lot at a few ford forums...just not as much as I'd liked to have found. I've come to realize that I'm really spoiled here at DTR because there are a lot of guys that actually know what they're talking about here(granted there's a lot that don't as well).
It sounds like you're well on your way to figuring out exactly how to do this. I have one suggestion that I think will really help mileage and power if you decide to go to the trouble. That is to get quench in the combustion chamber, whatever head/piston combo you decide to use. Even if you have to buy new pistons or mill the block, get the pistons within about .040" or so of the head. I'd be willing to bet someone makes a cheap cast piston designed to develop quench with a stock iron head. Trust me, if you can get proper quench in the combustion chamber, it will pay for itself in better mileage and power.
On the heads, I think edelbrock performer rpm heads are like $1200 or so for a completely assembled set. I may be wrong on that, but that's what I remember those heads costing for most engines they have them for. You might have to mill the heads or swap pistons to get decent compression, as aluminum heads need more compression to equal the power of an otherwise-identical set of iron heads.
The stock heads mainly suck on the exhaust side if I remember right. That is where I'd focus any porting efforts if you decide to use a stock head.
On the heads, I think edelbrock performer rpm heads are like $1200 or so for a completely assembled set. I may be wrong on that, but that's what I remember those heads costing for most engines they have them for. You might have to mill the heads or swap pistons to get decent compression, as aluminum heads need more compression to equal the power of an otherwise-identical set of iron heads.
The stock heads mainly suck on the exhaust side if I remember right. That is where I'd focus any porting efforts if you decide to use a stock head.
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