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Old May 31, 2004 | 08:23 PM
  #16  
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You guys should read this :

Isn't this the truth?? Read this thoroughly !!
Subj: America Needs to Wake Up
Date: 5/27/2004 1:13:19 PM Central Standard Time
:



A friend sent me this speech which was reportedly given by Navy Capt Ouimette, the XO at NAS Pensacola. In this recent speech he contends that the terrorists have been at war against the US for longer than we realize and gives dates, etc.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

AMERICA NEEDS TO WAKE UP!
That's what we think we heard on the 11th of September 2001 and maybe it was, but I think it should have been "Get Out of Bed!" In fact, I think the alarm clock has been buzzing since 1979 and we have continued to hit the snooze button and roll over for a few more minutes of peaceful sleep since then.

It was a cool fall day in November 1979 in a country going through a religious and political upheaval when a group of Iranian students attacked and seized the American Embassy in Tehran. This seizure was an outright attack on American soil; it was an attack that held the world's most powerful country hostage and paralyzed a Presidency. The attack on this sovereign U. S. embassy set the stage for events to follow for the next 23 years.

America was still reeling from the aftermath of the Vietnam experience and had a serious threat from the Soviet Union when then, President Carter, had to do something. He chose to conduct a clandestine raid in the desert. The ill-fated mission ended in ruin, but stood as a symbol of America's inability to deal with terrorism.

America's military had been decimated and downsized/right sized since the end of the Vietnam War. A poorly trained, poorly equipped and poorly organized military was called on to execute a complex mission that was doomed from the start.

Shortly after the Tehran experience, Americans began to be kidnapped and killed throughout the Middle East. America could do little to protect her citizens living and working abroad. The attacks against US soil continued.

In April of 1983 a large vehicle packed with high explosives was driven into the US Embassy compound in Beirut. When it explodes, it kills 63 people. The alarm went off again and America hit the Snooze Button once more.

Then just six short months later a large truck heavily laden down with over 2500 pounds of TNT smashed through the main gate of the US Marine Corps headquarters in Beirut and 241 US servicemen are killed. America mourns her dead and hit the Snooze Button once more.

Two months later in December 1983, another truck loaded with explosives is driven into the US Embassy in Kuwait, and America continues her slumber.

The following year, in September 1984, another van was driven into the gates of the US Embassy in Beirut and America slept.

Soon the terrorism spreads to Europe. In April 1985 a bomb explodes in a restaurant frequented by US soldiers in Madrid.

Then in August a Volkswagen loaded with explosives is driven into the main gate of the US Air Force Base at Rhein-Main, 22 are killed and the snooze alarm is buzzing louder and louder as US interests are continually attacked.

Fifty-nine days later a cruise ship, the Achille Lauro is hijacked and we watched as an American in a wheelchair is singled out of the passenger list and executed.

The terrorists then shift their tactics to bombing civilian airliners when they bomb TWA Flight 840 in April of 1986 that killed 4 and the most tragic bombing, Pan Am Flight 103 over Lockerbie, Scotland in 1988, killing 259.

America wants to treat these terrorist acts as crimes; in fact we are still trying to bring these people to trial. These are acts of war.

The wake up alarm is getting louder and louder The terrorists decide to bring the fight to America. In January 1993, two CIA agents are shot and killed as they enter CIA headquarters in Langley, Virginia.

The following month, February 1993, a group of terrorists are arrested after a rented van packed with explosives is driven into the underground parking garage of the World Trade Center in New York City. Six people are killed and over 1000 are injured. Still this is a crime and not an act of war? The Snooze alarm is depressed again.

Then in November 1995 a car bomb explodes at a US military complex in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia killing seven service men and women.

A few months later in June of 1996, another truck bomb explodes only 35 yards from the US military compound in Dhahran, Saudi Arabia. It destroys the Khobar Towers, a US Air Force barracks, killing 19 and injuring over 500. The terrorists are getting braver and smarter as they see that America does not respond decisively..

They move to coordinate their attacks in a simultaneous attack on two US embassies in Kenya and Tanzania. These attacks were planned with precision. They kill 224. America responds with cruise missile attacks and goes back to sleep.

The USS Cole was docked in the port of Aden, Yemen for refueling on 12 October 2000, when a small craft pulled along side the ship and exploded killing 17 US Navy Sailors. Attacking a US War Ship is an act of war, but we sent the FBI to investigate the crime and went back to sleep.

And of course you know the events of 11 September 2001. Most Americans think this was the first attack against US soil or in America. How wrongthey are. America has been under a constant attack since 1979 and we chose to hit the snooze alarm and roll over and go back to sleep.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
-- My Contribution is ....
( I think the final toll of deaths was 3018 - not counting the hijackers of which there was 17)! New York City, Washington, DC and a field in Pennsylvania
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
In the news lately we have seen lots of finger pointing from every high officials in government over what they knew and what they didn't know. But if you've read the papers and paid a little attention I think you can see exactly what they knew. You don't have to be in the FBI or CIA or on the National Security Council to see the pattern that has been developing since 1979.

The President is right on when he says we are engaged in a war. I think we have been in a war for the past 23 years and it will continue until we as a people decide enough is enough.

America needs to "Get out of Bed" and act decisively now. America has been changed forever. We have to be ready to pay the price and make the sacrifice to ensure our way of life continues. We cannot afford to keep hitting the snooze button again and again and roll over and go back to sleep.

After the attack on Pearl Harbor, Admiral Yamamoto said "...it seems all we have done is awakened a sleeping giant." This is the message we need to disseminate to terrorists around the world.

Support Our Troops and support President Bush for having the courage, political or militarily, to address what so many who preceded him didn't have the backbone to do both Democrat and Republican. This is not a political thing to be hashed over in an election year this is an AMERICAN thing. This is about our Freedom and the Freedom of our children in years to come.

I just got this message from my brother.
Tom
Old May 31, 2004 | 08:46 PM
  #17  
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I believe alot of the middle eastern countries are upset with the usa for continued support of Israel. Israel has land that United Nations resolutions say needs to be returned to the owners. Many are living in refugee camps awating the return of there land. These oppressed people see usa planes, tanks, and money supporting Israel keeping this land. Now Israel is building a wall around this land. Israel needs to make peace, return land, and learn to be a good neighbor. The united states needs to be more careful who we lend our support to.
Old May 31, 2004 | 09:33 PM
  #18  
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Originally posted by FiverBob
Who was it that scorned the US, welcomed terroists in his country, defied the UN, support terroism around the world? Let me remember - - - oh yeh, some Islamic radical named Saddam. And where did he live, and rule, and create his mayhem - - - hmmmm, oh yeh, Iraq.
scorned the us, yes... Welcomed terrorists into his country, not so sure about that... defied the UN, yes... supported terrorism, not so sure about that, Momar Qudaffy (sp) over in Lybia (sp) definatly supported terrorists around the world far more than saddam...(wasn't momar's agents found responsable for bombing that pan-am flight over scotland??) Saddam an islamic radical?? I don't think so, evil tyrant, yes. Relegious zelot definatly not...
I never have been able to draw a direct line between 9/11 and Saddam in Iraq. I am not disputing the fact the man was evil and had to go, I just don't think he was involved or had anything to do with 9/11.
Afganistan and the Taliban.... Now there is a direct link to 9/11.
Old May 31, 2004 | 10:36 PM
  #19  
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MnTom, you hit the nail on the head. We have been at war since 1979, and we keep rolling over. And the far left keeps screaming that we are to militant, we need to downsize the military, we need to keep using diplomacy instead of action.

We need to step up to the plate and swing.

And for those that don't like it, I am sorry. I am glad that we have a man in the White House that is not afraid to go against the political winds that are blowing.

We need to support our troops and honor those that have gone before. I still think that those who turn their back on the service that has been done is turning their back on almost everything this nation stands for.

Like it or leave it. Good words, in my opinion.
Old Jun 1, 2004 | 07:44 AM
  #20  
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From: Tomball, Texas
We are much better off without the draft. The volunteer system brings in a much better quality soldier. Even the military doesn't want the draft.
Wanting to be a soldier brings honor and pride.

Shakespeare's quote is so true today (I probably butchered it!):

We few, we happy few,
we band of brothers,
for he today that sheds his blood with me,
shall be my brother.


God, Country, Corp

MikeyB
Old Jun 1, 2004 | 08:06 AM
  #21  
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Originally posted by AlpineRAM
Well- maybe it's just me-but would you take up a gun and go to war for something you can't stand behind? Personally, for me on my side of the pond, I wouldn't want to go to war for the government we currently have. I'd go and defend my country-yes, but I wouldn't go out somewhere to defend their politcal agenda. (Which I didn't vote for)
America is in the situation that it won't have to defend the country- only so called interests. And on those I think you can differentiate, if you like, between the ones from the past and the ones the current administration thinks are worth waging war for...

Just my 2c

AlpineRAM
I'd say 9/11 is worth waging war for.
Old Jun 1, 2004 | 08:10 AM
  #22  
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Thumbs up

Originally posted by FiverBob
Boy, I really struggle thinking this war is all about "interests." Let me see, what was it that happened on 9/11 - - maybe we have forgotten. And, who was it that bombed out ship, and our embassies, and . . . on and on and on? Hmmmm . . . oh yeh, it was radical Islamics. Now let's see - - - who is that says "we infidels" should be eliminated? Oh yeh, Islamic radicals. Who was it that scorned the US, welcomed terroists in his country, defied the UN, support terroism around the world? Let me remember - - - oh yeh, some Islamic radical named Saddam. And where did he live, and rule, and create his mayhem - - - hmmmm, oh yeh, Iraq.

Now, how do we call that "interests?" The only interest involved here is that is in the best "interest" of the world that he is eliminated and that country be liberated. Too bad a bunch of other cowards were too involved in protecting their "interests" in their financial involvement in that crooked regime to get on board to get rid of him. I am waiting for all the facts to come out about the involvements of France, Germany and Russia - - and the UN in that debacle.

OK, shut up Bob. Your blood pressure is going up.

Proud to be an American and sooooo proud of our president. He is a man of integrity and guts. Sic em, W.
What he said.
Old Jun 1, 2004 | 08:25 AM
  #23  
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From: Lingleville TX but active duty Air Force all over the world currently
We need to go Black jack Pershing on all of em........Do some research on him......
Old Jun 1, 2004 | 10:31 AM
  #24  
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Freedom Is Not Free!!
Old Jun 1, 2004 | 12:29 PM
  #25  
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AlpineRam,

I just can not understand why you do not see it as it is:

A bunch of Iraqi terrorists using weapons of mass destruction attacked the USA, threatenning even the foundations of our nation, and as such all able bodied people should be called to arms to go and defend our homeland, as we are doing now.
It is that patriotic spirit that leads us to great victories, and when we defeat tyrants the opressed people come out in the streets with flowers and welcome our troops with joy. They offer them their hospitality, ask them to stay until they want. They even offer to repay us for our valiant and galant resque. The love of the freed people so overwhelms our soldiers that they continue to selflessly sacrifice life and limb for this freedom fight.
And they say they would do it again at any time.

In the mean time, because we are so loved and respected around the world, all the nations are fighting among themselves who should be the first to come and help us in this noble quest.

Many want to send troops, others want to supply wast quantities of oil at reduced prices, and others yet in the Islamic world are repeatedly publicly condeming any uncivilized act by a few unsawory caracters who do not appreciate the freedom we brought to the Iraqi nation.

I think you must stop watching and reading those crazy reality stunts that imply that the actual wrong doers were Saudis, that their leader is still at large after all this time, that we went to war by choice without a plan, etc. etc. etc. Of course all the other scandals that we do not have a big enough broom to quickly sweep under are just the inventions of the ...whatever, who dare to opose the rightcheousnes and intelectual might of our leadership. After all the rest of the world must ony be a bunch of idiots.

PS. Before anyone goes off on me which I do not mind I want you to know that my son is there serving with all the other brave men and women. And as far as I can tell most of them believe that they are there because that is their job. They do the best they can, because they believe in doing their job well. They deserve our support and prayers because they are not doing it by chioce but by demand. The demand of their job.
Old Jun 1, 2004 | 12:50 PM
  #26  
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1) I agree that each should have a choice but if you choose to leave then don't come back.

2) While I can see the merits of an all volunteer force I'm not sure we can man the numbers we need.

3) I would like to see a mandatory service period for everyone in the U.S. No exemptions at all. There are plenty of jobs that can be done that don't require physical strength. I would venture to say that 95% of people born with disabilities could perform a useful function in the service. Think of the training (for job skills) they would get and the confidence and pride derived from serving our country.

4) Many of us here on this site are concerned about immigrant issues. How about a mandatory service time before you get a long term visa?


I know there are lots of issues with what I said above. My son, who is 18 and just graduated from high school is as prime a candidate there is for any future draft. Does that scare me? Yep. He is trying to decide right now about joining an ROTC program in college. He is a good kid and I have to be very careful about giving him advice. I want him to make the best decision for him, not something to please me.

My biggest ( and really only regret I have in my life) is that I didn't serve when I had the chance. By the time I realized just how important it was to me it was too late. Can't do much about that except pass that along to young people that I meet in life.

Wartime presidents have a pretty bad re-election record. The upcoming election may be the most important election that I will ever vote in. So, my service to my country now comes in the form of getting people to vote. I'm sure not all of them will vote the way I will but at least they will vote.

So, vote, pray for peace but if you have to go carry the biggest hammer you can.
Old Jun 1, 2004 | 01:31 PM
  #27  
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Originally posted by rvnagain
I believe alot of the middle eastern countries are upset with the usa for continued support of Israel. Israel has land that United Nations resolutions say needs to be returned to the owners. Many are living in refugee camps awating the return of there land. These oppressed people see usa planes, tanks, and money supporting Israel keeping this land. Now Israel is building a wall around this land. Israel needs to make peace, return land, and learn to be a good neighbor. The united states needs to be more careful who we lend our support to.
Maybe you need to wake up and smell the roses. Seems like someone else thought that way... lets see now, oh yeah, Hitler. Possibly you should look at the history you try to quote. The UN gave the partitioned section of land to the new country of Israel in 1948. They are the owners. The Palestinians left and refused their sovereign portion of Palestine. See they don't want a portion of land for themselves, they want the Jew dead and gone.

You may have a point there though, suck up to the terrorists and maybe they will pass over you when thy get here. You like them that well, go over there and join them. At least you are a minority...
Old Jun 1, 2004 | 01:44 PM
  #28  
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RVNAgain said "I believe alot of the middle eastern countries are upset with the usa for continued support of Israel. Israel has land that United Nations resolutions say needs to be returned to the owners. Many are living in refugee camps awating the return of there land. These oppressed people see usa planes, tanks, and money supporting Israel keeping this land. Now Israel is building a wall around this land. Israel needs to make peace, return land, and learn to be a good neighbor. The united states needs to be more careful who we lend our support to."

I am not flaming anyone - just responding to RVNAgain's comments. So the "you" and "you'll" is a general comment to any and all.

All the UN needs to do is enforce the treaties, agreements and resolutions and leave Israel alone. Israel hasn't gone out and attacked any other country that wasn't threatening them. Including Iran (and their Nuclear Power Plants), the so-called Palestinian "State". Did you know there was no such thing as a "Palestinian" until the early '60's time frame?
Israel took a total barren desert and through their hard work have turned it into an almost oasis. The previous residents never did anything like that to the same land - they were willing to sit back in their 10th century mentality and smoke camel-dung cigars. Now that Israel has a prosperous, beautiful country, everyone in that area wants it all back and most have said they will not stop until there is no more Israel.
I think if you'll look back in history, the UN (at the time) provided ALL the land that is in dispute to Israel for their homeland & country. Immediately, they were attacked by Egypt and a couple other countries. Israel survived and kicked butt. They were again attacked in 1967 - in that war, all alone, they not only survived, but they also managed to acquire more land areas - and they didn't take any names this time.
Now, Israel is being told that they have to return the land they won in that war. When will the US return the land they took from Mexico or France or Canada, or..... during our various internal wars? Countries are never forced to return the land they've acquired during a war. If that was the case, we would only be maybe 1/3 the size we are now.
Additionally, the 'refugee' problem is totally a Syria & Saudi Arabia caused problem. Way back in '48, these people (approximately 250,000) were told to leave their homes and that Saudi Arabia would deal with Israel and would return the land to the so-called native people very soon. So, they left voluntarily. However, Saudi Arabia was not able to keep their promise. Most of these 'refugees' have been living in the same land area for more than 50 years. And they are still called 'refugees' after more than 50 years?? Why isn't their 'home' country taking care of these people? Israel was able to absorb almost 650,000 people into their tiny country and economy back in the early '50s. Yet Syria was unable to absorb 250,000 into their 10x + larger land mass and economy??
As far as the 'Palestinians" are concerned, most want a very normal, peaceful life style. There are the few, most vocal group, who are intent on wiping Israel from the face of the map. No matter how much Israel gives (according to various treaties), it's never enough for the Palestinian leadership. During the Oslo Accord, Israel was to give up the "West Bank" (west bank of what?) and the Gaza Strip. In exchange, this would have been the end of all hostilities between Palestine and Israel. Yet Palestine continues to cause as much hatred and violence as humanly possible. Israel abided by the Treaty - why hasn't Palestine? Why hasn't the UN stepped in and made Palestine obey the treaty? How many Israelies have you heard about going into Palestine and triggering bombs to kill as many civilians as possible? At least their military are the ones fighting the Palestinians. The Palestinian "freedom fighters" (or whatever coddley name you want to call them) are the ones who use teenagers and children to cross into Israel and detonate these coat-covered bombs and kill so many innocent civilians. I call them innocent, because there's no difference between those Israelites and our people in the Towers. Neither group of civilians has done anything to these people yet were/ are/and will be killed indescriminately by terrorists.
As far as the 'wall' is concerned, Israel is finally able to stop these killers (and I'm ONLY talking about these 'suicide' murderers - not the general population - by killing the Palestinian leadership and erecting the monstrous fence/border to keep these killers out. The same people who demand that we (US) try to negotiate with these same terrorists are the same type of people who keep on demanding that Israel negotiate with their terrorist neighbors. All you have to do is look at the broken negotiations and treaties between Israel and Palestine to see we are fighting the same type of terrorist war. Who was waving their flags and cheering after the 09-11-01 attacks? The terrorist Palestinians. And Israel is the 'bad guy'? How can anyone in the US tell Israel that they cannot take out their attackers leadership, while we go after those and their leaders who attacked our citizens?

Do some more research and check out the 1930's German leadership and compare it to Czechoslovachia at that time. You'll see so many mirror images that it's truly frightening.

My turn to get off the soap-box.

DW
Old Jun 1, 2004 | 02:12 PM
  #29  
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Thumbs up

Originally posted by DeaconWayne
RVNAgain said "I believe alot of the middle eastern countries are upset with the usa for continued support of Israel. Israel has land that United Nations resolutions say needs to be returned to the owners. Many are living in refugee camps awating the return of there land. These oppressed people see usa planes, tanks, and money supporting Israel keeping this land. Now Israel is building a wall around this land. Israel needs to make peace, return land, and learn to be a good neighbor. The united states needs to be more careful who we lend our support to."

I am not flaming anyone - just responding to RVNAgain's comments. So the "you" and "you'll" is a general comment to any and all.

All the UN needs to do is enforce the treaties, agreements and resolutions and leave Israel alone. Israel hasn't gone out and attacked any other country that wasn't threatening them. Including Iran (and their Nuclear Power Plants), the so-called Palestinian "State". Did you know there was no such thing as a "Palestinian" until the early '60's time frame?
Israel took a total barren desert and through their hard work have turned it into an almost oasis. The previous residents never did anything like that to the same land - they were willing to sit back in their 10th century mentality and smoke camel-dung cigars. Now that Israel has a prosperous, beautiful country, everyone in that area wants it all back and most have said they will not stop until there is no more Israel.
I think if you'll look back in history, the UN (at the time) provided ALL the land that is in dispute to Israel for their homeland & country. Immediately, they were attacked by Egypt and a couple other countries. Israel survived and kicked butt. They were again attacked in 1967 - in that war, all alone, they not only survived, but they also managed to acquire more land areas - and they didn't take any names this time.
Now, Israel is being told that they have to return the land they won in that war. When will the US return the land they took from Mexico or France or Canada, or..... during our various internal wars? Countries are never forced to return the land they've acquired during a war. If that was the case, we would only be maybe 1/3 the size we are now.
Additionally, the 'refugee' problem is totally a Syria & Saudi Arabia caused problem. Way back in '48, these people (approximately 250,000) were told to leave their homes and that Saudi Arabia would deal with Israel and would return the land to the so-called native people very soon. So, they left voluntarily. However, Saudi Arabia was not able to keep their promise. Most of these 'refugees' have been living in the same land area for more than 50 years. And they are still called 'refugees' after more than 50 years?? Why isn't their 'home' country taking care of these people? Israel was able to absorb almost 650,000 people into their tiny country and economy back in the early '50s. Yet Syria was unable to absorb 250,000 into their 10x + larger land mass and economy??
As far as the 'Palestinians" are concerned, most want a very normal, peaceful life style. There are the few, most vocal group, who are intent on wiping Israel from the face of the map. No matter how much Israel gives (according to various treaties), it's never enough for the Palestinian leadership. During the Oslo Accord, Israel was to give up the "West Bank" (west bank of what?) and the Gaza Strip. In exchange, this would have been the end of all hostilities between Palestine and Israel. Yet Palestine continues to cause as much hatred and violence as humanly possible. Israel abided by the Treaty - why hasn't Palestine? Why hasn't the UN stepped in and made Palestine obey the treaty? How many Israelies have you heard about going into Palestine and triggering bombs to kill as many civilians as possible? At least their military are the ones fighting the Palestinians. The Palestinian "freedom fighters" (or whatever coddley name you want to call them) are the ones who use teenagers and children to cross into Israel and detonate these coat-covered bombs and kill so many innocent civilians. I call them innocent, because there's no difference between those Israelites and our people in the Towers. Neither group of civilians has done anything to these people yet were/ are/and will be killed indescriminately by terrorists.
As far as the 'wall' is concerned, Israel is finally able to stop these killers (and I'm ONLY talking about these 'suicide' murderers - not the general population - by killing the Palestinian leadership and erecting the monstrous fence/border to keep these killers out. The same people who demand that we (US) try to negotiate with these same terrorists are the same type of people who keep on demanding that Israel negotiate with their terrorist neighbors. All you have to do is look at the broken negotiations and treaties between Israel and Palestine to see we are fighting the same type of terrorist war. Who was waving their flags and cheering after the 09-11-01 attacks? The terrorist Palestinians. And Israel is the 'bad guy'? How can anyone in the US tell Israel that they cannot take out their attackers leadership, while we go after those and their leaders who attacked our citizens?

Do some more research and check out the 1930's German leadership and compare it to Czechoslovachia at that time. You'll see so many mirror images that it's truly frightening.

My turn to get off the soap-box.

DW
Good post...
Old Jun 1, 2004 | 02:17 PM
  #30  
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From: Lingleville TX but active duty Air Force all over the world currently
we can support our numbers without a draft..im active duty and we are going througha 24,000 man reduction in forces...thats cutting 24,000 bodies from us........LOVE IT OR BE GONE ALREADY.....ill always remember blackjack pershing........



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