Dodge Durango Gasser question
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From: Austria Europe
Dodge Durango Gasser question
I've got a customer with a Durango 4.7L and this car has me puzzled.
The customer came in with the CE light on and the complaint of massive black smoke. Looked at the codes and found Bank 1 running lean- while the actual exhaust gas tested out for lambda 0.6 (should be 1.0, so we are extreeeeeeemely rich)- so I changed the O2 sensor (only has one upstream and one downstream of the catalytic converter) and the exhaust gas had a lambda value of 0.995 and the code did not pop up again- customer drives the car for about 2 days and all of a sudden the same problems as before.
All other systems check out good, only O2 sensor gone within less than 50 miles. I do not want to throw O2 sensors on it every 50 miles.
I read that there are O2 sensors from Bosch that are cheaper and more reliable- if anybody has a part No I'd be really glad.
Anybody any ideas?
Thanks!
AlpineRAM
The customer came in with the CE light on and the complaint of massive black smoke. Looked at the codes and found Bank 1 running lean- while the actual exhaust gas tested out for lambda 0.6 (should be 1.0, so we are extreeeeeeemely rich)- so I changed the O2 sensor (only has one upstream and one downstream of the catalytic converter) and the exhaust gas had a lambda value of 0.995 and the code did not pop up again- customer drives the car for about 2 days and all of a sudden the same problems as before.
All other systems check out good, only O2 sensor gone within less than 50 miles. I do not want to throw O2 sensors on it every 50 miles.
I read that there are O2 sensors from Bosch that are cheaper and more reliable- if anybody has a part No I'd be really glad.
Anybody any ideas?
Thanks!
AlpineRAM
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From: Central VA
I had a 318 gasser that would run excessively rich.
After playing with it for awhile, I discovered severe carbon tracking in the distributor cap was causing misfire and loading up the CAT with raw fuel causing the Ox sensors to die.
Might be something to check.
REAL trucks don't have spark plugs......or glow plugs........
After playing with it for awhile, I discovered severe carbon tracking in the distributor cap was causing misfire and loading up the CAT with raw fuel causing the Ox sensors to die.
Might be something to check.
REAL trucks don't have spark plugs......or glow plugs........
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From: Central VA
Originally Posted by AlpineRAM
Thanks Shovel- the 4.7 has individual coils on each plug and I don't have any recorded misfires.
and it ain't a truck - it's a car
and it ain't a truck - it's a car
Originally Posted by jrkerns
...it's not a car or a truck...it's a minivan 
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From: Cypress, TX
Has he recently replaced any gaskets? It sounds like the O2 sensor is being poisoned - some silicone gasket sealers can do this via the crankcase ventilation system. Not to sound condescending, but it would help to know what might have changed (gaskets as above, different fuel or oil, etc.) just before the problem started.
Rusty
Rusty
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The problem is that the vehicle (minivan, car, bus, rocket, 4wheelpocketbike whatever 
) has just been bought by my customer and he doesn't have any service history.
It has an aftermarket air filter but I assume that it's not the cause because it isn't overoiled and the 4.7 has only MAP, TP and IAT, no mass flow sensor.
I didn't find any obvious places where they could have replaced anything that would require RTV to seal.
Something new has happened now there is water in the oil, did a pressure test on the radiator system and it has no leaks.
The engine oil has been changed, but I know we used the same drum of oil on other vehicles with cat. conv too without problems- new oil filter is from Mopar.
Keep the ideas coming!
Thanks!
Markus
PS- I read about an aftermarket Bosch O2 sensor somewhere that should cost about 45 US$- instead of the 230Euros plus 20% .. Anybody an idea about a Bosch part number?
) has just been bought by my customer and he doesn't have any service history. It has an aftermarket air filter but I assume that it's not the cause because it isn't overoiled and the 4.7 has only MAP, TP and IAT, no mass flow sensor.
I didn't find any obvious places where they could have replaced anything that would require RTV to seal.
Something new has happened now there is water in the oil, did a pressure test on the radiator system and it has no leaks.
The engine oil has been changed, but I know we used the same drum of oil on other vehicles with cat. conv too without problems- new oil filter is from Mopar.
Keep the ideas coming!
Thanks!
Markus
PS- I read about an aftermarket Bosch O2 sensor somewhere that should cost about 45 US$- instead of the 230Euros plus 20% .. Anybody an idea about a Bosch part number?
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From: Cypress, TX
From a Google search on Bosch O2 Sensor Poisoning:
The bold area above ties into your water-in-the-oil scenario.
Rusty
Oxygen Sensor (a.k.a. Lambda Sensor, O2 Sensor)
The ECU requires a final test to fine-tune the mixture: the oxygen sensor. Located in the exhaust downpipe, close to the engine, this sensor doesn't work until it reaches about 600ºF. At that point, it generates a voltage that is proportional to the amount of oxygen left in the exhaust gas. Too much oxygen indicates lean running; too little means the mixture is rich. The ECU uses the feedback to constantly adjust mixture. The O2 sensor is quite sophisticated, and can be killed in a number of ways. Inappropriate gasket sealants can poison the sensor. A sudden shock (such as dropping the sensor), or excessive oil or fuel in the exhaust can poison it. If you blow a head gasket, you should replace the sensor, because coolant can ruin it. A bad O2 sensor may not be immediately noticeable. Just remember that a rich mixture can damage your expensive catalytic converter.
The ECU requires a final test to fine-tune the mixture: the oxygen sensor. Located in the exhaust downpipe, close to the engine, this sensor doesn't work until it reaches about 600ºF. At that point, it generates a voltage that is proportional to the amount of oxygen left in the exhaust gas. Too much oxygen indicates lean running; too little means the mixture is rich. The ECU uses the feedback to constantly adjust mixture. The O2 sensor is quite sophisticated, and can be killed in a number of ways. Inappropriate gasket sealants can poison the sensor. A sudden shock (such as dropping the sensor), or excessive oil or fuel in the exhaust can poison it. If you blow a head gasket, you should replace the sensor, because coolant can ruin it. A bad O2 sensor may not be immediately noticeable. Just remember that a rich mixture can damage your expensive catalytic converter.
Rusty
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From: Austria Europe
Well the water in the oil had absolutely no antifreeze in it, that's what really puzzles me. Also the pressure test we use usually shows a bad headgasket really quick.
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From: Los Angeles
This may sound really dumb but is the battery OK.. or are they disconecting the battery in some way.??
I had a 1999 and if the battery goes dead, gets low enough or is disconnected it will clear the computer memory and the truck will run rich and blow black smoke for about 3 to 5 miles until it learns to drive again.
gerry
I had a 1999 and if the battery goes dead, gets low enough or is disconnected it will clear the computer memory and the truck will run rich and blow black smoke for about 3 to 5 miles until it learns to drive again.
gerry
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From: Ila georgia
also try www.dodgetrucks.org