I could give you the answer but this thread would get moved awfully quick.

 

Justin[/quote]

Diesel is gonna be phased out cause its getting to expensive to meet emission standards? We could concentrate on alternate bio-fuels that'll burn cleaner than any fancy-shamncy gasoline hybrid but that might hurt the oil companies.

Why should we GROW our fuel? Its not like farmers are struggling in this country.

Growing fuel.

:: ppfft ::

We cant have that...thats crazy talk!!!

 

Why should we GROW our fuel? Its not like farmers are struggling in this country.

Growing fuel.

:: ppfft ::

We cant have that...thats crazy talk!!![/QUOTE]

Wish that would actually happen....not much chance. This entire area has just about stopped farming due to going broke, my dad included. He quit about 10 years ago now and got a job in town. Tractors and farm equipment all just sitting out rotting now other than the grain equipment for cattle.

 

Wish that would actually happen....not much chance. This entire area has just about stopped farming due to going broke, my dad included. He quit about 10 years ago now and got a job in town. Tractors and farm equipment all just sitting out rotting now other than the grain equipment for cattle.[/quote]


I know the feeling. My grandfather was one of the largest squash and okra farmers south of San Antonio but when he had his stroke, on top of a decade long drought and water rations we couldn't keep it going. But if this country would wake up to the idea of bio fuels and there was a sudden and steady demand for soy, corn, and other renewables, I would get what land we have left and hit the rows.

 

I know the feeling. My grandfather was one of the largest squash and okra farmers south of San Antonio but when he had his stroke, on top of a decade long drought and water rations we couldn't keep it going. But if this country would wake up to the idea of bio fuels and there was a sudden and steady demand for soy, corn, and other renewables, I would get what land we have left and hit the rows.[/QUOTE]

Corn is over $6 a bushell last time I checked. A few years back it was $2.50 a bushell. Sounds like demand has gone up to me.

 

That was exactly what I was speaking to and meant. Diesel as a fuel will be replaced at some point in the future. The compression fired engine still has uses. The statement about buses - they use the same engines adapted to LNG, CNG or propane. If it works in a bus it may work in a small or large truck.

With the mad rush caused by 'Global Warming', it's virtually like the early 20th Century again with respect to vehicles and fuel. If you can dream it..... Bottomline: At this point everything is on the table. Bad ideas will eventually fall by the wayside. Personally my money is on the Fuel Cell.

 

I disagree with the last part of that statement. I have an old friend that is always dreaming of ways for the oil companies to be hurt. The truth, that I can never get through to him is: When a new fuel is brought to market it will be the same huge multi-billion dollar companies bringing it to you. It just makes sense. What do you think Standard, Exxon etc would do if biofuel suddenly took off? Do you honestly think they would start rolling up the carpet while remembering the 'good old days'? Not for a minute.

Each oil company maintains a number of chemical laboratories. All of which are hard at work to bring you the next fuel. It has to be a coordinated effort between vehicle manufacturers and fuel manufacturers, not to mention the government. As always it will be a game for the "Big Boys". A small time guy in Iowa would not be able to beat out Exxon. Do you think for a minute GM would commit to building 1 million new cars based on a new engine without a solid guarantee that the fuel would be all over the country in time?

The oil companies have infrastructure: Refineries, distribution centers, maritime fleets, tens of thousands trucks and retail stations. They will win.

 

It's being driven by EPA and in my state CARB. These guys do not care about you or me. They care and are paid to cleanup the air, the environment etc. It will be enough when all vehicles are 'ZERO' emission.

 

In today's Washington Post,.....a different view.

 

Here is the latest news:

Fueled by Economy, Automakers Ready 'Clean Diesel' Push in U.S.
New Models Better Equipped to Overcome Negative Perceptions

By Jean Halliday

Published: September 15, 2008
DETROIT (AdAge.com) -- Soon you might see Patrick Dempsey and Sandra Bullock tooling around in diesels -- but not those loud, stinky vehicles from years ago. Coming is a new breed of clean and quiet engines that can meet even strict emissions standards in California and New York. "This is not your grandfather's technology," said Steve Cannon, VP-marketing at Mercedes-Benz USA.

In Europe, diesel vehicles hold some 50% of the market, but Mike Omotoso, senior manager at J.D. Power & Associates, said diesel models account for only 2% of new light-vehicle sales a year in the U.S. That, however, is about to change, he said, estimating that the figure will rise to 10% by 2015.

German automakers are leading the charge. Volkswagen of America launched its Jetta TDI earlier this year, and sibling Audi soon will offer a diesel Q7 SUV. Mercedes-Benz USA will launch its newest BlueTec diesel vehicle, an E-Class sedan, next month, and BMW's first clean-diesel product launch in the U.S., the X5 SUV, is coming later this year, followed by a version of its best-selling model, the 3 Series sedan, in January.

But those carmakers will have to change this country's diesel-dissing ways. Americans see diesel vehicles as "poor-performing, meaning slow; black, sooty emissions; smelly; and loud," said Jack Pitney, VP-marketing for BMW of North America. "We have huge perceptual barriers with diesel launches. There's a tremendous opportunity for us but also a real education challenge."

J.D. Power's Mr. Omotoso said marketers face other roadblocks as well. Diesel fuel costs more than gasoline, and fewer than half the country's 170,000 gas stations sell diesel. But "you can drive longer distances between fill-ups," he said, "so it's not likely you'll run out of gas." He said diesel provides 30% better fuel economy.

Gasoline averaged $3.64 a gallon on Sept. 8, and diesel was $4.05 in the U.S., according to the Energy Information Administration.

The only diesels Detroit automakers offer are heavy-duty pickups, but they plan to expand to light full-size pickups in the next couple of years, Mr. Omotoso said.

In 2010, Ford Motor Co. will start offering a clean-diesel version of its light-duty F-150 pickup but not of small cars, a spokesman said. "We are focusing on EcoBoost in the U.S.," he said, referring to Ford's new direct-injection turbo engines, which offer better performance and fuel economy.

Ford would have to charge too much for small diesel cars here because the engines are made in Europe, and the exchange rate boosts the cost here, Mr. Omotoso said.

BMW started beating the drums for its Advanced Diesel with BluePerformance engine a year ago with out-of-home and print ads in influencer magazines such as Smithsonian. GSD&M Idea City, Austin, Texas, handles that push. BMW is also readying a diesel microsite, created by Dotglu, New York, to help dispel misperceptions.

Mr. Pitney said BMW's education push is working, citing the fact that diesel has been among the top 10 search terms on bmwusa.com in the year since the ads started.

Mercedes-Benz USA is rolling out print ads in October titles for the G-Class, R-Class and M-Class with its second-generation BlueTec diesel, carrying the theme "Blue is the new green." Merkley & Partners, New York, handles that push, which touts safety and saving when it comes to fuel, money and the environment, Mr. Cannon said. "Even in a tough economy like we have now, you've got to give people rational reasons to buy," he said.

The first-generation BlueTec, which was first marketed in 2006 as part of the E-Class line, could be sold in only 43 states due to stricter emissions rules elsewhere. Mercedes-Benz also introduced an earlier-generation diesel, the CDI, in its three trucks in late 2007.

Mr. Cannon said the brand's diesel penetration in the 43 states is nearly 20%. But Mercedes "is almost starting from scratch in California" with the new diesels, since it hasn't been able to sell the older diesel models in that major car market for almost a decade.

The BlueTec campaign will also include online this year and events next year. The marketer recently started letting Hollywood stars such as Ms. Bullock and Mr. Dempsey use the new BlueTec models.

Mercedes' new diesel will be sold at a "very small premium" compared with hybrid models, Mr. Cannon said, and will deliver between 20% and 40% improved fuel economy, with highway drivers getting the benefit at the higher end. And whereas it could take six to seven years for gas savings to make up for the higher price of a hybrid, Mr. Cannon said, buyers of the new BlueTec models will break even in half that time.

 

Then they'll move on to outlawing farts.