Well. I dont HATE them, but seems with all the new diesels that the electronics are doing more harm than good . It seems all 3 brands have a motor that will last at least 200k miles; but all the darn electronics on them crap out every 50k miles making them more troublesome than they should be. Fords having buttloads of electronic problems with the 6.0, the d-max has plenty of problems, and seems even the new cummins has injection pump/LP problems. WHATS THE DEAL??? Why cant they all just be mechanical; or at least reliable even if they are electronic? Almost 200k miles on my truck, original lift and injection pump. I dont think i will ever sell this truck. I could rebuild everything on it and still be ahead of a new truck money/reliability wise. The 12 valve cummins was bullet proof(mechanical injection), the 6.9/7.3 IDI's had no real problems except for cavitation(mechanical), and even the 6.2, and some 6.5 chevy's(mechanical) didnt have any real problems unless it was with the motor itself. It seems we are just moving backwards with the new diesels. All of them are getting worse fuel mileage, and less reliable, and you cant hardly work on them yourself. This was not meant as a bash, as i believe dodge has done pretty good with the new CTD, and i love my buddies 06, but i just dont understand why they cant get around these electrical problems they all 3 seem to have. This is not to say i wouldnt buy a new Cummins at all, but it just seems to me they should be able to do better. Guess this is just my 3:00am vent . What do you guys think?

Eric

 

Electronics have thier place and it is nice to have variable timing (injection pump timing), they can be troublesome at times. I really liked my older vehicles, and 84 F150 and a 90 F150. The 84 was simple to work on, and the 90 did have fuel injection and the computer and sensors and such. A $30 code reader took care of the computer side and me still working the mechanic side of things.

I do like them and I don't like them sometimes. However I am an elctronics tech in the Coast Guard and have to deal with troublesome radios and equipment that gives goofy readings and fault codes and errors. So I adapted and just take it in stride.

 

Welcome to a brave new world. Electronics is the only way for engines (diesels included) to meet emission requirements. Granted, electronics can be troublesome sometimes, but overall it's pretty reliable. Most issues I have seen has been with the sensors, wiring and or the wiring connectors.
A lot of the Ford 6.0 issues was bad injectors and computer programming.

MikeyB

 

Try to imagine a mechanical system that would do everything that is accomplished with the electronic. I agree it can be a hassle but mainly because they are not supported(tech support, not bras) properly.

Randy

 

Ahh good ol electronics....guess I should be celebrating because mine made it over the 50k threshold you established.
Remember electronics made it possible for you to post your rant on this board. You didn't type that message on a typewriter did ya??
Emissions. Power. Lift pumps aren't electronic. They are electric.
Ford is having problems. Dodge seems to be doing quite well.
Drive a tuned sports car with VVT. You will fall in love with electronics.
*ring ring ring* hold on got to answer my electronic cell phone.

 

can't go wrong with the good ole 12 vavle, easy power gains, and outragous amounts of torque, its the only thing i have every worked on, but i am told that its bout the easiest thing to work on...

 

I think the problem lies in finding a technician that has good troubleshooting skills when it comes to the latest electronics.They are out there but few and far between,usually a dealer is not going to spend the time to diagnose an intermittent electrical problem which is the case a lot of times, so you are just SOL until it completely shutsdown and leaves you stranded.The old 12 V while run forever

 

The problem is the bottom line. The big three are more interested in making a cheaper product than they are making a product that can be easily maintained. It is called "Designed Obsolesence". The EPA and consumer demand for luxury are causing some of the problems along with the fact that no one can possibly stay ahead of electronic developments and still have the time to go to work. Then comes the tree huggers. They rant and rave that the earth is dying so our politions pass laws that look good on paper and cost more so they can get reelected. The catylitic converter is prime example. They can not work as designed until they are at operating temperature and in heavy traffic, where they are needed most, they fail. Now that I have gotten that off my chest,,,,,,,,,GOOD MORNING!

 

Ur right on that

I used to have an old 1983 F 150 4x4, 4 speed, 4wd, with a 300 inline six cylinder. That was just as easy as my 12V to work on...

Tx

 

Being older than dirt, I well remember the 57 to about 62 Chev Rochester fuel injections. I had a 283 hp 57 chev so equiped and worked on many others. This was entirely mechanical FI. The high pressure pump was driven off the distributor with a cable drive similar to a speedometer cable. You needed 4 or 5 of these inthe glove box for spares as not every dealer carried them or even knew what they were. You needed a timing light as you needed to twist the dist to install the cable properly. The pump diaphram leaked frequently so you needed several of these too. The fuel filters got plugged all the time so a couple of these to replace along the road side. Trying to clean the tiny injector nozzles with out damaging them was an exercize in patience. Out inthe middle of nowhere was not fun. You needed plenty of carb cleaner in the trunk. Tuning the injector required a manomometer which was hard to get. It was delicate so you didn't just throw it inthe trunk. Next a full set of manuals...no cd's or DTR to help. Forget about going to a dealer. They didn't know anything then either. You also needed a set of ignition points and condenser. I made my own dual point conversion so I had 2 sets. A dist cap and rotor too. Coils didn't go bad too often but it didn't hurt to have a good one along. Of course a set of spark plugs was mandantory. A nice big tarp to throw over the hood area while you were working kept out some of the cold in the winter and the sand and rain in the summer. I also carried a pair of axels and a ring and pinion and a set of spider gears or a whole pig for the rear end. A spare syncronizer for the 3 speed and a clutch disc. This pretty well covered the emergency things you needed. 75 to 100 pounds of tools in the trunk pretty well assured you were equipped to handle anything. There wasn't any electronics on these..even the radio had a mechanical vibrator in it...we carried a spsre of these too.

Sat mornings was usually spent rounding up replacement parts for those used over the last week.

If you managed to put 15k miles on a year back them you were on the road or beside it constantly.

In the end the electronics have made hotrodding and cruising our trucks a lot more fun. They can be frustrating when they fail and expensive but they sure are a lot easier to replace. Back inthe Jurassic age you didn't just go buy a new injector....you overhauled it yourself...along side the road. There was no AAA either.

 

hey guys, this is kinda on the same point, well, i am an electical engineering major at Texas Tech and i have been around computers and other electronics all my life, i have also been around cars and trucks, so i know the mechanical and electrical side. from my experiene electronics can hae a tendency to "randomly" go bad or just act funny without any reason. mechanical parts work fine as long as you take care of them. electrical parts are less durable because of things like spikes in voltage and the materials are VERY wimpy. if there is a way to do something mechanically there is no reason to switch to an electric part. I was watching a special about the Enzo farrari and they said "it is the most technalogically advanced car in the world," but the guy test driving it said "the computer takes all of the manual controll away from you, if you oversteer it compensates" he also said that "the f40 is much more fun to drive because nothing is computer controlled, it doesn't even have power steering"

makes sense to me

 

Imagine how an F-117 pilot feels. Without electronics the jet won't even fly. Now that's a scary thought.

Can't say I feel strongly one way or another but I do LOVE my truck.

 

At least we are still steering our trucks mechanically, and almost stopping them mechanically (ABS makes it about 70/30 electronic),
and if the electronics fail, we just coast to the side of the road, we don't need to ignite a couple rocket boosters under our bottoms.


phox

 

You guys all have your points, and like i said. I use plenty of electronics every day just like the rest of you; and they definatley have their place, but i kind of am on the same line of thinking as PanteraGSTK in thinking that "if there is a way to do something mechanically there is no reason to switch to an electric part". And im not by any means saying all electronics will fail, but compare the electronic injection pumps on the newer trucks to the one on a 12 valve. Which one is clearly more reliable? I do like electronic stuff, and think it's sweet to be able to plug in a box, and turn it from 0 to 150hp or whatever, but I just think 90% of the time a mechanical part will give less trouble, and last longer than an electronic part. It does seem to me that most all the new gasser trucks are very reliable as far as electronics go, but they have been improving on them for a while now. I think the diesels will get much better over time, but it is going to take just that....time. I just mainly wanted to see what you guys thought about the subject.

Eric

 

Good points, although when it's working, an F-117 gets you to work pretty fast. Not sure it can tow...