4th Gen Engine and Drivetrain-2010 and Up 6.7 liter Engine and Drivetrain discussion only. PLEASE, NO HIGH PERFORMANCE DISCUSSION!

Ram, Ford, Chevy Dyno

Old 05-26-2018, 09:06 AM
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Ram, Ford, Chevy Dyno

This has been out there for awhile. Gonna try to post this link. There are many other subjects at TFL TRUCK on their YouTube page. I think Ram should quit playing games with Ford and Chevy and just put Hauler engine in the truck. The Marine Application for the 6.7 Cummins is 580 hp. Never seen a Powerchoke or a
Maxie Pad in a Class A RV.

Dave

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Old 05-28-2018, 10:50 AM
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CoastalDav:

I had seen the video you posted prior to today.

I realize that DTR is more of a "Dodge CTD" website and I have owned four (4) of them since 1992 and still own my 1996 Dodge CTD 12 valve.

However, in 2015 I bought a new 2014 Ford Super Duty 6.7 Diesel Lariat XLT which I still have. The truck now has over 75,000 trouble-free miles. I know that many members here don't like the Ford or the Chevy Diesel Pickups referring to the Ford as "Powerchokes" or whatever. After owning my 2014 Super Duty for three years now, I have to tell you and the other DTR Members here that Ford builds a good diesel pickup!

In my opinion, the front ends, the transmissions and the interiors and FAR superior to ANYTHING Dodge makes now! I also would NOT put up with that 67,000 mile "service" on cleaning out the EGR system on the new 4th Gen Dodges! I have helped two of my friends do it and it is a NASTY dang job!
I don't have to do it on my Super Duty because Ford puts an EGR system on their diesel trucks that is about three times the size/volume of what the 4th Gen Dodge 6.7 Diesels have!

Finally, you mentioned NOT ever seeing a Ford 6.7 Super Duty Diesel in front of a Class A Motorhome. Well, I have seen quite a few of them and will try to get a picture or link up here of that.

----------
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Old 05-28-2018, 05:37 PM
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I put a lot of miles on my Rams.
2016 has 210,xxx now.
owned 25 to date since 1990
Will be looking at a Ford for consideration as next truck.
Friend has a 2011 Ford with 1.2 million kilometers on it.
Had issues with the Def freezing and thats it.
Iím putting a new trans in my truck this week because the internal transmission cooler leaked and cross contaminated the engine and transmission.
Water Soluble glue on the pucks in the torque converter donít like antifreeze/water.

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Old 05-29-2018, 09:43 AM
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Scotty, good to hear you may be considering a Ford Super Duty. You are one member here (like me) that I know has put the Dodge CTD Pickups through a lot and have seen their weaknesses. As you pointed out the Dodge CTD transmissions are a definite problem area and I don't care if it is a 47RH, 47RE, 48RE, or a 68RFE. Any of them HAVE to be upgraded BEFORE you add ANY upgrade in power. Anyway, thanks for your reply buddy!
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Old 05-29-2018, 06:38 PM
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Originally Posted by John_P View Post
...

However, in 2015 I bought a new 2014 Ford Super Duty 6.7 Diesel Lariat XLT which I still have. The truck now has over 75,000 trouble-free miles.... After owning my 2014 Super Duty for three years now, I have to tell you and the other DTR Members here that Ford builds a good diesel pickup!


John_P
We're really lucky to live in a golden age of diesel trucks right now. There really isn't a "bad" diesel pickup out there right now among the new ones. That said, as you know 75,000 miles is just getting started. I hope you never have to work on the engine, as you know you'll have to take it to the dealer and have them pull the cab. Things like interior and styling is subjective, but all the press I read puts the Ram in 1st place there. I think the dealership experience drives a lot of sales and customer satisfaction. This variable isn't manufacturer-specific. The 68RFE tranny and the AISIN will hang with the "Allison" in the GM, and either is better than the Ford tranny. I pull trailers at work with all three brands. The guys are always fighting over the keys to Ram, especially when they need to tow. Better ride, handling, more responsive exhaust brake and most of all that legendary Cummins torque.

But like I say, they are all great (or "good" as you put it when referring to the Ford) trucks. If you're going to get a new one every five years or so it doesn't matter which one you get. Go with cost of ownership (Rams sure hold their value) and dealership experience. Can't really go wrong with any of them until you have to pull the cab to work on the Ford. Check out the other forums (e.g. the Dieselstop) and see what people are complaining about. Sorry for the ramble, but that's my two bits.
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Old 05-29-2018, 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by SOhappy View Post
We're really lucky to live in a golden age of diesel trucks right now. There really isn't a "bad" diesel pickup out there right now among the new ones. That said, as you know 75,000 miles is just getting started. I hope you never have to work on the engine, as you know you'll have to take it to the dealer and have them pull the cab. Things like interior and styling is subjective, but all the press I read puts the Ram in 1st place there. I think the dealership experience drives a lot of sales and customer satisfaction. This variable isn't manufacturer-specific. The 68RFE tranny and the AISIN will hang with the "Allison" in the GM, and either is better than the Ford tranny. I pull trailers at work with all three brands. The guys are always fighting over the keys to Ram, especially when they need to tow. Better ride, handling, more responsive exhaust brake and most of all that legendary Cummins torque.

But like I say, they are all great (or "good" as you put it when referring to the Ford) trucks. If you're going to get a new one every five years or so it doesn't matter which one you get. Go with cost of ownership (Rams sure hold their value) and dealership experience. Can't really go wrong with any of them until you have to pull the cab to work on the Ford. Check out the other forums (e.g. the Dieselstop) and see what people are complaining about. Sorry for the ramble, but that's my two bits.
--------------------------------------------------
SOhappy:

Well, I was wondering how long it would take one of our DTR Members to get in here and start running the Ford Super Duty 6.7 Diesels down as compared to the 4th Gen Dodge CTD CR 6.7. And since you are the first, let me "refute" some of your statements.

#1.) While my 2014 Ford Super Duty is only at 75,000 miles I have several friends with the 2011 through 2013's that are well over 200,000 miles. One of my buddies does "hotshot" hauling with his and he is close to 300,000 miles. And while you are right about the cabs having to be removed to do a "total rebuild" there are shops that can do that and do it in about the same amount of time that it takes them to pull a Cummins 6.7 out through the top on a 4th Gen Dodge.

#2.) I don't know what "press" you are talking about as far as the Ford vs Dodge interiors, but I have owned four (4) Dodge CTD Pickups and have had trouble with the interiors in ALL of them! The cracked dashboards are WELL documented in the 2nd and 3rd Gen Dodge CTD Pickups and in my opinion the front ends are JUNK! My 2014 Ford is still nice and tight after 75,000 miles where the front end on my old 2006 Dodge CTD CR had to be completely REBUILT at 34,000 miles after severe "death wobble!"

#3.) Lets discuss this statement you made:
"The 68RFE tranny and the AISIN will hang with the "Allison" in the GM, and either is better than the Ford tranny. I pull trailers at work with all three brands."

REALLY????

While I am glad you have had good luck with your Dodge CTD CR Transmissions, in my opinion the Aisin is alright but the 68RFE is NOWHERE near built as tough as a 6R140 in the Ford or the Allison 1000 in the Duramax. Last year, I had the opportunity at my transmission builder's shop
(ATS Diesel Performance) to see a 68RFE torn down right next to a Ford 6R140. I can tell you without a doubt that the Ford Transmission internals are much better than any of the internals in the 68RFE. The input, output and intermediate shafts are also MUCH larger in the Ford 6R140 than they are in the 68RFE. If you don't believe this, go check it out yourself. Any of the lead transmission shops (ATS, Suncoast, Goerend, BD) will tell you the same thing! ALL of the transmissions in my Dodge CTD Pickups had to be rebuilt to handle as little as 50 H.P. more without slipping the clutches in those trannies and that is a fact Sir!

#4.) You also said this: "Go with cost of ownership (Rams sure hold their value) and dealership experience."

REALLY????

Dealership experience here is that if you do ANYTHING to the new 2018 Dodge CTD CR Pickups including even adding an "Edge CTS" to monitor EGT's, regens, coolant temps etc. dealers here in my area will absolutely VOID your warranty! The Ford Dealers are not near that strict.

So,......you and I have very different opinions about these trucks and that is fine. But I want the members to know the new 4th Gen Dodge CTD CR Pickups are NOT the "best" in all areas as many here believe. I say,.......
"To each his own......"
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Old 05-30-2018, 01:31 PM
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Old 05-30-2018, 04:12 PM
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John, my 2007 had 780,000 miles on the untouched stock 68RFE that ran with a Smarty on SW 3 for over 600,000 of those miles. The only service I did was filters every 60-80k miles. I never once flushed it.

Maybe I was lucky on that one. My 2012 had hard shifting but I flushed it.

Iím learning that the Ďflushí with the pump system does not come recommended.

I also determined that my 16 Ramís internal transcooler wasnít able to handle something I did.
-30 outside, cold start, stuck in deep snow, rocked the truck and trailer hard and lots from D to R in 4x4 for a looong time.
Trans fluid like tar, intense demands and I believe this is when it went poof. Which means I drove it for three months before the hard shifts showed up, pink trans fluid (diluted with coolant) and then the foam in engine overflow bottle.
I had flushed the coolant and the transmission prior to getting stuck.

I think the trans did well in spite of my dummy move. lol

Iím still looking at a Ford when its time to consider a new truck. May even look at a GMC.
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Old 05-30-2018, 09:54 PM
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Originally Posted by John_P View Post
CoastalDav:

I had seen the video you posted prior to today.

I realize that DTR is more of a "Dodge CTD" website and I have owned four (4) of them since 1992 and still own my 1996 Dodge CTD 12 valve.

However, in 2015 I bought a new 2014 Ford Super Duty 6.7 Diesel Lariat XLT which I still have. The truck now has over 75,000 trouble-free miles. I know that many members here don't like the Ford or the Chevy Diesel Pickups referring to the Ford as "Powerchokes" or whatever. After owning my 2014 Super Duty for three years now, I have to tell you and the other DTR Members here that Ford builds a good diesel pickup!

In my opinion, the front ends, the transmissions and the interiors and FAR superior to ANYTHING Dodge makes now! I also would NOT put up with that 67,000 mile "service" on cleaning out the EGR system on the new 4th Gen Dodges! I have helped two of my friends do it and it is a NASTY dang job!
I don't have to do it on my Super Duty because Ford puts an EGR system on their diesel trucks that is about three times the size/volume of what the 4th Gen Dodge 6.7 Diesels have!

Finally, you mentioned NOT ever seeing a Ford 6.7 Super Duty Diesel in front of a Class A Motorhome. Well, I have seen quite a few of them and will try to get a picture or link up here of that.

----------
John_P
John....

Almost anything can make it to 75k miles nowadays......with even minimal servicing.

Since this is an open forum, for all of us to share experiences, I shall toss in a few of mine in rebuttal to a few of your statements in regards to my 2014 RAM 3500 Tradesman Crew Cab 4x4 w/AS69RC....
  • The front ends are much more robust since the 2013 MY 3500s and 2014 2500s came out. My 14 only needed unit bearings (really only one, I replaced both) at 269k miles. When traded at 362k miles, all steering components and ball joints were OEM. I achieved 154k miles on a set of Bridgestone R500 HDs on those same front end components.
  • The 67,500 mile maintenance only requires replacement of the CCV filter as of the 2013 & newer (DEF version) model years. Under $70 shipped for an OEM Fleetguard unit from Amazon, and about thirty minutes are all that are required.

One commonality we do share is the praise of the FoMoCo transmission. Additionally....like any of the others, they will take a dump after extra power is tossed at them during the long term.

My AS69RC never skipped a beat the entire 362k miles, even whilst grossing upwards of 34k GCW. Shifted as good at 362k when I threw it in park for the last time at trade in time as it did when I took it out of park with 14 miles on the odometer....




Comparison of 2nd GEN interior issues to trucks within the last 5 model years is NOT a fair comparison. Likewise.....comparison of 3rd GEN front end components to those of a 13 / 14 4th GEN RAM is not even fair.
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Old 05-31-2018, 07:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Scotty View Post
John, my 2007 had 780,000 miles on the untouched stock 68RFE that ran with a Smarty on SW 3 for over 600,000 of those miles. The only service I did was filters every 60-80k miles. I never once flushed it.

Maybe I was lucky on that one. My 2012 had hard shifting but I flushed it.

I’m learning that the ‘flush’ with the pump system does not come recommended.

I also determined that my 16 Ram’s internal transcooler wasn’t able to handle something I did.
-30 outside, cold start, stuck in deep snow, rocked the truck and trailer hard and lots from D to R in 4x4 for a looong time.
Trans fluid like tar, intense demands and I believe this is when it went poof. Which means I drove it for three months before the hard shifts showed up, pink trans fluid (diluted with coolant) and then the foam in engine overflow bottle.
I had flushed the coolant and the transmission prior to getting stuck.

I think the trans did well in spite of my dummy move. lol

I’m still looking at a Ford when its time to consider a new truck. May even look at a GMC.
-------------------------------------
Thanks for the report Scotty!

I know there are many DTR Members that have great service from their Dodge CTD CR Transmissions. But for other members, such as SOhappy to come in here and declare that the Ford 6R140 does not measure up to anything Dodge makes is just wrong and you and I both know that! Typical DTR "bashing" of any other brand than Dodge! I know you remember the old "tranny" and oil wars" we had here a few years ago!

I have been surprised that there have been as many of our DTR Members that have reported issues with both the 68RFE AND the Aisin! After seeing that 68RFE torn down next to the Ford 6R140 I have to tell you Scotty that I was not too impressed with the internals on that 68RFE! But, you know I respect what you have done with these trucks but I also know you do all your maintenance too.
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Old 05-31-2018, 07:17 PM
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Mr Brockman:

Glad to hear you have had good service with your trucks and transmissions.

Like any brand while you have good service, many DTR Members HAVE NOT! And that is why I posted those links for other members here to see to get "both sides of the story."

And while you say the newer 4th Gen trucks have better interiors and front ends I'm sorry, but I just do not agree with your Sir and that is based on many of my friends who own the 2015-2017 models! While the front ends are somewhat better, there are still issues with them including the dreaded "death wobble" and that is pretty well documented. I also have to say that Fiat/Chrysler has pretty much "copied" the Ford Super Duty front end design with the exception that the Dodge control arm is somewhat shorter than the one on the Ford Super Duties so that is probably why they are better now!

Finally, I mentioned to all of you that I have friends that "hotshot" the Ford Super Duty Diesels and many of those trucks are up around the mileage many of the 4th Gen Dodge CTD CR 6.7 Cummins are.
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Old 05-31-2018, 08:05 PM
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Iíd be interested in knowing what percentage of 2013 & newer 3500ís and 2014 & newer 2500ís with ďdeath wobbleĒ were induced with cheap leveling kits, K-Mart shocks, and Sears tires.

Additionally......I know several owners that are more than delighted with the robustness and significant improvement of the newer 4th GEN Chassis/steering components......and those owners were previous generation owners, having been there / done that in regards to front end woes.
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Old 06-02-2018, 07:27 PM
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One other big issue with the new 2017-2018 Dodge CTD CR 6.7 Cummins Engines is the BIG recall Fiat/Chrysler issued for the water pumps starting on fire! One friend of mine had it happen to him on I-95 in Florida in his 2017 and he had to use a small fire extinguisher to put the fire out!
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Old 06-07-2018, 07:34 PM
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SOhappy:

While we all know you LOVE your new 4th Gen Dodge CTD CR Pickup things didn't look too good for you a few months ago:

https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...0/#post3349289

Is that your 4th Gen I see on the back of a rollback wrecker??? That is why I try to let our DTR Members know of some of the problems on these new 4th Gen's!
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Old 06-15-2018, 09:13 AM
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I am reopening this thread, lets all try to act like gentlemen shall we?
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