We don't have any info on our own test trucks with stocker turbos, however we do have 2 customers that do some testing with us with 5" exhaust, Ram Air IIIs and brand new PowerMax CRs. No numbers yet, I can think I can safely say that the EGTs at 5/5 or even 4/4 will NOT be as low as the Banks kit full out, especially since we're seeing at least 150F more EGT than you are, and we're running KSB1Bs. We really feel that there is a place for pressure increase on these trucks, alongside of the duration and timing.

If we can convince one of our testers to relinquish control of our Edge EZ , we plan on doing some pressure-duration-timing tests. I'm sure we can pull another 40 HP minimum with the KSB1Bs, and still be safe on EGTs.

Rod

 

Pushrod,

What horsepower can the stock clutch on a 03 HO CTD 6 speed mixer handle? I am looking at achieving HP in the low 400's, but would like to be able to step up.
I am considering replacing a Diesel Dynamics True Torque box with the TST box as it will have plenty of headroom for upgrades as both my pocket book and towing loads increase. Initially I will be at the lower settings and as I make mods and increase towing loads will step up to higher settings. I don't realistically forsee going to 9/9.
L8r,...........dogger

 

Let me check against the consensus opinion on this board: There is general agreement that Mark Chappel and his guys are speaking falsely when they say they have two trucks, a 2003 and 2004 that will run on 9/9 with just transmission modes and a pusher pump.

They are speaking speculatively and extrapolating from dyno-driven data. In the real world, we are going to need a big turbo or twins, o-ringed heads, injectors, intake, exhaust modifications to use the power.

I dont know squat about diesel mechanics, so I want to make sure that those who do know are supporting me when I call TST up and confront them with their mendacity.

 

Thinking of Blue Chip - Attitude (if they get it for 04.5) - or CR.
Scotty II or AFE & tube.
Input anyone?

 

the 3rd gen stock clutch will start to let go at 380 HP. Its better then the 2dn gens but will still need to be addressed.

 

hey scotty, 380HP at what rpm? torque is what kills clutches, and of course if you mean 380 HP at 2900 this is under 700 ft lbs. But 380 HP at 2200 rpm is over 900 ft lbs.

 

Let me check against the consensus opinion on this board: There is general agreement that Mark Chappel and his guys are speaking falsely when they say they have two trucks, a 2003 and 2004 that will run on 9/9 with just transmission modes and a pusher pump.

They are speaking speculatively and extrapolating from dyno-driven data. In the real world, we are going to need a big turbo or twins, o-ringed heads, injectors, intake, exhaust modifications to use the power.

I dont know squat about diesel mechanics, so I want to make sure that those who do know are supporting me when I call TST up and confront them with their mendacity.

 

About using bigger injectors with the Tst module - unless im missing something it seems that the guys running big injectors are having more egt problems - more turbo problems ie - blowing up !

I think that a small pressure box added would be the better answer for more power - better fuel burn do to higher fuel rail pressure. Is that basically what the speed loader on the banks box is for - it ups the fuel rail pressure. - Maybe Im wrong.

 

TST told me that they saw upgraded injector setups having more problems with EGTs and turbos crapping out.

 

2300 to be precise as per Peter at Southbend.
These 3rd gens sure can generate the HP and Torque easily.

 

We'll see all sorts of failures and successes with this engine before some good combinations are proven and reliable.

I am seeking good reliable power in the 500-550 HP range with lots of bottom end and mid range useable torque.

I think the injectors, pressure/pulse box and bigger turbo or compounds will be the way to go. I am not keen on timing if its too agressive.
However, the cam might be adequate but will need to be changed out sooner then on the 2nd gen VP-44 trucks.

I am currently doing some testing on lots of stuff.
I have noticed that the manifold pressures are able to go higher before head gasket failure...so far we have not blown the gasket where it would have on the HO VP-44 trucks.

Other limitations that might occur could be the common rail, the injector lines themselves, the cam, exhaust manifold, intercooler and the intake...even the RAM AIR 3 might be limited after 500 HP.
I have already addressed that with a radical intake that I will be fitting this week.

We already know the HY-35 is a good turbo up to a point.

There is a definate bottleneck in this design and I think its the cam as well as the late injection.

Fuel delivery requires a simple improvement to maintain supply too.

 

Everyone is saying that the problem with the CR's and especially the 600's is that the injector timing is way too late, good for emmisions, bad for power/EGT's.

I have not bought a box yet because I feel I'm still in "break-in" phase at 5000 miles, but the TST really looks tempting as the only real choice for timing/duration. If the injector timing is retarded, (like the engineers that decided to burn MORE fuel to decrease emissions), then the TST box is a natural.

I just have to do a little soul searching after reading Push Rod's opening dissertation which I feel is right on the mark. Can I keep myself from going above 5x5 on a stock truck? Am I willing to upgrade exhaust and intake. Yes! Do I want to upgrade the trans and turbo anytime soon? definitely not. I already have the gauges to be a responsible power monger but,.....do I have the self control.......... That there be the real question.

As a side note, I'm thinking the TST w/ gauges, (as a back-up), wired to reside in the console would be very awesome indeed!

Fred

 

1) Well, yes and no. Yes, they were able to generate the power they say they were, and the temps were probably not all that bad either. But it wasn't on the street. It was on a dyno. Many, if not all, of the manufacturers utilize load dynos, and will often quote EGT figures based on load-dynos. This is not just a "TST thing"

2) I wouldn't do that if I were you. TST feels that they can drive EGTs higher on a load type dyno than a driver can on the street. I feel they are in error with this kind of thinking, and I've debated it with them before. We just agreed to disagree, and left it at that. Any further debate would be kind of pointless at this stage in the game. You know what the box willl do, and how it will behave and can now make your choices accordingly.

RadRam,

Injectors with the TST box on 9x9 is currently a bad news scenario, at least with the combos we've tested. We've already got too much fuel in the cylinders, too late, so opening up the injectors isn't going to buy you much. Now, if the box is left turned down, and injectors added, it may be a nice combination, as you can get more fuel in, earlier, kind of like a pressure box. Personally, we'll be testing a pressure box stack with the PowerMax before we look to injectors.

Rod

 

Push Rod,

Thanks for the good advice. I have talked with Mark before and respect TST as a company. The person I talked with at TST told me they were using these boxes on the street and "implied" that it was the same setup that they dynoed.

It is hard to believe that Mark did drive a truck with the box for a few months prior to release of the product. If so, he would certainly have noticed some of the problems.

My background is science. I like data based decisions and analysis. In lew of that, real world experience (trial and error) should provide us with some answers to the EGT problems.

Is Mark working on a fix for the EGT issue? I just tend to trust people. When a TST tech says they have been driving a 2003 with stock everything accept transmission and pusher pump and not having any problems, I believe him. I also believe that people who post on this site are telling the truth.

So you can see why I am confused.

 

1) I have no doubt that they are driving the truck on the street, in the exact same configuration that they dyno tested. They may even be driving it on the street in 9x9 mode, but likely have the defueling setup, so they can get brief bursts of 9x9 power, until the box defuels.

2) Actually, there is no real "problem" per se. Those of us with performance shops asked TST to deliver us a box with monster fueling, **** all the torpedos. They have done exactly what we've asked of them, now its up to us to figger out how to use it. As for the code issues, TSTs test trucks were running just fine a few months ago with no codes. However, Dodge appears to have a variety of ECM/PCM versions out there, so until the box hit the street, it would have been nearly impossible for TST to know this.

3) TST is constantly refining the programs on these boxes. I've went through 4 different programs, and with each successive change, we've seen some real nice improvements with regards to drivability and EGTs. Will TST be able to get a monster fueling box that won't create high EGTs? No chance. Its up to us to find the combination of parts to make use of the fuel.

Rod