j

Now that I have my off road project running, I will be towing in the mountains more. Looking to cool things off on the grades. I can add a little power with water/meth, which is the direction I am leaning, but are there any negatives other than cost of fluid? I started reading the post above, but it appeared to get into debates over opinion, and some of the "links" don't work..

Question is, am I better off with an intercooler or injection? Or is it just a matter of opinion to do one over the other?

Which, if any, water/meth kit comes with an intake horn with ports? And which is best for cost/value?

John_P

J:

Let me see if I can help you out with your questions about water injection vs intercoolers etc.

I don't know if you read the thread in this section titled: "Water Injection" but here is a link to it in case that is NOT the thread you were talking about:

https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...ection-248415/

Myself and other DTR Members on here gave ALOT of input on this subject in that thread which should help you, although I think some of the companies listed there may be gone now. Here is a link to one company that I KNOW is still doing a good job with the water injection systems for our Dodge Trucks. Here is the link to their company Sir:

Snow Performance-The Water-Methanol Injection Experts

For your information, I have been successfully running water injection in my 1996 Dodge CTD 12 valve for many years now. I actually started with the "Snow Performance Water Injection System" first, but had to go to a more radical system as my horsepower continued to go up. I have said before that the "Snow Water Systems" work very well as long as you are not WAY UP on H.P. In my opinion,.....the trouble they have in high horsepower trucks is the water pumps can't keep up with the demand. Most all of their water pumps are about 200-250psi pumps, very similar to the water pumps used in RV applications. As more heat (EGT's) is added, you need to add more nozzles.
As you add more nozzles, your pressure starts to drop and the "atomization" of the water gets poor. In testing on my truck, I saw this clearly and ended up going to a 800+ psi system from "Scheid Diesel" which would probably be
"overkill" for what you are looking for Sir.

As far as aftermarket intercoolers, they do work better than the stock intercoolers but personally I do not think it is substantial for the amount of money you have to pay one. I also have an aftermarket/oversized intercooler in my 1996 Dodge CTD and had it in there BEFORE I added the Snow Water System. Did it help?? Yes, it helped some, but in my opinion it was nowhere near what the water injection systems were able to do as far as keeping EGT's in check.

You mention in your post about "cost/value' for these systems. You can buy the system and use plain old distilled water which is very cheap. The methanol is added mainly for more power, but it not needed for cooling effect.
In my 1996 Dodge CTD, I don't even run the methanol in my water as I mainly need the water for cooling my EGT's. However, you will need to run a "rust preventative" in with the water (such as "Number 13" from NAPA) to keep the intake from developing rust.

I don't really see a "downside' to the water injection systems and will be glad to help you with any questions you have Sir.

Good luck!

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John_P

John_P

J:

You also asked about how the water injector nozzles are placed in our trucks.
Go to PAGE #14 in that "Water Injection" Thread I linked and you can see how some of the DTR Members plumbed their systems.

All of my water injection nozzles are machined right into my cylinder head but that is not needed for what you are trying to do.

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John_P

soulezoo

I will second all of what Mr. P said above.

I want to emphasize that you'll see a bigger difference with the water injection than the intercooler.

I know of no water injection system that comes with the air intake horn. However, there are a number of them out there that come pre-tapped to accept the spray nozzles. I have been using the CFM+ many years now myself.

madhat

While I agree with these gentlemen, and they are much more knowledgeable than me... I used water/meth and learned later that it can be a band-aid instead of a fix... twins/correctly sized turbo chargers would have been a better fix for me.

If you're not familiar with water injection, know that under low RPM and high EGT situations, you can put the fire out (too much water) and possibly hydro-lock a cylinder.

As far as your comment about the cost of the fluid, you don't specifically need to run methanol to achieve your cooling... straight water will work. If you want to use methanol, try purchasing Heet gas line dryer in the yellow bottle, it's close to 99% methanol.

Water injection is a great tool, and may be exactly what you need... just do some reading first!

j

I would love do swap turbos and do twins but the smog ****'s here is CA won't allow it. Will probably go with water kit.. is there an advantage to running straight methanol? Or any drawbacks? For when I'm not towing..I know there is a slight hp advantage combining water and meth, but can straight methanol be used without problems and how much hp advantage? If anyone knows

John_P

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J:

Yes, you can run "straight methanol" but I DO NOT recommend it Sir! I know there are guys that do it, BUT,.....methanol is a fuel and burns just like your #2 diesel fuel does. It can cause higher cylinder pressures and I know some of my friends that have blown head gaskets by running straight methanol.

If you go back and read my posts in that LONG "Water Methanol" Thread I posted for you above, you will read how I had "detonation" issues with
methanol on my 1996 Dodge CTD 12 valve. Now granted, the older Dodge CTD 12 valve engines have "fixed" timing, whereas your Dodge CTD CR truck has "variable timing." That helps, but it does not entirely eliminate that
"detonation" problem I covered in that thread. Basically, "detonation" with
methanol sounds like "spark ping/knock" in a gas engine. I found that the more methanol I added the WORSE the "detonation" became.

So,....you can run "straight methanol" but as I said,.....I don't recommend it
especially if you have stock headbolts!

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John_P

j

It was more of a curiousity than an intent. Thanks for all the help.. Injectable it is!

John_P

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J:

Sorry Sir,....I didn't intend to sound "mean" in my response to you. You are welcome on the help and let me know if there is anything else I can do for you.
As you can probably see by now, there are quite a few "opinions" on water injection for our trucks and I know that not all members necessarily agree
with me. But, with that being said, "trial and error" and alot of experience with WI on my 1996 Dodge CTD 12 valve drag truck has helped
me alot.

Good luck to you.

madhat

I agree with you, John!!!

John_P

------------------------------------------------
Thanks Mark! I just hope everything we have posted here has
helped "J" some. I know when I got started with water injection it was darn
confusing and there was less info then than there is now, although the old truck sled pullers along with Scheid Diesel helped me ALOT!

j

I did not take that as mean at all, very informative... I was just stating my reason for asking about straight methanol. . More curiosity than anything. .. will be looking at water/meth kits and an intake horn swap. Thank you very much for the info.

MikeyB

Looking at the OP sig I noticed he's running a Hypertech. Personally I would ditch the Hypertech for a Smarty before even thinking about running juice.

Methanol has a positive timing effect on diesels, too much isn't a good thing and could pop a head gasket with heavy boost. Also methanol is corrosive to metals and rubber products.

RyeThomas

Just to add their are a few companies that make stock appearing turbos that move a lot more air.

soulezoo

I agree with John and Mark...

Let's all sing kum ba yah!!!

Who's got the s'more's??