I've heard people raving about "stacking" a mild pressure box with a box that will do timing and pulse width. For example, the EZ on a low level (1 or 2?) stacked with the Power Pup in "Tow" mode. Here's my question: what is the benefit of getting the fuel pressure hike from the EZ rather than letting the Power Pup do it all in either "Performance" or "Extreme" mode?

 

I'm assuming this combination is similar to the EZ and the TST (timing advance/duration). I'm not 100% sure what the cause of the benefit is, but my EGTs are down about 200 degrees with them stacked. The EZ by itself is a smooth mild power increase. The TST alone is agressive and runs kind of hot. Putting them together cools them down and makes a comparable amount of power with a much smoother curve than the TST alone. I run the EZ on level 3 and the TST on 5/6 normally. Hope this helps!

 

Well, it gives some insight at least so thank you for the reply. I was beginning to wonder why all of the guys that are "stacking" didn't have an answer for why they do it...

So for everyone else, is it just cool to say your "stacked", or is EGT control the real benefit?

 

toybw, I understand what your saying. What I understand with stacking you do run cooler, but I would think the main reason for stacking would be more power

 

btt...

This one really has me puzzled. What is the benefit of stacking????

 

More power w/ cooler temps! Many guys here have to go to lower settings on their single box setup while towing because the temps get too high. Stacking the boxes lets you run on more powerful settings while also running cooler. Nothing's worse than having the extra power you need but you can't use it because your EGTs get too high! HO motors tend to run a bit warmer than the SOs. It almost makes me glad I have an SO. I'm thinking about getting a new truck but if I don't, I'm going to finish building my trans and I'm gonna stack me some boxes!!

Also, stacking boxes is a lot cheaper than buying a new turbo or injectors.......

 

OK, so back to the original question: what you're saying is in theory, an EZ on a low level "stacked" with a Power Pup in "Tow" mode will run cooler than the Pup by itself in "Performance"? This would give the pressure from the EZ and the timing/duration from the Pup, versus having the Pup do everything.

I guess I still don't understand how/why it would make a differnce who or what is telling the truck to change parameters? Has anyone actually compared an EZ/Pup "stack" to just a Pup? I know an EZ by itself on the higher levels can cause EGT concerns, but it's fueling only. The Pup does all three, so is it really necessary to "stack" with the Pup?

 

Basically, stacking more than one box is a goal aimed at optimizing the performance you want, given the boxes available when none of them will singularily satisfy your goals. Its largely a matter of experimentation, optimizing the power curve you want, prefered drivabilty, etc.,, and a tiny bit of perception and bragging rights thrown in for good measure. One mfg might do one or more things well, but not all things well. I"m refering to timing, duration, pressure, and driveability.

the 'pup on extreeme was designed for use with an external pressure box. so, by itself, the 'pup will naturally be heavy in duration and whatever timing they can get via software, and weak on pressure. that will make it run a bit hotter.

you can essentially change or at least influence a mfgs box behavior with an external stack. For example, aggressive pressure fooling on the 'pup will change amount pressure used in the whole pressure/duration/timing equation.

The VA C3.2 is very heavy in duration, no timing, but introduces a very nice torque rise for towing. that makes it a good stack with, say, a pressure timing box, or even another duration/timing module that isn't so aggressive on the bottom end. for example, Quadzilla has been teasing us with a timing/pressure box for a long time now, and if they are succesful, such a box would be a very nice, natural compliment to the C3.2.

the Edge Juice is also heavy on duration and timing and zero pressure. thats because
Edge has a pressure box and in all likelihood they want to see the two used together.

The TST is the same way. and in actual practice, folks have discovered that a little pressure added to the TST yields a performance benefit as well.

So Tobyw, you are right that, and the end of the day, it doesn't matter who is turning what ****. its the relative position of those ***** with respect to each other that you can manipulate with external stacking, if you do not like the relative position of the ***** as they are present in any one particular box.

and lets not get confused by the term, "fueling". you can attain "fueling" by increasing the injector on time, or by increasing the injector hole size, or by increasing fuel pressure in the rail. so if we are talking about a given injector, we can say "pressure" or we can say "duration". and both of these, in any combination or separately, add fuel.

In particular with respect to the 'pup, I suspect that the external pressure box turns up the pressure **** higher than the pup does by itself.

 

Translated......just run the pup on Performance and forget about the Edge if your planning on keeping it at that low a level anyway. The pup probably adds just enough pressure on the Performance mode (supposedly 30hp worth) to get the effect your looking for without spending $400 on another box. Running the pup on Tow mode (50hp) and stacking with the EZ will not yield enough noticeable difference versus just running the pup on Performance. That would be money better spent on other goodies.

For me the main benefit of stacking is adjustability. Yeah you get more power, but I can also turn it on and off, up or down, as I wish. I personally don't like pressure, but it is necessary to make good power. So, stack a duration box that can be turned up or down, with a pressure box that can be turned up or down. I cruise around on the duration box for everyday driving, but the pressure is there at the flick of a switch when you need to smack some Ford/Chevy/Hemi butt.

Nice to see you Doug. Haven't been posting much lately.

 

That was EXACTLY what I was hoping someone could verify. Thank you doug for the great info, and AK RAM for the great advice.