Turbo silencer question
09-13-2007, 12:12 PM
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Turbo silencer question
I have read a little about this, can you all help me out a bit. What is it, where is it, can I take it out, will it harm anything if I do, and does it help the performance and or sound at all? Lots of questions, but thanks for any help.
09-13-2007, 01:22 PM
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from what i understand th 6.7 turbo is different and it held in by pressed in place pins that must be drilled out, where as the 5.9 turbos are held in place by snap rings
09-13-2007, 03:56 PM
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Riddler is correct on the 6.7 being different. It doesn't have the snap ring for the silencer on the turbo. There is however a silencer of sorts in the intake tube from the air filter box to the turbo.
You can remove this silencer and it does allow the turbo to talk back somewhat and you can certainly hear the whistle of the turbo. You can get at this by removing the first two clamps on the intake tube right after the air box.
Once you have exposed the bigger portion of the intake tube here, you will see a plastic and foam stuffer that you can grab softly with pliers and pull straight out with it. Then put this all back together leaving the silencer out.
Your ready to check her out then. I have had mine out for quite some time now and I hope to have a whole new intake tube ready to install by this weekend that I have been making. I wanted to remove the plastic intake tube for more of a straight smooth flow design in hopes of a little extra room I need to re-route where I am going to try and move the EGR cooler by-pass valve assembly.
Figured I might as well add a little chrome for the intake tube as well, once I got the fit all as I needed. Hope its back from getting the shine put on it
I will get some PIC's posted of the new intake tube in place once I get it back and mounted.
You can remove this silencer and it does allow the turbo to talk back somewhat and you can certainly hear the whistle of the turbo. You can get at this by removing the first two clamps on the intake tube right after the air box.
Once you have exposed the bigger portion of the intake tube here, you will see a plastic and foam stuffer that you can grab softly with pliers and pull straight out with it. Then put this all back together leaving the silencer out.
Your ready to check her out then. I have had mine out for quite some time now and I hope to have a whole new intake tube ready to install by this weekend that I have been making. I wanted to remove the plastic intake tube for more of a straight smooth flow design in hopes of a little extra room I need to re-route where I am going to try and move the EGR cooler by-pass valve assembly.
Figured I might as well add a little chrome for the intake tube as well, once I got the fit all as I needed. Hope its back from getting the shine put on it
I will get some PIC's posted of the new intake tube in place once I get it back and mounted.
09-13-2007, 05:53 PM
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09-13-2007, 08:57 PM
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I took mine out but was very careful not to damage it. I can't be sure but I think it affected performance. I put it back in. I noticed a funny surge in power at certain RPM's. By removing I think it disturbs the air flow to a point that at certain RPM's it's not getting the smooth flow of air. The silencer in the 6.7 turbo is totally differant than the 5.9. It also acts to direct the air into the turbine. In my opinion I would not advise taking it out. I did however take the foam baffle piece out of the intake tube. I don't think it's as critical as the silencer in the turbo and it did increase the sound.
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09-14-2007, 10:45 AM
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Agreed on not removing the silencer ring from the 6.7 turbo because:
1-Those that have seem to see various degradations in performance
2-Seems the sound you get is not as pleasing as what you got with the 5.9
3-There are still a lot of these new turbos being replaced under warranty due to either HW or SW issues. If you are still under warranty and you go in with a blown up turbo, I doubt you'll be covered if they see the silencer ring removed and (maybe) the intake tube modified or changed. I like modding my trucks too, but I would wait until some of these issues get sorted out or you are out of warranty.
4-I did have a chance to talk with a Cummins engineer on this. He said one reason the silencer rings are press fit/pinned into place, was to discourage people from removing them like was commonly done on the 5.9's. Apparently, due to the VGT turbo design, it is much more critical that intake air enter in a certain way and at a certain velocity (thats why the ring looks like a venturi tube out of a carb). At a minimum taking the ring out will probably impact performance (see #1 above) and they believe the air hitting the VGT at the wrong angle over time will damage the impeller vanes.
If you're going to change your intake tube, save your stock stuff so you can put it back on if you need to go in for a warranty issue. If it was me, I wouldn't remove the turbo ring. If all you're trying to do is get more turbo whistle, I've heard people that use the AFE stage 2 intake are getting good results.
1-Those that have seem to see various degradations in performance
2-Seems the sound you get is not as pleasing as what you got with the 5.9
3-There are still a lot of these new turbos being replaced under warranty due to either HW or SW issues. If you are still under warranty and you go in with a blown up turbo, I doubt you'll be covered if they see the silencer ring removed and (maybe) the intake tube modified or changed. I like modding my trucks too, but I would wait until some of these issues get sorted out or you are out of warranty.
4-I did have a chance to talk with a Cummins engineer on this. He said one reason the silencer rings are press fit/pinned into place, was to discourage people from removing them like was commonly done on the 5.9's. Apparently, due to the VGT turbo design, it is much more critical that intake air enter in a certain way and at a certain velocity (thats why the ring looks like a venturi tube out of a carb). At a minimum taking the ring out will probably impact performance (see #1 above) and they believe the air hitting the VGT at the wrong angle over time will damage the impeller vanes.
If you're going to change your intake tube, save your stock stuff so you can put it back on if you need to go in for a warranty issue. If it was me, I wouldn't remove the turbo ring. If all you're trying to do is get more turbo whistle, I've heard people that use the AFE stage 2 intake are getting good results.
09-14-2007, 12:26 PM
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Agreed on not removing the silencer ring from the 6.7 turbo because:
1-Those that have seem to see various degradations in performance
2-Seems the sound you get is not as pleasing as what you got with the 5.9
3-There are still a lot of these new turbos being replaced under warranty due to either HW or SW issues. If you are still under warranty and you go in with a blown up turbo, I doubt you'll be covered if they see the silencer ring removed and (maybe) the intake tube modified or changed. I like modding my trucks too, but I would wait until some of these issues get sorted out or you are out of warranty.
4-I did have a chance to talk with a Cummins engineer on this. He said one reason the silencer rings are press fit/pinned into place, was to discourage people from removing them like was commonly done on the 5.9's. Apparently, due to the VGT turbo design, it is much more critical that intake air enter in a certain way and at a certain velocity (thats why the ring looks like a venturi tube out of a carb). At a minimum taking the ring out will probably impact performance (see #1 above) and they believe the air hitting the VGT at the wrong angle over time will damage the impeller vanes.
If you're going to change your intake tube, save your stock stuff so you can put it back on if you need to go in for a warranty issue. If it was me, I wouldn't remove the turbo ring. If all you're trying to do is get more turbo whistle, I've heard people that use the AFE stage 2 intake are getting good results.
1-Those that have seem to see various degradations in performance
2-Seems the sound you get is not as pleasing as what you got with the 5.9
3-There are still a lot of these new turbos being replaced under warranty due to either HW or SW issues. If you are still under warranty and you go in with a blown up turbo, I doubt you'll be covered if they see the silencer ring removed and (maybe) the intake tube modified or changed. I like modding my trucks too, but I would wait until some of these issues get sorted out or you are out of warranty.
4-I did have a chance to talk with a Cummins engineer on this. He said one reason the silencer rings are press fit/pinned into place, was to discourage people from removing them like was commonly done on the 5.9's. Apparently, due to the VGT turbo design, it is much more critical that intake air enter in a certain way and at a certain velocity (thats why the ring looks like a venturi tube out of a carb). At a minimum taking the ring out will probably impact performance (see #1 above) and they believe the air hitting the VGT at the wrong angle over time will damage the impeller vanes.
If you're going to change your intake tube, save your stock stuff so you can put it back on if you need to go in for a warranty issue. If it was me, I wouldn't remove the turbo ring. If all you're trying to do is get more turbo whistle, I've heard people that use the AFE stage 2 intake are getting good results.
I shake my head everytime I read about some of the things people are jumping in and doing. Again, I'll say very *Shade Tree.*
I think the advancement of this engine requires a bit more thought than to just hack something off, or pry something out. You paid good money for the truck, seems like you ought to be a little more careful and do plenty of investigating before performing something like this.
I'm now interested in bombing mine, but I'd like to be a bit more selective in my methods. We've already seen how fickle these engines (emissions) can be.
Think I'll take my time-
BigD
09-14-2007, 01:34 PM
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lol well for me taking out the Ring has not affected any performance what so ever. You say you put it back in? What did you do to put it back in? You would have to take it out with out any damage at all to it and you would have to set it PERFECT and repress or weld it in or something. The sound is better and IMO it has nothing to do with the air flow. IF it did then why even make it possible to remove with snap rings in the past or lightly pressed in? Why not just make it part of the housing of the turbo if it was so important for air flow? I don't buy it.
09-14-2007, 11:13 PM
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Your truck, your decision, your money if it turns out to be a bad idea.
To your points I would say this: The silencer ring on the conventional 5.9 turbo was just a silencer ring. People took them out forever, they got louder, and there seemed to be no other impact.
The 6.7 turbo is a totally different beast since it is a variable geometry turbo. What you are calling a silencer ring is in fact responsible for directing and controlling the air flow in this VGT. (this FACT comes direct from a Cummins R&D engineer)
The fact that the ring is press fit and pinned into place has nothing to do with trying to make it harder or easier to remove, it has everything to do with making it easier and/or more cost effective to assemble at the factory.
To your points I would say this: The silencer ring on the conventional 5.9 turbo was just a silencer ring. People took them out forever, they got louder, and there seemed to be no other impact.
The 6.7 turbo is a totally different beast since it is a variable geometry turbo. What you are calling a silencer ring is in fact responsible for directing and controlling the air flow in this VGT. (this FACT comes direct from a Cummins R&D engineer)
The fact that the ring is press fit and pinned into place has nothing to do with trying to make it harder or easier to remove, it has everything to do with making it easier and/or more cost effective to assemble at the factory.
09-16-2007, 12:16 AM
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I removed my "silencer, air flow directional thingy" by removing the housing from the turbo itself and carefully drilling out the dowel pins. I very carefully and lightly tapped it out from the back side by using a long screw driver on the ribs that hold it together as not to damage the inner part. I put it back in by drilling and tapping 3- 1/4" set screw holes and simply put it in with the set screws to hold it in. It rest in the housing on a machined shoulder so it will only go in so far. The set screws are only there to keep it from vibrating out. I will say it again that taking it out was a bad idea. (IMO)
09-16-2007, 12:18 PM
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I removed my "silencer, air flow directional thingy" by removing the housing from the turbo itself and carefully drilling out the dowel pins. I very carefully and lightly tapped it out from the back side by using a long screw driver on the ribs that hold it together as not to damage the inner part. I put it back in by drilling and tapping 3- 1/4" set screw holes and simply put it in with the set screws to hold it in. It rest in the housing on a machined shoulder so it will only go in so far. The set screws are only there to keep it from vibrating out. I will say it again that taking it out was a bad idea. (IMO)
09-16-2007, 12:36 PM
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Oh yeah....I loc-tited them. The elbow from the air filter is over them and clamped also. There is no way they can get out. As far as the silencer foam piece in the intake pipe, I notice no perfomance gain but is does let the turbo sound off more. That piece is easily removed once you have the intake tube apart. Just push it out the bigger end. You don't have to break, rip,or tear anything.
11-11-2010, 11:23 AM
#15
Fellas, I removed the silencer foam piece on my 2011 today. Drove it some this morning and notice absolutely ZERO difference. But, I am leaving it out. It probably took up about 70% of the space in the intake tube. I am not that smart when it comes to CTD's but I do know that air cannot flow through a solid material. I did like the way the piece looked like it directed the flow of air. Above all else, it has to be getting more air now. Also, under certain conditions, I bet the filter wrapped around the silencer absorbs certain amounts of moisture. I also know that my turbine is always over 200 degrees so any moisture gets vaporized immediately. This could be a problem if you take on water though. But, I really do not plan on swamping my 55,000 dollar truck.