ted_pulliam

I am replacing the clutch in my '01.5 and I am stuck trying to separate the transmission from the engine. Absolutely everything is unbolted. I've checked, double checked and triple checked. The engine is supported by a floor jack with a block of wood under the oil pan, and I have a fancy smancy 800# transmission jack supporting the transmission itself. There is a chain fastening the transmission to the jack, just to be safe.

There is about a 1" gap right now between the engine block and adapter bellhousing, but it won't go any farther. I know it is ready to turn loose but something, perhaps either the throwout bearing, some part of clutch or the tranmission input shaft is absolutely refusing to budge. I have tried gently prying at the gap betwen the engine and adapter housing, and that helped some, but continued prying would harm something.

Just a thought, would I be wise to go as far as unbolting the adapter/extension housing (which is what is getting stuck) from the transmission itself or would that take me a a place I really don't want to go? There appear to be 6 bolts holding it on.

Thanks in advance for any assistance - Ted

G1625S

I think you gotta just keep messin with it. more likely then not the agngle between engine and trans is a little off, or there's some tension between the two. Can't tell you how many ways I lookt at mine and everything seemed 'square', but when I dropped the engine down another inch or so, the tranny walked right out. As for the 6-speed, I think they're modular and you don't likely want to open the tailhousing can of worms.

Tate

AFAIK, the bellhousing on the 5600 is bolted from the inside, so you have to remove the tranny before you can remove the bellhousing. Is the shift tower clear of the floor? Exhaust in the way? If those check out, get a jack and put it under the engine balancer to tilt the engine back a bit, should make it easier.

ted_pulliam

Thanks G1625S. I'll keep working with the alignment of the whole thing.

Ted

ted_pulliam

Tate, the exhaust is completely removed, and I'm sure nothing else on the outside of the tranny is causing the binding. I will try as you said to tip the engine backwards using the harmonic balancer. That might be part of my problem since right now I have the jack under the oil pan of the engine per the Haynes manual I am using. It said to make sure the engine is fully supported and to do so with a floor jack positioned under the oil pan with a block of wood cushioning the oil pan. If I temporarily remove the jack from this location and reposition it under the harmonic balancer this shouldn't be any problem since even though the tranny is unbolted from the engine, the engine is still held in place with the big mount on either side, right?

I hear what you said also about the clutch housing not being able to be unbolted without first removing the tranny. I'm glad to hear you say that since I was afraid I had made a mistake by trying to removing the tranny and clutch housing together as one unit.

Like G1625S and you both said there must be something out of alignment, so hopefully this will work. I'll let you know if this works. Thanks very much for the assistance!

Ted

Tate

Haynes, is for the most part, worthless. The engine is slightly front heavy with where the engine mounts are positioned, so front will sag down without the tranny. That may be what they were talking about, in their poor fashion.

Homestead

You have to drop the rear of the motor, been there done that. Just don't drop it so much that your fan breaks the shroud. It will only go so far and the head will hit the firewall but that is to much.

After you drop the rear of the motor, you have to shake and pull and it will drop out. The 5600 is actually to big for the tunnel so it's a bit of muscling to get it out.

When it comes to getting it back in, just reverse the procedure while pulling up and down on the harmonic balancer. It will fight you but it will go in.

Jeff

ted_pulliam

Guys, thanks a million. I did exactly what was suggested and tipped up the front of the engine and the transmission slid right out! The only "problem" I had was that the shifter (really just the threaded stub sticking out of the top of the trans) wanted to tweak the sheet metal at the back of the opening going into the cab. I finally got the whole thing safely down to the ground.
Should I remove the shifter stub from the top of the tranny before trying to put it back in?
Tate was right, Haynes is pretty crappy since they just throw together the maintenance of the gas and diesel versions of our trucks and don't even cover the NV5600, only some general tidbits on the NV4500.
Anyway, I feel a lot better and I look forward to getting this clutch switched out. I miss driving this beast and I look forward to many trouble free miles on the new clutch.

Ted

G1625S

Alright! Haynes=bad DTR=good!
I left the stub in on my 4500. I massaged the floor with a bfh once everything was out, then massaged it back from the cab after re-install. What clutch you gonna run?

ted_pulliam

Being a poor, married (least for now) guy, I'm going with a NAPA MU20231. I don't tow or haul with the truck, and have absolutely no power mods. My rig made it 215k on the stock clutch, so I'm gonna take my chances on this clutch and not replace one of the other super popular (and much more expensive) performance clutches that get a lot of press time here on DTR :-)

I'm just a bit bummed out that after all of this I need to remove that pesky flywheel and have it machined. Then doing that will probably make it necessary to replace the rear main seal, so I'll bite the bullet and do that too while the flywheel is out. I tried to rationalize just R&R'ing the clutch without taking time for the flywheel and rear seal, but I'd be crazy not too! I am finding out that for someone such as myself with limited time and resources this isn't a quick affair to get over with. If I can do it only once and then go another 100 - 200k before I need to do it again, it will all be worth it.

Ted

G1625S

Definitely worth it-you are wise beyond your mods (or lack therof) grasshopper After all that huffing, you know it'd suck to do again for a lousy drip in the driveway...Don't forget the new pilot bearing. The machine shop should pop it right in for you.

Homestead

Knocking the shifter off when you put it back in will make it easier to install.

Definitely change out the rear main seal while you have it apart, I lost a clutch over a leaking rear main.

While your this far into it, drain the trans oil and after you get it all back in before you put the shifter back on, dump in a full 6 quarts of oil. Yes you are over filling it but the 5600 has a few oiling problems with the standard fill amount. By over filling it, you are sure to get all the bearings submerged and oiled as well as keep some of the heat down.

Mine has been over filled since almost day one, I'm over 200,000 miles now and it works as good if not better than new. I change mine out ever 20,000 or so and it's never been a problem.

Compared to getting a 5600 rebuilt, oil is cheap and it's your friend if you let it do it's job.

Jeff

Junk Man

FWIW, the 01 FSM is at pdftown. At least you'd have some directions & pics.

ted_pulliam

Thanks again guys... I will take the excellent advice everyone has given, and will also look to get a FSM so I can avoid the "vague-itis" that the Haynes manual suffers from.

I will definitely overfill that bad boy when I put it back in, and I'll also have the machine shop pop that pilot bearing in while they have the flywheel. The kit I bought comes with the pilot bearing, alignment tool, pressure plate and flywheel. I just wish they had thought to include a self installing feature

Ted

ted_pulliam

Well, now I am confused! I did get hold of the FSM from pdftown for the 2001 Ram 2500, and it says on page 6-4, under the section "Clutch Flywheel Runout" the following:

"Flywheel machining is not recommended. The flywheel clutch surface is machined to a unique contour and machining will negate this feature. However, minor flywheel scoring can be cleaned up by hand with 180 grit emery, or with surface grinding equipment. Remove only enough material to reduce scoring (approximately 0.001 - 0.003 in.). Heavy stock removal is not recommended

This has blown away all of my previous understanding that the flywheel must be removed and machined. In another post, one of the other DTR members recommended something called the "flexhone", which mounts on a drill and looks like it would only rough the flywheel up a little without removing material.

What should I do, have the flywheel machined, or just do the minor scoring myself with either 180 grit sandpaper or the flexhone? I still plan to do the rear main seal and pilot bearing, but honestly it would be a big relief not to have to spend the additional down time locating a machining operation in the area in which I live to take my flywheel to and waiting for them to get to it.

Ted