My truck won't stay running...Please help!
11-03-2016, 01:30 PM
#1
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My truck won't stay running...Please help!
So here's the situation...
The truck ('99 3500 4x4 auto 24v) has been sitting unused at my parents house for a about a year now because of a problem my dad found with it where he claimed it would randomly shutoff and he'd have to wait about 30 minutes before he could start and run it again. I just finished grad school and have some time before I start my new job so I've been over to their house and started troubleshooting the truck. We have owned the truck since about 2007 and have replaced the injection pump and the transfer pump around 162k miles. The truck now has 208k miles on it and has never had any other problems.
I have started the truck, driven the truck, allowed the truck to run continuously for about 4 hours, and I haven't seen it shut off or anything else troublesome. My dad reported that the shutoff problem came once while driving in stop and go traffic, and once while idling after driving for about an hour. Thinking that the problem likely was brief fuel starvation from the transfer pump (because we all know about how great these stock transfer pumps are), I installed a mechanical fuel pressure gauge and BD Power fuel pressure warning light. The truck has great fuel pressure. The bump/start test yields 5-7 lbs, idle yields 14-15 lbs, and wide open never drops below about 10-12 lbs. Now, with a way to monitor the pressure, I began driving the truck. I made a few trips totaling about an hour each and then let the truck sit and idle for a few hours. No issue, and no drops in pressure while having my eyes glued on the gauge the whole time. Thinking that my dad must've invented this problem somehow, I though the days of worry were over.
So a couple weeks ago after Hurricane Matthew barreled through Florida and left use without power, I decided to buy a surplus 45kw generator in VA. I decided to take the ram to go get it because it runs great now! ...or so I thought.
Driving the 11 hour drive was no problem. The truck did fine in stop and go, cruise control, 85+ mph, passing people, and had plenty of power to spare. No hiccups whatsoever. At least until I got to VA where I entered the warehouse property and let the truck idle while the genset was loaded onto the trailer. The truck died. I thought, "oh ****." I went back to the cab and restarted the truck. It started after a few cranks. It ran a bit more and died again. I restarted and it seemed fine so I put it in gear and began to leave the property with my new genset. While turning around on the property, the truck died again. I knew it was hopeless at this point. Luckily, they let me park the truck and trailer on promises that I'll be back to get it in the coming weeks.
I'm baffled. The truck did great for 11 hours of highway driving. Let it idle, it dies. It starts back, but won't stay running. I had it towed to the local dealership to run the codes but wait for it..... they told me my batteries were dead and wanted $2000 for new batteries and cables!!!! ***?! Not happening. I'm heading up to get the truck with another dually this weekend.
Where should I start to trouble shoot this thing? What do you think is wrong? To me, it seems to defy any kind of logic. My best guesses are:
1) Loose or dirty electrical ground causing the injection pump to shutoff.
2) Air in the fuel system
3) Clogged strainer for the in-tank fuel pickup
More details and thoughts:
*One of the batteries doesn't hold a charge and does need to be replaced
*The crank position sensor on the bottom of the block is covered in oil splatter from use over the years
*CCD is displayed in the overhead console
*The 'wait to start' feature hasn't worked since I've been driving the truck. It's Florida so it still starts right up. However, it did used to work.
*With all the electrical issues, it must be part of the shutoff problem. If it were the injection pump again, it wouldn't start back up at all, right?
*No check engine light and no OBD-II codes (this is why I took it to the dealership so they could check for DRB codes)
*ABS and BRAKE light are on, but I think that's unrelated and a back 4x4 hub sensor.
So...for my sanity...please give me your experiences, suggestions, thoughts, and any other relevant information on the matter. I don't know where to start.
The truck ('99 3500 4x4 auto 24v) has been sitting unused at my parents house for a about a year now because of a problem my dad found with it where he claimed it would randomly shutoff and he'd have to wait about 30 minutes before he could start and run it again. I just finished grad school and have some time before I start my new job so I've been over to their house and started troubleshooting the truck. We have owned the truck since about 2007 and have replaced the injection pump and the transfer pump around 162k miles. The truck now has 208k miles on it and has never had any other problems.
I have started the truck, driven the truck, allowed the truck to run continuously for about 4 hours, and I haven't seen it shut off or anything else troublesome. My dad reported that the shutoff problem came once while driving in stop and go traffic, and once while idling after driving for about an hour. Thinking that the problem likely was brief fuel starvation from the transfer pump (because we all know about how great these stock transfer pumps are), I installed a mechanical fuel pressure gauge and BD Power fuel pressure warning light. The truck has great fuel pressure. The bump/start test yields 5-7 lbs, idle yields 14-15 lbs, and wide open never drops below about 10-12 lbs. Now, with a way to monitor the pressure, I began driving the truck. I made a few trips totaling about an hour each and then let the truck sit and idle for a few hours. No issue, and no drops in pressure while having my eyes glued on the gauge the whole time. Thinking that my dad must've invented this problem somehow, I though the days of worry were over.
So a couple weeks ago after Hurricane Matthew barreled through Florida and left use without power, I decided to buy a surplus 45kw generator in VA. I decided to take the ram to go get it because it runs great now! ...or so I thought.
Driving the 11 hour drive was no problem. The truck did fine in stop and go, cruise control, 85+ mph, passing people, and had plenty of power to spare. No hiccups whatsoever. At least until I got to VA where I entered the warehouse property and let the truck idle while the genset was loaded onto the trailer. The truck died. I thought, "oh ****." I went back to the cab and restarted the truck. It started after a few cranks. It ran a bit more and died again. I restarted and it seemed fine so I put it in gear and began to leave the property with my new genset. While turning around on the property, the truck died again. I knew it was hopeless at this point. Luckily, they let me park the truck and trailer on promises that I'll be back to get it in the coming weeks.
I'm baffled. The truck did great for 11 hours of highway driving. Let it idle, it dies. It starts back, but won't stay running. I had it towed to the local dealership to run the codes but wait for it..... they told me my batteries were dead and wanted $2000 for new batteries and cables!!!! ***?! Not happening. I'm heading up to get the truck with another dually this weekend.
Where should I start to trouble shoot this thing? What do you think is wrong? To me, it seems to defy any kind of logic. My best guesses are:
1) Loose or dirty electrical ground causing the injection pump to shutoff.
2) Air in the fuel system
3) Clogged strainer for the in-tank fuel pickup
More details and thoughts:
*One of the batteries doesn't hold a charge and does need to be replaced
*The crank position sensor on the bottom of the block is covered in oil splatter from use over the years
*CCD is displayed in the overhead console
*The 'wait to start' feature hasn't worked since I've been driving the truck. It's Florida so it still starts right up. However, it did used to work.
*With all the electrical issues, it must be part of the shutoff problem. If it were the injection pump again, it wouldn't start back up at all, right?
*No check engine light and no OBD-II codes (this is why I took it to the dealership so they could check for DRB codes)
*ABS and BRAKE light are on, but I think that's unrelated and a back 4x4 hub sensor.
So...for my sanity...please give me your experiences, suggestions, thoughts, and any other relevant information on the matter. I don't know where to start.
11-05-2016, 07:19 PM
#3
Registered User
hmmm out of fuel? I know the sending units and pickup tubes in the tank tend to lose accuracy. I run out of fuel with 10 gallons still in tank. I t could be reading 1/4 tank and your empty.
I also had to replace electrical connector from wiring harness to lift pump. because of intermitten shut down. the connectors ground wire in the connecter was loose so when I was idling (when the truck shakes the most) the ground was barely touching giving the lift pump no 12 volts or partial volts because the connection was not solid. I used a meter on the connection and pushed and pulled on it hand found it.
I hope it helps, Mike
I also had to replace electrical connector from wiring harness to lift pump. because of intermitten shut down. the connectors ground wire in the connecter was loose so when I was idling (when the truck shakes the most) the ground was barely touching giving the lift pump no 12 volts or partial volts because the connection was not solid. I used a meter on the connection and pushed and pulled on it hand found it.
I hope it helps, Mike
11-15-2016, 06:02 PM
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You need to test the instrument cluster using the trip meter push button. cant remember how but it can be done. Check if all bulbs on cluster light up that do not normally display. Normally if bulbs are good and wait to start light does not light when key is turned on it points to the ecm starting to go bad, but with a bad battery you need to get full battery power to truck to troubleshoot. You can check Mopar1973mans sight there is alot of good info on the ecm for our trucks.
11-16-2016, 07:04 AM
#5
Administrator
Always replace the batteries as a set, don't ever mix and match old and new batteries.
The WTS light could be burnt out (hopefully) or the ECM is acting up. The WTS light is directly tied to the Cummins ECM, all other indicators (except turn signals and high beam) are processed through the Dodge PCM.
The WTS light could be burnt out (hopefully) or the ECM is acting up. The WTS light is directly tied to the Cummins ECM, all other indicators (except turn signals and high beam) are processed through the Dodge PCM.
Originally Posted by Instrument Cluster Test
Insert the key into the ignition and rotate it one click forward to the OFF position. Push and hold the odometer reset button and then turn the key one click forward to the ON position while continuing to hold the reset button in. This will start the test:
- The odometer will read CHEC (you can let go of the odometer reset button here). The Wait To Start, Air Bag, and ABS lights should also light during this step. The PCM controls the instrument cluster, but the ECM, airbag module, and ABS module will function like normal during this which is why their lights are lit at first.
- The odometer will then change and read all 8's. The CRUISE and TRIP indicators under the digits will also be lit. No other indications will be lit during this part of the test. This lasts for about 5 seconds.
- The odometer will then test each and every segment of its display in sequence
- After that, every indicator on the dash will light up, with the exception of the Wait to Start light, turn signals, and high beam indicator. The WTS light is under control of the ECM which is why it does not light during this part of the test.
- The indicators will go out and then all of the gauge needles will move together in three steps. ¼ scale, ½ scale, and then full scale. The exception here is the fuel gauge, it will read 1/8, then ¼, then full.
- The gauges will go back to zero and the test is over. The door chime will sound and the instrument panel will return to normal.
- The odometer will read CHEC (you can let go of the odometer reset button here). The Wait To Start, Air Bag, and ABS lights should also light during this step. The PCM controls the instrument cluster, but the ECM, airbag module, and ABS module will function like normal during this which is why their lights are lit at first.
- The odometer will then change and read all 8's. The CRUISE and TRIP indicators under the digits will also be lit. No other indications will be lit during this part of the test. This lasts for about 5 seconds.
- The odometer will then test each and every segment of its display in sequence
- After that, every indicator on the dash will light up, with the exception of the Wait to Start light, turn signals, and high beam indicator. The WTS light is under control of the ECM which is why it does not light during this part of the test.
- The indicators will go out and then all of the gauge needles will move together in three steps. ¼ scale, ½ scale, and then full scale. The exception here is the fuel gauge, it will read 1/8, then ¼, then full.
- The gauges will go back to zero and the test is over. The door chime will sound and the instrument panel will return to normal.
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