jhinds

This relates to thread https://www.dieseltruckresource.com/...ight=blue+chip.

I didn't want to hijack that, so I'm starting a new one. I hope this follows the correct protocol

I too have hard start long crank times when hot problems on my 98.5 Dodge. I'm on my second VP44. The OEM lasted about 70K and this one has about 120K on it. The dealer replaced the OEM for me with a rebuilt one. This problem didn't show up till some months after I had an Airtex fuel pump installed. No codes are thrown, and, of course, no check engine light.

At that time it was putting out 25 psi while the old pump was at 18 psi. Bad information, I think, from another forum, led me to believe the vp44 couldn't handle 25 psi so I had my mechanic wire the Airtex to the power window circuit getting it out of the way of a possibly weak vp44 printed circuit board/computer. This was done at the behest of Airtex tech support.

This had no affect on the problem and I also learned that a dealer installed new lift pump, in the tank, would put out the same psi as the Airtex. Further research led me to the fine tutorial at Blue Chip's web page where I learned:

"Hard start hot is ALWAYS an issue due to heat soak, where the distributor section of the pump gets hot from the latent heat from the engine after the engine is shut off. Cooling the distributor by either time or an outside source, shrinks the distributor making it fit the rotor tighter to make higher and therefore enough pressure to pop off the injectors and start the engine. To test for this or convince yourself that I am right, try this trick. Run cold water over the Injection Pump for a few minutes the next time you know it will be hard to start, and if it starts right up you know you need a new pump."

So I bought Blue Chip's "PREMIUM UPGRADED SPECIAL X Blue Chip FUEL SAVER Rebuilt VP44" for $2150 plus shipping. Chip personally assured me that the Computer on this item had "zero heat cycles on it" meaning it was new.

My mechanic installed Blue Chip's vp44 and it exhibited the same behavior as the old one. Chip, upon learning the serial number of the unit said, "oh, one of those" He had the mechanic pour cold water on it and it started right up. He says this is because the computer is defective. But above he says the cold water "shrinks the distributor". It also, if it starts, will only idle. Chip says that this is also being caused by a bad Bosch computer. (It's not the APPS, in other words.)

I'm confused. I haven't found anything bad about Blue Chip in my searching; I have an outstanding mechanic. Return the vp44? Use another supplier? I just want improved gas mileage, a preferably replaceable computer on the IP, and the computer should have silver solder, be new, and, I'd like better than a one year warranty, and, really, would like a totally new VP 44.

What would ya'll do?

John Hinds
Granger, Texas

Tallguy67

I am no VP44 expert, there are others on here who will chime in. I recently thought I had VP44 problems so I went through the BlueChip diagnosis page at least a half dozen times. It certainly sounds like you have a failing IP from what I read. Are you saying in the post that you have a new IP from BlueChip, you called Chip and he won't do anything for you? That really doesn't sound like what I have heard about that company/guy.

Dieselbuilder

I myself had purchased a blue chip pump and before had a hoard of problems with the pumps I bought from ADP, when after installing blue chips pump all my problems went away and has never run better. I am not sure what your saying is Chip going to warranty your pump?

duster75

Have a blue chip x pump.... mpg's better but not as good as I hoped for $ spent. I'm sure he will come around and replace...... His pumps are supposed to have new boards... By his comments above leads me to think,what is he outsourcing now.... Mexico???? or did bosch have a bad run....Mexico????

jhinds

Tallguy67, I do have a new IP from Blue Chip. I didn't learn about this problem till late Friday, after 5 Eastern. Chip is no doubt willing to correct the problem, but it is problematic that I was evidently shipped a vp44 with a used Bosch computer on it while I paid for a NEW computer and was assured that was what I was getting. They are supposed to call me Monday, per my mechanic who had extensive conversations with Chip, which of course, will be billed to me at his hourly rate. Meanwhile I need advice as to whether to give them another chance, something I'm not eager to do for a $2000 plus part which is advertised to have a 2% failure rate within the one year warranty, and which was bad out of the box.

jhinds

Duster, I'll be sure to ask. I've since read on another thread, and on pensacoladiesel's web page about various testing procedures and wonder what testing Blue Chip does before shipping. According to what I read on Pensacola's page Bosch manufactures in China.

jhinds

Dieselbuilder, Yes, they'll warranty pump. Your experience with BCD is in line with everything I've been able to find. That doesn't take away from the fact I was shipped a pump with a used and defective Bosch computer when I spent top dollar to make sure I got what was supposed to be the best they had available.

Dieselbuilder

It seen's when Edit happens it is hard to stop its just one thing after another

TDIDog

I find this all quite interesting. There seams to be a lot of VP44 failures lately. I am having the same symptoms & not sure which way to go. I contacted Diesel Auto Power, & they say their pump comes with new electronics & all the upgrades, and is less than $1000. 1 yr warranty etc. Pretty tempting to go that way and take a chance. Just can't understand so many pumps acting up.

pind

I've had both good and bad experience with rebuilt VP pumps.

I have put rebuilds on customer trucks that have gone the life of the truck after install, and I have had them fail within 800 KM. It is a roll of the dice at best.

The pumps I install ALL have new electronics installed, and all the available updates, so what do you do?

Keep on keepin on is about the best strategy.

As far as BCD. I have heard only good about the company, and see no reason for you to have any problems. One of the few companies anymore, that you hear all good about.

TDIDog

Has anyone heard any bad things about Diesel Auto Power? If their pump is good enough, it's almost a thousand dollars cheaper.

rickf

Mr. Hinds, You are slamming Chip before he even has had a chance to explain what has happened. You say this came about after close of business on Friday. You already have a half dozen negative posts against him and you do not even know if it was a used computer or a defective one, or a voltage spike through your modified wiring. Give Chip a chance to stand behind his product. Do you know for sure that you will have to pay full price for the replacement labor? Have you asked Chip if he might help? If your mechanic is so good and you use him all the time I would think he would cut you some slack. I had my own shop at one time and I had these things happen, sometimes you just bite the bullet and do it for cost to keep your customer happy. I strongly suggest you get some answers from the rebuilder before slamming him on a public forum.

Rick

jhinds

Rickf,
I didn't get an email notification of your post. I got on here to give an update, which is, as I expected, and stated so above, BCD is indeed standing behind their product. A replacement unit is on the way, overnight, and BCD is splitting that cost down the middle. As it turns out the unit did indeed, according to Chip, have a "new" not a rebuilt Bosch computer on it. Chip evidently misheard the part number my mechanic gave him and when I spoke to him today he actually pulled the invoice and claims it is indeed a new computer. I wish he had pulled my invoice when dealing with the shop. Now, it WAS dead on arrival. Chip and my mechanic diagnosed the problem as a bad Bosch computer right out of the box.

As said above, also, one searches in vain for bad ratings on BCD. Bad things happen to good people just as good things happen to bad. It's the luck of the draw.

My ordeal in this is hardly over. A new symptom has cropped up in that pin #7 (red wire) going to the IP does not energize for two seconds on cranking. Chip told me that this adds a new dimension to his troubleshooting guide as regards hard start hot long crank times and agrees with my mechanic that this issue is likely related to a defective ECM.

Rickf wrote: " voltage spike through your modified wiring." Of course, the truck is wired as from the factory. The Airtex recommended bandaid for a weak Bosch computer having been abandoned when BCD's IP was installed.

Finally, rickf, I don't think I slammed BCD. That wasn't my intention at all. I set out to be circumspect and always give people the benefit of doubt. If I wanted to be an *** I'd just dispute the charge with the credit card company and certainly wouldn't have bothered posting anything on the internet which takes a lot of time anyhow; and usually gives no satisfaction. I'm way beyond being vindictive, making enemies in this life.

jhinds

To the others that posted, Thanks for your input. I'm no longer getting notifications of posts for some reason.

Chip Fisher of BCD gives good reasons why pumps are failing at an increasing rate. They don't make any new cores so the recycled ones have maybe been rebuilt several times. You can't get a new VP44 in this country Bosch having made a deal to not compete with rebuilders. Chip has been contacted several times by attorneys about being an expert witness in a class action lawsuit but hasn't heard back...yet. Now, Bosch does take failed computers and resolder them which ones evidently have a high failure rate. Chip explains that its just the cost of owning one of the vehicles to have to replace the VP44 occasionally and reiterates that the Bosch computer is the weakest link. He points out however, that as these trucks get older he sees more and more problems cropping up such as a dead wire on pin #7 I mention in my previous. He's never seen this before but after talking to my mechanic Friday was able to work with another mechanic to isolate the same condition on the unit on which he was working. Interesting. He also told me a new Bosch computer is $700 and, if my memory serves, a new distributor and rotor is about $400. That doesn't leave much room for markups by retailers.

rickf

So you are saying that posts number 1, 5 and 7 are not negative and accusational? Maybe I am reading them wrong but comments from others leads me to believe I read then correctly. I am glad the problem was found. I have seen reference to pin 7 in several forums so this is not new. I do not remember exactly what the solution was.

Rick