From a previous Post i decided to read the Warrenty Book ( Red Book).

Cummins Diesel Warrenty States it begins at the end of the 3/36 basic warrenty, and covers
Cylinder Block , head asm, core plugs, and IP, plus some more items.
For 5 years or 100,000k miles.

So: Items covered for 8 years 136K miles.

I'm good to Feb 2010 or 136 K ( Have 60K now)???

Who does the Work, Dodge or Cummins????

 

Your cummins warranty started when the truck was first put into service. 5 years or 100,000 miles which ever comes first. It runs concurrently with the 3/36,000. Authorized dodge truck dealers do the work. The warranty is to the first purchaser only, unless it is elgible and has been transfered to the second owner.

 

my warranty on my 02 runs out in july 07. i have checked with my service manager.

 

Correct, the 5yr/100K isn't in addition to the 3yr/36K, it's 5years total.

Every Dodge got the 3year/36,000 mile "bumper to bumper".

Cummins engines got the 5year/100,000 mile as part of the deal with Cummins to use their engines.

Dodge Dealership does all warranty work.
Back in the old days, Dodge would often refer engine repairs to an authorized Cummins shop if they didn't have a Diesel Mechanic on the payroll, but those days are long gone.

I have a 7year/100,000 engine/powertrain warranty on mine.

It was purchased towards the end of the 2002 model year,
there was a promotion in spring of 2002 to "clear the lots for the 2003's" that added the extra years.
Deductable's kick in on various powertrain parts at various points during the warranty.


phox

 

OK, But:

I will quote the dodge warrenty book page 11, sec 2.6:

Quote
2.6 Cummins Diesel Engine Limited Warrenty

A. When It Begins
If your truck is equiped with a Cummins Diesel Engine, The Cummins Diesel Engine Limited Warrenty begins at the end of the 3/36 Basic Limited Warenty period,and covers the cost of repairing those parts of your truck engine listed that are defective in materials,wworkmanship,or factory preparation.
B. Parts Covered for 5 years or 100,000 miles.
Unquote, it goes on to list parts covered...under warrenty,

Above makes me believe Cummins warrenty starts at end of basic warrenty as stated...

 

You are correct in your interpretation of the warranty.....and you are not alone. It has been documented once already that this interpretation has already been fought and one successfully by one DC customer already. However, I believe this to be the exception to the rule. But, since your manual is very clear in it's wording that "The Cummins Diesel Engine Limited Warranty BEGINS at the END of the 3/36 Basic Limited Warranty period", is is worth a fight since you are technically correct that the manual clearly implies that the Cummins engine is warranted for a total of 136k / 8 years.

 

Three comments:

• Not "technically correct"—just plain old correct.
• The Warranty Information booklet clearly states (as required by law) rather than implies
• Not 136k/8 years—just that the warranties run consecutively. One ends & the other begins.

I spent a fair amount of time posting the original warranty thread on "that other site". I wonder if earlier posters in this thread ("Your cummins warranty started when the truck was first put into service.", "Correct, the 5yr/100K isn't in addition to the 3yr/36K, it's 5years total.", and "i have checked with my service manager") have read the linked thread completely, including all of its links.

If you are still one of the crowd that is accepting the DaimlerChrysler & Dealership/Service Manager line that the Basic Warranty and the Cummins Diesel Engine limited Warranty run concurrently then perhaps you will be one of the crowd that DaimlerChrysler takes for a ride.

-Thomas

 

Sorry for this manifesto, but I'm amazed at the number of owners that are having injection pumps replaced. Up until now, most owners of 2000's, 2001's, 2002's were having it done under warranty. The 02's like mine had a 7yr/100,000 drivetrain warranty. But now there's a growing number that are having to foot bill, either because of the time limit, or because they drive it a lot and are staring at 100 grand on the clock. I was one of them when last month, I lost my IP with 128,000 miles on it. If there was anyone that babys their truck, it's me; totally stock and spends 85% of its running time at 1800 RPM, never loaded, just lots and lots of miles. It's fed a steady diet of Stanadyne to help lube the fuel system. I buy it in 5 gallon cans I use so much of it. But being out here in the sticks, miles from a diesel shop, and not having enough time to do it myself, I spent $3300.00 to have my dealer perform the work. Having purchased 2 vehicles from them, these guys know me, and aren't taking me for a ride. My lift pump, although working was so badly rusted, that they wouldn't warranty the new injection pump (12mo/12,000 miles) unless I had the in-tank retrofit lift pump done at that time too. That amounted to nearly 800.00 of the total bill. I'm curious as to what's going to happen when more and more owners are faced with a bill of this magnitude that they must foot themselves? And what really steams me is they replace the defective pump with the same darn thing! I realize they have no choice, but this is rediculous! To illustrate how prevalent this is, two other people in my family have had their IP's replaced. My son had his die at 47,000 miles, and my brother in law had his 2001 die with less than 50 miles on the odometer! So I truely believe that injection pump failures are far from isolated incidents. Now after thoroughly reading Thomas' thread a few weeks back, I debated whether I should press this issue with my dealer and or DC. I'm still wrestling on what to do. First, I have very little time to persue the issue. Secondly, and I mean no offense to you Thomas, I don't know how willing I am or if I'm even able to become one of "those customers" that the service department wishes would never darken their doorstep again. We all know what the warranty really is. The black mileage bar graph for the Cummins warranty in my manual starts at 0 just as the basic warranty does. Is this a moral issue for me? Perhaps, I don't know. Or is it how willing am I to become someone I'd like to think I'm not....usually and again, I mean no offense to Thomas. Maybe Thomas has the power of persuation, or perhaps his dealer rolled over after Thomas persisted (and perhaps persisted and persisted...) Thomas, I applaud your efforts and I suspect you have the tenacity of a bull dog and I suspect a lot more fight in you than I.

But I believe this issue borders on an outright recall or at the very least, what I've referred to in the past as a "silent recall". You know, you bring your truck in, and the dealership pulls you aside and like they're doing you an immense favor, whispers that DC is going to cover this with for a small $100 deductable. You're going to see more and more owners screaming bloody murder as the warranties expire, and it's not until some intrepid owner decides to file a class action law suit that we'll see some movement on DC part to remedy the problem.

For now, I'll be driving my truck comfortable in knowing I have 11,000 miles or maybe until May left before I need to start worrying again. But at that point, I'll be throwing in the towel. I'm cutting my losses. I'll be selling my beast and going back to a gasoline vehicle. I believe I was incorrect when I thought that diesel engines had the edge over gasoline powerplants when comparing them on high mileage alone. That's why I bought my Cummins. With diesel fuel prices stuck at .40+ more per gallon than gas, you'll never recoup the price of the engine option. I did a spreadsheet the other day and found that I could drive a gasoline vehicle getting 15 miles per gallon, and still be a shade ahead of my Cummins getting 21 miles per gallon. That's on a good day with a stiff tailwind and going downhill! Yep, I'm doing the mutiny thing. I'm going for a Chebby this time. Besides, I get a nice supplier discount. Yep, I'm gonna get me one of those engines which feature "fuel management" aka. cylinder deactivation. At 20 mpg, I'll be saving nearly four cents per mile over what I'm paying now. Over 100K miles, that's 4000 bucks, and besides, it's about time I get to listen to one of my big buck audio systems my design team and I made for it. For the time being though, it too early to say goodbye. As they say, it isn't over 'till the rotund woman sings. Unfortunately for me, she's now back stage warming up.

 

First the warranty was and should of been explained to all first owners at time of delivery.

Second it takes 5 plus years for someone to read into the wording of a warranty manual which was mass-produced and considers it gospel.

Third as always the squeeky wheel gets the grease. Chrysler has been taking care of the warranties beyond limitations. Mostly based on ownership, current miles. age. and prior history.

Fourth do i think it is right. No. The vp44 and its system has been weak and they know it. Will they recall it. I doubt it. These trucks are getting to old and beyond the recall guide lines.

 

My warranty booklet (which was included with my 2001 Ram) says the Cummins Diesel Engine Limited Warranty begins when the Basic Warranty ends. In compliance with Federal law, DaimlerChrylser has specified two things: the time or event at which the warranty period begins, if different from the purchase date, and the warranty's duration. The event at which the engine warranty begins is "the end of the 3/36 Basic Limited Warranty period". The warranty's duration is 5 years or 100,000 miles, whichever comes first. My warranty booklet contains no simple, readily-understood language (see below) that would indicate that the Cummins Diesel Engine Limited Warranty's period began at purchase time. Instead, it contains explicit language that indicates a completely different "begins at" point.
Not according to the fine print on the inside of the back cover of my 2001 warranty booklet. It explicitly states that warranty coverage applies to all vehicle owners.
The warranty booklet speaks for itself, and requires no explanation (given that Federal law requires that it be written in simple and readily-understood language). I certainly wouldn't yield responsibility for explaining the warranty to someone who has a financial interest opposite mine.
Of course the warranty booklet is gospel. Federal law mandates that. There is no other warranty apart from what is described in that booklet. What DaimlerChrysler or a dealer may say is irrelevant, if it differs from the plain language of your warranty information booklet.

EDIT: it didn't take "5 plus years" for some of us to understand the terms of the warranty. Some of us, because the warranty was part of the product on which we spent $30,000+, knew what the booklet said when we first purchased our trucks. It comes to light now, after "5 plus years", because that's when some of our VP44s failed - the first time we've actually needed the warranty coverage.

Thomas' original, eloquent post on "that other site" makes all of this quite clear. He provides the text of his warranty booklet and links to the applicable statutes.

Based on private communications with Thomas, it seems that he didn't (as was suggested by another poster) have to persist too much with his dealer. Rather, he presented the dealer with his warranty booklet, service records, and references to the applicable Federal laws. The dealer, who seems to be able to read the English language, agreed with Thomas that the warranties run consecutively, not concurrently. The dealer, apparently, contacted DaimlerChrysler, who then sent Thomas reimbursement for the covered expense (VP44 replacement).

From some of the posts I've read on other forums, DC actually tried to wiggle out of the warranty obligation. Thomas performs all of his maintenance himself. DC wanted to see records of that maintenance. If the warranties ran concurrently, why didn't DC just use that "fact" to deny coverage for the VP44 replacement? Why did they ask for maintenance records (logs and receipts)? Even more importantly, why did they, once such records were produced, send Thomas a check?

 

For those who think the Cummins Diesel Engine Limited Warranty started at delivery, who have a 2000-2001 Cummins-equipped Ram, and who can refer to the warranty information booklet that was included with the truck (other model years, particularly 1999 and 2002, may also use identical language, but I haven't seen those booklets firsthand)...

Please explain why DC used the language they did in the section of the warranty booklet that defines when the Cummins warranty begins. Reconcile that language with the various other warranties.

My 2001 warranty booklet, in section 2.1(D), says that the Basic Limited Warranty began when I took delivery of the truck:
2.1(D) "The Basic Limited Warranty begins on either of the following dates, whichever is earlier:
* the date you take delivery of the truck"

In sections 2.2(B), 2.3(B), 2.4, and 2.5(B), DC tells me that various other warranties begin when the Basic Limited Warranty begins:
2.2(B) "This warranty starts when your Basic Limited Warranty begins under 2.1(D)"
2.3(B) "These limits are counted from the time when your Basic Limited Warranty begins under 2.1(D)"
2.4 "These limits are counted from the time when your Basic Limited Warranty begins under 2.1(D)"
2.5(B) "These limits are counted from the time when your Basic Limited Warranty begins under 2.1(D)"

In section 2.6(A), however, DC has explicitly told me that the Cummins Diesel Engine Limited Warranty begins at a completely different time/event:
2.6(A) "the Cummins Diesel Engine Limited Warranty begins at the end of the 3/36 Basic Limited Warranty period"

Had DC intended the Cummins warranty to run concurrently with the Basic Limited Warranty, it was certainly within their power to include such language. After all, they did use such language with at least four other warranties. Instead, when defining the terms of the Cummins Diesel Engine Limited Warranty, DC explicitly described a different "begins at" event: the end of the Basic Limited Warranty period. Since DC used one type of language for several warranties, and a different type of language for the CDELW, they surely must have meant that "different" language when describing the CDELW.

 

There are at least two problems with using the diagram at the beginning of the Warranty Information booklet as a definition of when warranties begin:
1. Federal law (16 CFR 701.3(a)) requires that written warranties be disclosed in "simple and readily understood language". My Warranty Information booklet is written in the English language. That language does not use "pictographs". The "bar graph" at the beginning of the booklet does not comply with the statute's requirements.
2. Notwithstanding (1) above, the "bar graph" tells us nothing about when the various warranties begin. It merely describes durations. Note that the "Basic Limited Warranty" does not begin at "0" miles on the odometer - it begins when you take delivery of the truck. The odometer could display 100 miles at that time, but the bar graph makes no such allowance. Thus, the bar graph isn't telling us about "the point in time or event on which the warranty term commences"; it's merely describing "the time period or other measurement of warranty duration" (16 CFR 701.3(a)(4)).

There is only one document that defines the terms of the warranty: the Warranty Information booklet. That document only defines one time or event on which the [Cummins Diesel Engine Limited] warranty commences": the end of the Basic Limited Warranty.

 

OK, Good stuff........

I am the 3 owner of the truck, I regestered it with Dodge,
They gave me a print out showing all warrenties in effect. but no reference to
the Cummins warrenty, I guess it's time to determine where I stand,
So I do not have to fight with them at the time of VP44 failure...

I wonder how many 53 blocks were in the 5/100k warrenty period that dodge skated on.

What puzzles me, if this is a cummins warrenty, I would think cummins is
paying for it, Why would dodge not want to do the work???

 

DaimlerChrylser is the warrantor. Cummins Engine Company has nothing to do with it. DC purchases the engines from Cummins without warranty, then warrants them to the customer themselves.

 

As far as i know the third owner has no warranty coverage.