Im going to go help a friend later try to get his truck back running and could use some pointers. Im not near as familiar with the ve pump as i am the P-pump. His truck ran great but leaked all over, he removed it and had it sealed up at a diesel shop, when he reinstalled it on the truck he thinks he "got it out of time". Now i know on these pumps thiers accually a key used SO not sure if you can stab it out of time? Unless you can stab it 180* out????? The engine didnt get turned over in between time but he didnt lock down the shaft either. Hes bleed the system well and ran it on either for a minute or so but it wouldnt pick up and run on #2. Im wondering when i get there to spend any time trying to get it running as is or pull the pump and restab it at 180*??? Any help would be great thanks.

 

Come on know one. Really just need to know if the pump can be stabed wrong. I dont have a manual on the trucks with a ve pump. Ive been thinking about it more and could see it making since that it could be 180* off?? Any one, im to go meet him in about 2 hours. Thanks guys, Ryan

 

You really should give people a little more than an hour to respond.

So to answer your question no you can't install the pump 180deg out. But what you can do is install it without actually lining up the key, and end up tightening the nut down on the shaft and pushing the key out. So now it is out of time, or the pump isn't turning.

 

Well we know the pumps turning because he said with the inj. lines croked open and turning the engine over fuel pulses out of all 6 in a large amount. But i understand that doesnt mean its delivering it at the proper time, he said he installed the key. Just didnt know if the position of the pump mattered being its a rotory style pump, and ya know see it couldnt be 180 out i was thinking it could be 360* out? Does this make since, so can it be out 360*? ryan

 

Re-read apwatson's post. Just because the pump turns does not mean that the key is in the slot.

 

I understand that, thats what i meant when i said, its pumping but that dont mean its pumping fuel at the correct time. All i know is he said he installed the key, but didnt lock down the pump/ so were not sure if when he re-installed it that its correctly timed due to the pump not being locked down and turned who knows where? All i need to know is if the pump could be stabbed 360* off. Thanks Ryan.

 

It is possible to put the pump internals back together 180* out of time.

The pin on the cam-plate should be in line with the two key-ways on the drive-shaft.

It can be installed exactly opposite, and everything will rotate and function, but it will not be in time with the camshaft.


Take a good light and one of those mirrors-on-a-stick and examine the pump-key/gear-slot alignment; the big nut will have to be off to see.

It is a big help, when installing the pump, to take a white-out pen and mark across the end of the pump-shaft, in line with the key; then, you can look in the mirror and see if the key is indeed lined up.

Also, a drop of super-glue will keep the key from falling out.


The last one I installed had stopped such that the pump-cam had to be on a lobe, instead of at rest in a valley, thus requiring me to hold the shaft in position and lock it, before it would line up with the gear.

 

Not possible to be 360* out.

There is a key-way in the gear; there is a key in the shaft; if the key is lined with the shaft, it can only be out of time at the cam-plate inside the pump.

If you were close, yet the key didn't line up, it should still be close enough to start/run, just not as good as it should.

Of course, I would want to know where did the key end up; no where good, I am sure.

 

If it ran on ether it should run on diesel, probably still too much air in the fuel system. Keep bleeding it. If that doesn't get it, you may want to pull the pump and make sure the key is in there and do what BearKiller said. And if you go that far you just as well find true TDC on the compression stroke and remove the bolts from the timing cover, pry it open enough to see if the pump gear is on the right marks and re-install the pump.

 

if it runs on either and not by its self then the timmings out, if the saft wast locked then the timming is out, put the motor at tdc and line the key on the pump saft up to the line that is on the circular ring on the out side of the saft seal, the line is around 5:30
you cant have a pump out 360 but if its out 15 degs it wont run
Joel

 

Thanks guys for the responses. I never did get it going. I found a mess when i got there, the pump shop or someone had locked the pump down and when this guy reinstalled it- he didnt unlock it. Not sure if this damaged the pump or not but when i pulled the pin you could see all kinds of ware on it from him trying to start it with it locked down. I started there and spaced the pin back out from the shaft with a washer and removed the shaft nut and washer to find that there was no key installed. I pulled the pump and messed with it and answered my earlier Q, about timing- in 1 full revolution of the pump it hits all 6 cyinders so it cant be 360* out, this is what i was trying to fiqure ou tbefore i went to jack with it. I went a got a key super glued it in re insatlled it timed correctly and it still wont run on #2. Cranks right up and runs great on ether but wont pick up and run on diesel? Something wierd though: crack the supply line at the pump and turn the engine over and no full will sput out of the open line/ But manually pump the lever and fuel pours out of the cracked line? What gives? Im wondering if the lobe could be flat on the cam, but it ran great before it just leaked diesel everywhere he said? I spent a long time on it and got frustrated and left. Maybe also a gasket installed wrong in the pump? It do not look like a professonal re seal job, big red gaskets sticking out 1/4" all over the thing, either way it still does not run and it is a pain to work on compaired to my p-pumped 12v.. Ryan

 

Sounds like the pump got trashed by trying to start it with the lock engaged A decent VE will pull its own fuel without the help of a lift pump, so you can rule that out, provided the IP itself was primed. No keyway installed? Yikes. Sounds like it's time to start over with a fresh pump. I can't agree that a p-pump is easier to work on, but to each his/her own, eh?

 

timing is still out be carfull you dont hydrolock the motor, put the timming pin in its place and also the pump saft in the right place and it will be fine

i once forgot that the lock was on it didnt mess the pump up just the tip of the screw
Joel

 

I would bet that many is the pump that has been locked and forgotten.

It would be an easy blunder to make.

 

Joel, it did in fact hydro lock once while turning it over. Bad sound. once it got past it it was fine and never did it again. i got it spinning before hitting it with the gas, i suppose its still out of time... but not familur enough w/o a book to correct it for now. I dont think it is out from the way i set it up but it sounds like it could be put together wrong in the pump and be 180* out correct?? Thanks for thr responses guys. ~Ryan~