We should start a sound library. I did shoot video of the gray white smoke from the tail pipe. I just drove it again thrashingcows. It even pings at idle. The truck never smoked before this pump rebuild. I did something wrong.

So far searching nets me a few items.

1) Throttle shaft indexing. Are their factory markings to match up? I made my own.
2) Collar and ball connected.
3) Stop lever indexing. Does shut engine off ok.
4) FSS connected. What is that?
5) Top hat assembled correctly.

Edit: Here is the video I shot with my cell. The sound is actually pretty good. It plays with Quicktime on my 'puter. YMMV.

http://rotordesign.com/1993cumminspi...009_170138.3gp

 

Thanks for the vid....

I think you have air getting in some where...check and re-torque all the fittings from your lift pump to the injectors.

As for your questions...

1) If you indexed it your self then it should be good to go.
2)If the collar was not connected to the ball you wouldn't be running.
3)Not sure of the problems with a shut down lever indexed wrong, but I think your OK.
4)FSS = Factory Shutdown Solenoid...if the truck shuts off with the Key...then it's working.
5)Not sure on that one.

 

I can recheck all fittings. Would there not be a fuel leak somewhere? Not sure I've ever heard of an air leak. I've ready about folks with bubbles in the fuel line. They just never mention if there was fuel seepage as well.

Are there ways to check for air leaks?

So there are no factory marks on the throttle shaft. I didn't see any. Since I had the top of the pump open several times I just wonder if I missed something. I was careful.

The top hat is the spring and washer attached to the back end of the governor bracket.

At least the pump does not leak fuel any more.

 

Just looking at these items and trying to better understand what it does to the pump and engine before I rip anything apart again. I'll start with the governor since it's the biggest change on how the pump was rebuilt.

There is one thing that I think is odd. When I took the governor shaft out, the weights fell out. But the washer was still in there. That means the thrust washer was behind the weights, not in front of it. I have pics of all of that. So when I reassembled the governor, I put the washer in front of the weights in their little grooves. It all actuated the same either way. But the difference might be that the governor's sliding sleeve may have moved the thickness of the washer. Would that not cause a much different throttle/mixture response?

At nearly the bottom of the page of Jim Lane's diagram, the governor parts in question are item number 115, 114, 805, 112.

114 is the washer. See how it's to the left of the weights (805)? That's how I put it back together. When I pulled it apart the washer (114) was to the right of the weights (805). The 64 thousand dollar question is do these 2 ways of assembly move the sleeve (115) in or out some distance and therefore change the fuel output curve?

Here's the trick: the weights have a groove in them above their feet. Does this mount the washer even further toward the sleeve?

Will this placement of the washer make my truck puke so much gray smoke and ping like mad??




Here is my governor with the weights pulled nearly fully open. You can see the washer, kind of a blue color in this pic, behind the end of the sleeve, after the rebuild.



Here is a view of a VW pump with the washer mounted on top of the weights. Source: http://gnarlodious.com/Vanagon/Bosch_Pump/-Rebuild.html



Here is a great view of the governor as borrowed from http://www.4crawler.com/Diesel/Governor/index.shtml
This diagram does not show a washer in this VW IP.

 

Has anyone measured their smoke screw from a pump that has not been tampered with? I'm wondering if my fuel screw is way off since the washer in the governor moved things somewhat.

I'm thinking that the difference between the 2 potential washer locations, could be the equivalent to many turns of the smoke screw.

 

I called a couple of pump shop owners today. Having gray smoke they say my timing is off. One guy said specifically that it was retarded. I wish I understood how, since the key on the pump was exactly back where it was when I took the pump out. I made scratch marks on the nose of the pump.

Both shops agreed that the washer goes in front of the governor weights, nut under them.

I still need to check for air leaks.

One major problem one of them talked about was DIY folks end up smashing the key into the gear hole, not aligning it with the key slot, and cranking the nut down, and flattening out the key. often cracking the pump shaft. He said it happens all of the time. When I installed the pump it felt like it went in right. I didn't think to use a mirror to look at the gear to see if the key and the slot were aligned. He said I need to put the engine at tdc, lock the pump and then remove it to see if it's timed correctly. I'm much more inclined to try and stuff a dial indicator into the back of the pump to check for lift. That way I only have to remove the 6 injector lines and not everything else.

The governor shaft is suppose to be set too. The very end of the governor shaft as it sticks out is suppose to be made flush with the mounting face of the pump, then turned in 1.75 turns, then tighten the lock nut. I set mine to the same place as it was when I got it. I turned the governor shaft all of the way in and counted the turns as I did that. I got 2.6 turns. So during the rebuild, I bottomed it and turned it out 2.6 turns, then locked it with the nut. I asked how the fuel screw is set. He said it's set using a fuel flow machine in the shop.

Because of this post below, I'm going to try and check the pump lift at tdc to hopefully save the labor of taking the pump out again. The engine plate says 1.25mm at tdc. I need to get a barring tool somewhere to rotate the engine. Maybe I can use the flywheel teeth to rotate it.
http://www.cumminsforum.com/forum/89...mp-timing.html

 

White/grey smoke usually indicates air getting into the system. Not unheard of to have an air leak, with no visible sign of leaks.

As for timing...the VE IP does not need any special timing...other then the 1.25mm setting. As for mashing the key and cracking the shaft...I have never come across this mentioned in any of the threads I've searched here on the DTR and other sites. I have come across many people who have had the key not slide in right, or come out and fall into the timing case...me included.

You can pull the oil fill neck and with a mirror and a piece of wire you can feel to make sure the key is seated properly and in place.

If you measured you gov' shaft before and set it to the same after then I think you will be OK...as for the washer...well that might affect things but can't see it causing white smoke.

 

Sadly, now you have an example. I mushroomed the pump shaft key. I can't believe it. I just now got it out. Took filing, grinding and finally a punch and hammer rotated it out. The key way is fine. I'll get a new key from the hardware store but I won't install it until I talk to the pump shop in the morning. I want to make sure the material selection of the key is close. All of these years of building Mopars and I can't get the key engaged in the slot. There's a joke in there somewhere....

Before I took the pump out I used my mirror and flashlight to clearly see nothing was in the gear key way after I took the nut off. Totally empty. Tried to get a picture but I didn't have a 3rd hand to hold the flashlight. But it was very obvious. So that's a good thing to check that the slot has the key engaged in it, before adding the nut and lock washer. I also checked the throttle shaft indexing and it was fine. I think I set the TDC on the dampener correctly. But I have to look that up. It won't matter much. The key was right next to the slot. So during install the key won't be far off.

I did learn that the fuel line going to the front of the pump can be left in place and not be in the way at all. That was a nice help. Working half as hard I got the pump out twice as fast. The second time's a charm.

 

Well there you go. I know with mine I couldn't get the two to line up perfectly, and the key kept puking out. So I ended up taking off the timing cover and doing it that way. Still took me close to two hours to finally get everything installed properly.

 

does the engine have to be on tdc to install the pump like the vid shows or can i rotate the pump to match the gear or rotate the engine to match the pump? shouldn't matter since the pump is keyed right?

 

TDC is for a pump brand new/reman out of the box. Brand new they are set up for TDC installation only. The key is line up with the line on the nose of the pump. Since they are keyed, as long as the pump key is lined up with the gear key way, it's all good.

The only thing I don't know yet is if the gear can be made to skip a tooth when the pump is removed. Have not found out yet how the gear is held in place.

 

Man I hope I can avoid taking the timing cover off. But I can see it being a necessity. The old key was a tight fit in the pump shaft. I had no fear of it falling out. It did have a deep mark on one side. That may make the fit tighter. The key from the hardware store is slip fit, but not secure like the last one. We'll see what the pump shop says.

I can't wait to see how it runs after fixing this disaster.

 

Even a new/reman pump can be moved. Line the pump shaft up with the timing gear and install. The VE IP does not need any special timing, since it rotates twice for every single engine rotation.

As for the gear skipping a tooth...it's possible, and I believe it's happened. It's only held in place by the shaft on the IP. Once removed from the IP it kind of slips down to rest against the lower gear, and the side of the case.

Some guys have lock-tited their new keys in place, so that they would pop out during installation.

 

The pump is back in. Runs better. Way more power. No gray smoke at idle. But some off idle through full throttle.

First pic is how I verified that the key was in the gear's slot. You can see the very end of the key nearest to the shaft. The key only sticks up barely 1/16" above the shaft. Doing this gave me far more confidence.


When I was torquing the nut on it didn't feel so mushy going on. Here's another hint. The threads of the pump stick out past the nut about 1.5 threads worth. The shaft was flush with the nut when the key got mushroomed.


The far left key is the new one from Cummins. The middle one is the one that got mushroomed. The right one came from the hardware store. The new one and the middle one both have a deep mark in the middle of the key. This distorts the keys slightly so they both are a tighter fit! This keep them from falling out during pump install.

 

As for the smoke. If I understand correctly my timing is still a bit retarded causing excess unburnt fuel. The pump now looks a bit more advanced than it originally was. The first pic is where the pump timing is set now. The second pic was the pump timing when I received the truck.