Ok, my 92 Dodge 350 has problems. We travel country fulltime and we pull a 5th wheel (not SUPER heavy, but 30ft 1 slide). We were on our way from Texas to San Diego and we were in Prescott Arizona and we did a really steep hill with the trailer, which was probably a bad idea in hindsight, but on the hill we overheated and with the smell of overheating we smelled trans fluid. So we immediately pulled over and I checked things and once it cooled we nursed it back to town. What we discovered was that the Heat exchanger had "popped internally" (or so the mechanic put it) and flooded the tranny with coolant, so the trans fluid looked like milk. I asked the diesel mechanic if it could be recovered, and he said yes, and that we needed a trans cooler to replace the heat exchanger, and to drain and flush the coolant/fluid mix. He then discovered that my torque converter seal had gone, and $1400 later, gave us the truck, which on the way to Flagstaff was overheating again and the trans was smelling burnt...like the fluid was getting burnt. Well, the mechanic did NOT stand behind his work and said that we would now need to either get a rebuilt trans or revuild this one to fix it (this without looking at it, since we were now 100 miles away). This is the most I've ever felt burned by a mechanic in my life, but that is neither here nor there.

So, we get to San Diego where my brother in law lives, and he says "Let's take look! and we'll change the filter and re-do the fluid (which I found out the mechanic had put in Dexron/Mercon after I told him I wanted Mopar ATF+4). At the time we opened up the pan (yesterday)...the truck drives ok, but seems to be slow into gear (which I was hoping was the incredibly burnt fluid which is in it), and sometimes we can do 50 miles with NO problems at all, even with the trailer (I know this from the drive into San Diego) except on fairly large hills. Other times, we start it and it starts over heating the trans about 3 miles out and we have to nurse it and stop (3 minutes) and go again every mile or two, and this has even happened without the trailer. At this moment in time, I'd like to extend the life of this transmission for the absolute longest I can humanly do so, because I just don;t have the money for a rebuilt until I can get on the road and work.

So (once again), we opened it up and drained it, and the trans fluid was brown...we dropped the pan and there was no visible metal in the pan, the magnet had the normal amount of dust on it, but in the bottom was some slim pieces of what seemed like almost pressboard or cardboard or even possibly brittle plastic that were about as wide as scotch tape (maybe a little thinner) and maybe 1/4 to 3/4 inches long, and there was about 10 such pieces, and then a few flakes of what is obviously the same stuff. Now this got me thinking in two directions...first, this trans is nearing critical, although in going back east I drive RIGHT past Phoenix Transmission (If I can at least make it get there) which is the best cheapest option for a trans right now I think, and I could get work on the way to afford the trans. Secondly, what I wondered was if the pieces could be acting like a clogged fuel filter does on most gas cars...drive, it sucks up the junk, clogs the filter, pull over a couple minutes, the junk drops to the bottom and the car runs again... Because it almost seems like this is how the trans overheat and slippage is. Pretty intermittent.

So, my main questions:

1. What does it sound like those "strips" are? I could even take a picture of them and post if someone thinks they could really identify this.
2. The mechanic insists there is NO need for doge tranny fluid in 1st gens. I always thought we NEED atf+3 or 4. Which is right?
3. Does my theory on the intermittent nature of things make ANY sense? Could this be?
4. What advice would you give for this whole thing, for at least getting it over to Phoenix, if not being able to fix it?
5. Anything else of use would be great, and feel free to ask ANYTHING you need and I will check back and follow up.

James

 

Sorry to hear of your troubles. This is just a guess, but it sounds like the friction material coming off the bands.

My 1993 factory service manual states: Mopar ATF Plus, type 7176 is the preferred fluid, but Dexron II can be used if the other isn't available. Copyright 1992. Dexron III and IV haven't been invented when this was printed.

It also states in the trouble shooting guide:

Shifts Delayed or erratic, Shifts also hard at times,

1. Low Fluid
2. Throttle linkage out of adjustment
3. Throttle linkage binding
4. Gearshift linkage out of adjustment
5. Fluid filter partially clogged
6.Air in fluid due to overfilled or air leakage at pump suction
7. Clutch servo problem
8. First band out of adjustment

You might want to get a large transmission auxillary cooler hook it up. And a trans temp gauge so you can maybe catch it before it cooks the fluid. Synthetics are very expensive but they can handle the higher temps better than regular fluid.

Just some ideas, hope they help.

 

I hate to tell you this. Rebuild time. Those pieces are clutch lining.
Trans is more than likely slipping & overheating. The debris in the pan would make that worse by plugging the filter.

As for the fluid, the owners manual for my 1991 says "type 7176 (ATF PLUS)", DEXRON II only if 7176 is unavailable.
TSB 21-010-06 states all vehicles specifying ATF+, +2, +3 & +4 should use ATF +4. I would use +3 or +4 myself.

 

I second Rampage. Sounds like clutch lining in your pan. I run Walmart brand ATF +3 in my 93 A518. Haven't seen it on the shelve at Walley World for a while. Maybe they don't carry it anymore??? Pep Boys or any decent auto parts place should have +3.

 

Thanks guys. Sigh.

Do you all think that cleaning it all out, new filter totally new fluid, that it should be able to make it to Phoenix from San Diego? On I-8 there is one BIG mountain and some hills. If I can get the money together, and make it to Phoenix, all my troubles should be solved, since they include a heavy duty towing TC and the rebuilt trnasmission under warrantee.

Anyway, since I don't have that much choice, I guess I better cross my fingers and re-assemble tomorrow morning.

I'll let you know how it goes.

Oh, one last thing, do any of those slip helping things (Slick 50 transmission treatment and such) actually help and do you think they might actually get me to Phoenix?

James

 

I wouldn't put anything other than +3 or +4 in it; they might try to void the warranty if they find a non-authorized fluid in it.

Best wishes - I remember that hill (and towing a 5er over it in the summer).

DBF

 

Put atf+4 in it. it will hold up to the heat better then any thing Else!

I don't now how many quarts it takes on a refill but i would find out and fill it!

I had a new durango that would overheat if 5 miles cus it had the wrong dip stick and was over filling it by 4 quarts!

It would blow oil out every were

probably not the problem but something to think about when your refilling it!

You wouldn't thing that over filling an auto tranny would be that bug of a deal but it will over heat in a quick hurry!!!!!!

 

My opinion...bad news, Anti freeze is death to trans clutches, i don't think you will get very far with it now. My recomendation is to get a rebuilt and install it while you are at a place you can install it yourself instead of getting stuck on the highway at a strangers mercy. Flush the lines and cooler, Put a filter inline just before the fluid goes back into the trans to catch any debris that might be in the system to save your new trans.

 

I think you need to make some changes. Running a truck like that pulling a 30' 5th wheel, with the screw "turned to the lock", as per you signature, with and A518 trans in the mountains, doesn't sound to fun. Especially if you are trying to run in overdrive. You need to spend $2000-$3000 and get you a built tranny if your gonna run like that. I pull that much with mine, but the pump is set at stock, I don't go in the mountains, and I ALWAYS, and I mean ALWAYS pull in 3rd and never in OD.

 

FWIW,

This is my opinion---sorry to say

You need to rebuld it, that "cardboard" material is probably from the front band. If the "mechanic" adjusted it too loose, that cooked it. If you drive it now the band and your front(direct) drum will be metal on metal and will destroy more parts. You need to "FLUSH" out the WHOLE system. If there are any check valves to control "drain back" you need to remove them. If they plug, which is possible you will burn up another transmission very quickly. You will need a new converter (it's probably full of debris) and the VB will need to be disassembled and cleaned VERY well.

 

Metal is front band,driving it,I doubt you will make it,I wouldnt try it if i were you,if you dont make it,its going to cost you twice what a trans will in towing bills and down time.

 

Most time folks never come back to report the end results of their little dramas that bring them here. My drama ends with us (my brother in-law and myself) doing everything we can to the trans (new filter, changed fluid, etc.) and us crossing our fingies and making the run for Pheonix...we made it, the trans was changed out and all is well. Exdcept now I have to look for info on the T-fitting I need to put in my temp gauge probe on the hot outflow....any takers?

Me

 

Half-inch NPT tee, standard at any hardware store. Male at the connection to the output line.

I didn't bother with one. I just put the sensor in there and tied the factory switch up out of the way.

Regards, DBF

 

sounds like a rebuild time, Did the guy repair the cooler in the radiator or just install an external one. If he bypasted the radiator I would have it fixed correctly than run through the radiator, then through the external cooler for extra cooling.
Good luck

 

Cool, on the half inch NPT tee. That can work. Thank you!

The heat exchanger on this one is not IN the radiator, it's a big "pill shaped" thing that was bolted on the engine area. It "popped inside" (according to the guy who ran the bypass), and so we bypassed it and ran a cooler underbed, and now I'm thining of adding a SECOND cooler on the radiator front (in addition to the one that dodge has)...I need to cool as much or more than the "heat exchanger" without the exchanger because dodge says "We don;t make it anymore...sorry.." and no aftermarket version either.

Anyway, suggestions on supercooling the trans fluid ARE appreciated.

James