Fusible Link Abatement
03-14-2007, 10:48 PM
#31
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Okay guys, tonight one of the fuses blew and the top three message center lights came on only when the HVAC were in any position but OFF. Along with that my heater fan quit working and the power windows and door locks.... That fuse traced back to the Pink Wire in the wiring diagrams that go to the 30 amp igintion fuse. So I put a 30 Amp fuse in that slot and now everything is back to normal. I then tried running the heater with the fan on high and operating the power windows and lock all at the same time and it didn't blow. We will see what happens.....
I also ended up tearing the whole dash apart to try to find a short in teh wiring that woudl make those lights go on when that fuse blows, but I couldn't find anything.
I also ended up tearing the whole dash apart to try to find a short in teh wiring that woudl make those lights go on when that fuse blows, but I couldn't find anything.
03-15-2007, 02:45 PM
#32
Adminstrator-ess
30 amps sounds about right, the blower motor draws a good load. Remember back when cars had 35 amp alternators and you could hear the blower motor speed up when you pulled away from a traffic light?
I think the power windows use a 30A self resetting breaker.
I think the power windows use a 30A self resetting breaker.
06-06-2009, 10:52 AM
#34
Registered User
Although I am no expert, I sort of think the fuse recommendations that were given to 4RnrRick by the electrical engineer were somewhat conservative for the application.
The "protection" should be sized according to the AWG (gauge) of the wire being protected.
I "think" the engineer recommended fuse sizes to protect the gauge of the links themselves, which are of much smaller gauge than the wires they themselves are supposed to protect.
Read this (all of it), then scroll to the chart of fuse recommendations for given sizes of wire :
http://www.bcae1.com/fuses.htm
I hope ^^this^^ helps in making choices for fuse-link replacement by breakers/fuses.
QUESTION :
Does anyone know where all the factory-supplied fuse-links are located, what color wire they protect, and what circuit each link is protecting ??
THANKS 
The "protection" should be sized according to the AWG (gauge) of the wire being protected.
I "think" the engineer recommended fuse sizes to protect the gauge of the links themselves, which are of much smaller gauge than the wires they themselves are supposed to protect.
Read this (all of it), then scroll to the chart of fuse recommendations for given sizes of wire :
http://www.bcae1.com/fuses.htm
I hope ^^this^^ helps in making choices for fuse-link replacement by breakers/fuses.
Does anyone know where all the factory-supplied fuse-links are located, what color wire they protect, and what circuit each link is protecting ??
06-06-2009, 01:37 PM
#35
Registered User
Gosh!!! What A Rat's Nest !!!
Wife's truck, 1991.5 model.
So far as I know, all of the circuits are still working, but I am trying to clear up this mess before it does cause problems.
Once I got fifty-seven miles of old nasty tape, thirty-nine filthy plastic zip-ties, and two short fat pieces of plastic loom out of the way, here is what I can see so far :
That "duck-foot" connector that splits off several wires from the fat BLACK alternator-charge-wire is missing in action, as in completely gone.
Everything that connects to the battery end of the fat BLACK wire is simply soldered to the stub-end of the big wire.
There is a fat GREEN wire that connects the two ends of the fat BLACK wire together; a fusible-link(FL), I am assuming.
1. Soldered directly into the big BLACK wire(BBW) is a RED wire of around 12AWG. This wire follows the factory bundle forward, toward the front of the truck. Where does this wire go ?? and should it not also be fused ??(I am sort of thinking this wire goes to the starter-relay, but not certain.)
2. Also connected at the BBW is a WHITE ?FL? (More info: This WHITE ?FL? turned out to be a short section of plain old 18AWG lamp-cord.) that feeds a PINKISH-RED wire 10AWG. this RED wire is in the bundle that proceeds toward the fire-wall and cab. What is this RED wire ??
3. Connected at the RED wire is a ?YELLOW? FL (More info: This YELLOW FL is marked 22GA.) that feeds a smallish RED wire, 18 or 20AWG. This RED wire is in the bundle going towards the front of the truck. What is this smallish RED wire ??
4. Also connected to the BBW is an ORANGE FL (More info: This ORANGE FL is marked 20GA.)that goes immediately into a plastic connector that feeds a 16AWG BLACK/RED-STRIPE wire that is in the bundle at the cab/firewall. What is this BLACK/RED-STRIPE wire ?? and why does it warrant a connector ??
5. Also connected to BBW is another ORANGE FL (More info: another 20GA)that feeds a 10AWG PINK/BLACK-STRIPE wire in the firewall/cab bundle. What is this PINK/BLACK-STRIPE wire ??
6. Also connected to BBW is a BROWN FL (More info: This BROWN FL is marked 18GA. )feeding a 10AWG RED/WHITE-STRIPE wire in the firewall/cab bundle. What is this RED/WHITE-STRIPE wire ??
All AWG sizes given are educated guesses and may not be 100% accurate to the actual size. (When compared side by side, the 10-ish looking wires appear to be more likely 12AWG.)
Thanks.
So far as I know, all of the circuits are still working, but I am trying to clear up this mess before it does cause problems.
Once I got fifty-seven miles of old nasty tape, thirty-nine filthy plastic zip-ties, and two short fat pieces of plastic loom out of the way, here is what I can see so far :
That "duck-foot" connector that splits off several wires from the fat BLACK alternator-charge-wire is missing in action, as in completely gone.
Everything that connects to the battery end of the fat BLACK wire is simply soldered to the stub-end of the big wire.
There is a fat GREEN wire that connects the two ends of the fat BLACK wire together; a fusible-link(FL), I am assuming.
1. Soldered directly into the big BLACK wire(BBW) is a RED wire of around 12AWG. This wire follows the factory bundle forward, toward the front of the truck. Where does this wire go ?? and should it not also be fused ??(I am sort of thinking this wire goes to the starter-relay, but not certain.)
2. Also connected at the BBW is a WHITE ?FL? (More info: This WHITE ?FL? turned out to be a short section of plain old 18AWG lamp-cord.) that feeds a PINKISH-RED wire 10AWG. this RED wire is in the bundle that proceeds toward the fire-wall and cab. What is this RED wire ??
3. Connected at the RED wire is a ?YELLOW? FL (More info: This YELLOW FL is marked 22GA.) that feeds a smallish RED wire, 18 or 20AWG. This RED wire is in the bundle going towards the front of the truck. What is this smallish RED wire ??
4. Also connected to the BBW is an ORANGE FL (More info: This ORANGE FL is marked 20GA.)that goes immediately into a plastic connector that feeds a 16AWG BLACK/RED-STRIPE wire that is in the bundle at the cab/firewall. What is this BLACK/RED-STRIPE wire ?? and why does it warrant a connector ??
5. Also connected to BBW is another ORANGE FL (More info: another 20GA)that feeds a 10AWG PINK/BLACK-STRIPE wire in the firewall/cab bundle. What is this PINK/BLACK-STRIPE wire ??
6. Also connected to BBW is a BROWN FL (More info: This BROWN FL is marked 18GA. )feeding a 10AWG RED/WHITE-STRIPE wire in the firewall/cab bundle. What is this RED/WHITE-STRIPE wire ??
All AWG sizes given are educated guesses and may not be 100% accurate to the actual size. (When compared side by side, the 10-ish looking wires appear to be more likely 12AWG.)
Thanks.
06-06-2009, 08:58 PM
#37
Registered User
Cleaning Out The Rat's Nest
Although not hardly finished, I got the worst of the fuse-link rat's nest in a lot better order than Chrysler had it in, and a WHOLE LOT better than the previous owner's cobbling; I even found a fuse-link replaced with a section of house-hold lamp-cord, one side of the two-sided stuff.
I crimp/soldered 12AWG leads to every wire in that mess, eliminating the fuse-links and splicing to the actual wires.
I had previously mounted a BERG brand(never heard of them before), made in USA, plastic breaker box w/lid, that holds SIX self-resetting breakers.
An 8AWG wire feeds a hammered flat and drilled to fit copper tubing "bar" that catches all six of the HOT-side studs on the breakers.
I routed the bigger stuff into this breaker-box and the smaller wires are connected to a fuse-block with ATC/ATO fuses.
We fired her up and turned ON everything we could think of and everything seems to work.
During this quest, I found another fuse-link that isn't connected to the big BLACK wire.
7. This little PINK 20-ish AWG wire comes out of the fire-wall/cab bundle, goes through a YELLOW 22GA FL, then proceeds forward, joining alongside a slightly larger 16AWG BROWN wire. What is this PINK wire ??
8. In the area of the "duck-foot", where all those fuse-links used to be, there is nothing left connected to the big BLACK charge-wire, except for it going through it's own fat GREEN FL. From it's terminal at the alternator, until it makes the route over to the battery, is there anything else spliced into the big BLACK wire ??
Thanks.
I crimp/soldered 12AWG leads to every wire in that mess, eliminating the fuse-links and splicing to the actual wires.
I had previously mounted a BERG brand(never heard of them before), made in USA, plastic breaker box w/lid, that holds SIX self-resetting breakers.
An 8AWG wire feeds a hammered flat and drilled to fit copper tubing "bar" that catches all six of the HOT-side studs on the breakers.
I routed the bigger stuff into this breaker-box and the smaller wires are connected to a fuse-block with ATC/ATO fuses.
We fired her up and turned ON everything we could think of and everything seems to work.
During this quest, I found another fuse-link that isn't connected to the big BLACK wire.
7. This little PINK 20-ish AWG wire comes out of the fire-wall/cab bundle, goes through a YELLOW 22GA FL, then proceeds forward, joining alongside a slightly larger 16AWG BROWN wire. What is this PINK wire ??
8. In the area of the "duck-foot", where all those fuse-links used to be, there is nothing left connected to the big BLACK charge-wire, except for it going through it's own fat GREEN FL. From it's terminal at the alternator, until it makes the route over to the battery, is there anything else spliced into the big BLACK wire ??
Thanks.
06-07-2009, 04:10 AM
#39
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Another source for quality electric system parts is Wrangler North West I have been using them for years just download the catalog from the site. And they make custom cables to your specs.
As I am big on having properly setup and neat electrical systems I have quite a few links for equipment listed below.
Waytek Wire - Major supplier thing Granger but just wiring equipment.
Electrical Terminal Service - general supplies
4x4 Mods - custom rocker switches
Cole Hersee - Manufacturer of many electrical components.
As I am big on having properly setup and neat electrical systems I have quite a few links for equipment listed below.
Waytek Wire - Major supplier thing Granger but just wiring equipment.
Electrical Terminal Service - general supplies
4x4 Mods - custom rocker switches
Cole Hersee - Manufacturer of many electrical components.
Last edited by Bogie; 06-07-2009 at 04:11 AM. Reason: spelling
06-07-2009, 09:42 AM
#40
Adminstrator-ess
OK. You are 100% sure there aren't two air temp switches/sensors in the intake manifold? All intercooled trucks should have two, the '91.5 trucks used a PCM mounted between the battery and the fender and are wired differently than both the non-intercooled trucks and the '92-'93 trucks. I'm trying to get a handle on exactly what we are dealing with before I decide which wiring diagram to pore over for an hour...
Crank position sensor started in '92.
Crank position sensor started in '92.
06-07-2009, 11:09 AM
#41
Registered User
Truck IS factory intercooled.
On Update: There ARE TWO temperature-sensors on top of the intake, behind the grid-heater.
The fore one is the smaller and has two black/blue striped wires; the aft one is the larger and has a blue and a white wire.
If it helps, it does have the over-drive button on the dash and it does have the overdrive transmission.
But the voltage regulator is factory original wiring, with no splices like it would have had it been switched, and the wires are factory color.
06-09-2009, 05:58 PM
#43
Adminstrator-ess
Wife's truck, 1991.5 model.
So far as I know, all of the circuits are still working, but I am trying to clear up this mess before it does cause problems.
Once I got fifty-seven miles of old nasty tape, thirty-nine filthy plastic zip-ties, and two short fat pieces of plastic loom out of the way, here is what I can see so far :
That "duck-foot" connector that splits off several wires from the fat BLACK alternator-charge-wire is missing in action, as in completely gone.
Everything that connects to the battery end of the fat BLACK wire is simply soldered to the stub-end of the big wire.
There is a fat GREEN wire that connects the two ends of the fat BLACK wire together; a fusible-link(FL), I am assuming.
1. Soldered directly into the big BLACK wire(BBW) is a RED wire of around 12AWG. This wire follows the factory bundle forward, toward the front of the truck. Where does this wire go ?? and should it not also be fused ??(I am sort of thinking this wire goes to the starter-relay, but not certain.)You are correct. The diagrams do not show any fusing on that wire.
2. Also connected at the BBW is a WHITE ?FL? (More info: This WHITE ?FL? turned out to be a short section of plain old 18AWG lamp-cord.) that feeds a PINKISH-RED wire 10AWG. this RED wire is in the bundle that proceeds toward the fire-wall and cab. What is this RED wire ?? Red wire runs to ignition switch and feeds fuses 11, 12, & 13.
3. Connected at the RED wire is a ?YELLOW? FL (More info: This YELLOW FL is marked 22GA.) that feeds a smallish RED wire, 18 or 20AWG. This RED wire is in the bundle going towards the front of the truck. What is this smallish RED wire ??Main battery feed to the PCM.
4. Also connected to the BBW is an ORANGE FL (More info: This ORANGE FL is marked 20GA.)that goes immediately into a plastic connector that feeds a 16AWG BLACK/RED-STRIPE wire that is in the bundle at the cab/firewall. What is this BLACK/RED-STRIPE wire ?? and why does it warrant a connector ??Feeds fuse 15, which runs all the convenience lights. I guess it has a connector so you can kill all that crap easily if you are trying to find a current drain?
5. Also connected to BBW is another ORANGE FL (More info: another 20GA)that feeds a 10AWG PINK/BLACK-STRIPE wire in the firewall/cab bundle. What is this PINK/BLACK-STRIPE wire ??Pink wire feeds the ignition switch and feeds fuses 1 & 2.
6. Also connected to BBW is a BROWN FL (More info: This BROWN FL is marked 18GA. )feeding a 10AWG RED/WHITE-STRIPE wire in the firewall/cab bundle. What is this RED/WHITE-STRIPE wire ??Runs the headlight switch and fuses 4, 5, & 6.
All AWG sizes given are educated guesses and may not be 100% accurate to the actual size. (When compared side by side, the 10-ish looking wires appear to be more likely 12AWG.)
Thanks.
So far as I know, all of the circuits are still working, but I am trying to clear up this mess before it does cause problems.
Once I got fifty-seven miles of old nasty tape, thirty-nine filthy plastic zip-ties, and two short fat pieces of plastic loom out of the way, here is what I can see so far :
That "duck-foot" connector that splits off several wires from the fat BLACK alternator-charge-wire is missing in action, as in completely gone.
Everything that connects to the battery end of the fat BLACK wire is simply soldered to the stub-end of the big wire.
There is a fat GREEN wire that connects the two ends of the fat BLACK wire together; a fusible-link(FL), I am assuming.
1. Soldered directly into the big BLACK wire(BBW) is a RED wire of around 12AWG. This wire follows the factory bundle forward, toward the front of the truck. Where does this wire go ?? and should it not also be fused ??(I am sort of thinking this wire goes to the starter-relay, but not certain.)You are correct. The diagrams do not show any fusing on that wire.
2. Also connected at the BBW is a WHITE ?FL? (More info: This WHITE ?FL? turned out to be a short section of plain old 18AWG lamp-cord.) that feeds a PINKISH-RED wire 10AWG. this RED wire is in the bundle that proceeds toward the fire-wall and cab. What is this RED wire ?? Red wire runs to ignition switch and feeds fuses 11, 12, & 13.
3. Connected at the RED wire is a ?YELLOW? FL (More info: This YELLOW FL is marked 22GA.) that feeds a smallish RED wire, 18 or 20AWG. This RED wire is in the bundle going towards the front of the truck. What is this smallish RED wire ??Main battery feed to the PCM.
4. Also connected to the BBW is an ORANGE FL (More info: This ORANGE FL is marked 20GA.)that goes immediately into a plastic connector that feeds a 16AWG BLACK/RED-STRIPE wire that is in the bundle at the cab/firewall. What is this BLACK/RED-STRIPE wire ?? and why does it warrant a connector ??Feeds fuse 15, which runs all the convenience lights. I guess it has a connector so you can kill all that crap easily if you are trying to find a current drain?
5. Also connected to BBW is another ORANGE FL (More info: another 20GA)that feeds a 10AWG PINK/BLACK-STRIPE wire in the firewall/cab bundle. What is this PINK/BLACK-STRIPE wire ??Pink wire feeds the ignition switch and feeds fuses 1 & 2.
6. Also connected to BBW is a BROWN FL (More info: This BROWN FL is marked 18GA. )feeding a 10AWG RED/WHITE-STRIPE wire in the firewall/cab bundle. What is this RED/WHITE-STRIPE wire ??Runs the headlight switch and fuses 4, 5, & 6.
All AWG sizes given are educated guesses and may not be 100% accurate to the actual size. (When compared side by side, the 10-ish looking wires appear to be more likely 12AWG.)
Thanks.
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06-09-2009, 06:03 PM
#44
Adminstrator-ess
During this quest, I found another fuse-link that isn't connected to the big BLACK wire.
7. This little PINK 20-ish AWG wire comes out of the fire-wall/cab bundle, goes through a YELLOW 22GA FL, then proceeds forward, joining alongside a slightly larger 16AWG BROWN wire. What is this PINK wire ??Runs the hazard lights.
8. In the area of the "duck-foot", where all those fuse-links used to be, there is nothing left connected to the big BLACK charge-wire, except for it going through it's own fat GREEN FL. From it's terminal at the alternator, until it makes the route over to the battery, is there anything else spliced into the big BLACK wire ??No.
Thanks.
06-10-2009, 12:27 AM
#45
Registered User
You have earned a steak or prime-rib.
Now we know what the wires are for that are now protected by breakers and fuses instead of those silly fuse-links.
I also intend to run these wires un-molested through the fire-wall grommet, thereby by-passing the terminal-block-gizmo-thingie and any corrossion that may be there.
I put that RED wire that went to the starter-relay on a 20-amp fuse; since it previously was not fused, will this be okay, or is that fuse gonna pop and cause a no-start some time later ?? Maybe I should put it on a breaker ??
Thanks.