Very disappointed front end work
#1
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Thread Starter
Very disappointed front end work
Went to les schwab for an estimate on front end: truck wanders all over the road and I hate it. Steering has the usual neutral zone from 11-1 (if steering wheel was a clock)
Pulled the trigger for them to fix it. Didn't do all my homework, thought for once I just wanted to pay the bucks and be done with it. I know there are a lot of upgrades but I didn't have the energy to pursue..all is "stock or better" quality.
I'm Sooo disappointed. I do believe that with well over 220k (broken odometer) the parts were worn out, but son of a gun, no improvement in the steering. None. It also feels weird when I'm turning the wheel, like I can feel a little tight, and then it slides. Can't explain, don't know the lingo or the concepts. Honestly I didn't want to know, just wanted it done right, ya know?
They know I'm unhappy and that I spent a lot of money, and of course they want me to be happy, but I haven't gone back yet to have them drive it and see what can be done. What questions should I be asking? What should I expect? What do you think it takes to actually resolve the issue? I specifically asked if my steering column was worn, while they were still in the middle of the job, and they said no.
Estimate was $1650, ended up at $2000
3 tie rods, 1 outer tie rod end
4 upper control arm bushings, 2 lower control arm bushings
Gear box (stock. Yuk)
Steering stabilizer
Track bar
Control arm bushing install without springs
Pitman arm pass/lt installation
Tie rod end pass/lt installation
Thrust angle alignment
They threw in some labor cuz it was running way over...
What do I do? I didn't have the death wobble before, and now I just hope it doesn't show up since everything is basically stock...
Pulled the trigger for them to fix it. Didn't do all my homework, thought for once I just wanted to pay the bucks and be done with it. I know there are a lot of upgrades but I didn't have the energy to pursue..all is "stock or better" quality.
I'm Sooo disappointed. I do believe that with well over 220k (broken odometer) the parts were worn out, but son of a gun, no improvement in the steering. None. It also feels weird when I'm turning the wheel, like I can feel a little tight, and then it slides. Can't explain, don't know the lingo or the concepts. Honestly I didn't want to know, just wanted it done right, ya know?
They know I'm unhappy and that I spent a lot of money, and of course they want me to be happy, but I haven't gone back yet to have them drive it and see what can be done. What questions should I be asking? What should I expect? What do you think it takes to actually resolve the issue? I specifically asked if my steering column was worn, while they were still in the middle of the job, and they said no.
Estimate was $1650, ended up at $2000
3 tie rods, 1 outer tie rod end
4 upper control arm bushings, 2 lower control arm bushings
Gear box (stock. Yuk)
Steering stabilizer
Track bar
Control arm bushing install without springs
Pitman arm pass/lt installation
Tie rod end pass/lt installation
Thrust angle alignment
They threw in some labor cuz it was running way over...
What do I do? I didn't have the death wobble before, and now I just hope it doesn't show up since everything is basically stock...
#2
I'm not sure how well I'd trust the no answer about the worn column, a lot of people wouldn't know the difference, even alignment techs. I would look into the gear box for the tight then sliding feeling. I have changed a lot of them thru the years and have had bad remans. Steering boxs can be tempermental. If it was mine I'd have them swap the box again and see if things got any better.
#3
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Thread Starter
Yes ,sounds like a good place to start. I seriously considered getting an upgraded steering box, but felt that if I didn't do some other upgrades at the same time, I might be throwing my money away. Plus I wasn't sure where I would want to get that work done.
I'm sure they are hoping this works too...
I'm sure they are hoping this works too...
#4
One other thing I thought of would be if possible take it to another shop just to have them drive it and check it out to give you a second opinion on what they think. I know the Les Schwab reputation is for the most part good. But I do know from personal experience that sometimes they miss the forest for the trees so to speak, and over look the main problem (which is usually less cost to fix) only to find what might become a problem. (Usually a big cost to fix). Moral of the story is second opinions can never hurt. Good luck.
#5
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Join Date: Aug 2006
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You probably won't experience death wobble. I'm assuming it's a 4wd since you have a stabilizer, that usually dampens the wobble. Most 2wd have a ball joint pressed into the pitman arm and when it gets worn you get serious wobble at low hwy speeds and gets worse with time. I'm not saying it can't happen with a 4wd but more uncommon.
I agree with the steering box swap. Also have the column linkage replaced with new ball joints. I know you're not interested in aftermarket but a better stabilizer helped me a ton, just fyi. Also, I installed air bags on the back and about to do the front. With air bags on the back of my last '96, I never had front end wear like on one without. It helps the front end not rise when you have a load. Aftermarket shocks are also a good investment to help save all the parts you just paid for. Just keep in mind even brand new, these trucks didn't have the most responsive steering and brakes. Good luck, keep us posted.
I agree with the steering box swap. Also have the column linkage replaced with new ball joints. I know you're not interested in aftermarket but a better stabilizer helped me a ton, just fyi. Also, I installed air bags on the back and about to do the front. With air bags on the back of my last '96, I never had front end wear like on one without. It helps the front end not rise when you have a load. Aftermarket shocks are also a good investment to help save all the parts you just paid for. Just keep in mind even brand new, these trucks didn't have the most responsive steering and brakes. Good luck, keep us posted.
#6
Registered User
I did my own work- took me over a month of every Saturday and part of sunday and while the items below did fix the looseness feel I also cant get the slop out of the wheel, and it also feels odd in turns- I have about a 1/8th turn of slop either way before the truck reacts on the highway. Parts I have replaced:
All tie rod ends, Pitman arm end, track bar end with lukes links.
All 8 control arm bushings with energy bushings
Front stabilizer bushings with energy bushings
Added a pump stabilizer
4 New bilstein 5100's
Even after all of that, the truck still requires me to "saw" the wheel just to hold a lane! I think I will try the Genos garage upgraded pump, but that's another expensive guess. If that doesn't work, Everyone says a T steering upgrade is the solid fix?
..... you know what, ill just go record a quick video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18TY...ature=youtu.be
All tie rod ends, Pitman arm end, track bar end with lukes links.
All 8 control arm bushings with energy bushings
Front stabilizer bushings with energy bushings
Added a pump stabilizer
4 New bilstein 5100's
Even after all of that, the truck still requires me to "saw" the wheel just to hold a lane! I think I will try the Genos garage upgraded pump, but that's another expensive guess. If that doesn't work, Everyone says a T steering upgrade is the solid fix?
..... you know what, ill just go record a quick video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18TY...ature=youtu.be
#7
Registered User
hi all
i got a 98 with plenty of stearing slop at 270,000 miles ,soooooooooo
i lnstalled the 3rd gen track bar and a stearing stablizer , still was sloppy , sooooo i took off the stearing box put in new seals and adjusted it my self , so simple a monkey could do it !
now at 329,000 miles still drives like a sports car !
i should do it for others $$$$ .
i got a 98 with plenty of stearing slop at 270,000 miles ,soooooooooo
i lnstalled the 3rd gen track bar and a stearing stablizer , still was sloppy , sooooo i took off the stearing box put in new seals and adjusted it my self , so simple a monkey could do it !
now at 329,000 miles still drives like a sports car !
i should do it for others $$$$ .
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#9
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#10
Registered User
hi ,
well as i rember it goes like this.
remove stearing box from truck .
if a greasy mess wash it all up now .
i disconnected pitman arm from tie rods and left pitman arm on box.
removed top cover dumped out fluid and replaced seal under it replaced cover. dealer charged $25 for that one seal i believe .
removed lock ring nut on end where stearing shaft connects to stearing wheel .
removed part under lock ring / nut , it screws out also
got the seals for that area from dealer also small pack with seals as i remember.
replaced seals
reinstall part with new seals
now THIS is where you adjust side to side stearing wheel slopiness !
turn in adjuster till it stops then service manuel says to back off 3/8 of a in i think .
well i backed off about 1/2 the factory adjustment as i recall .
re install lock ring/nut
last you adjust the screw in the alu top cover.just turn it in till you have no slop , too tight and stearing wheel will not return to center after a turn and wheel will drag too much to turn correctly .
when done correctly there will be a slightly firm feel when turning .
if wheel turns easily you need to be slightly tighter/ closer on the adjustments.
done mine about 3 years ago and love it .
i do have the 3rd gen track bar and stearing stablizer brace on the 98.
go almost every where with just one hand on wheel !
well as i rember it goes like this.
remove stearing box from truck .
if a greasy mess wash it all up now .
i disconnected pitman arm from tie rods and left pitman arm on box.
removed top cover dumped out fluid and replaced seal under it replaced cover. dealer charged $25 for that one seal i believe .
removed lock ring nut on end where stearing shaft connects to stearing wheel .
removed part under lock ring / nut , it screws out also
got the seals for that area from dealer also small pack with seals as i remember.
replaced seals
reinstall part with new seals
now THIS is where you adjust side to side stearing wheel slopiness !
turn in adjuster till it stops then service manuel says to back off 3/8 of a in i think .
well i backed off about 1/2 the factory adjustment as i recall .
re install lock ring/nut
last you adjust the screw in the alu top cover.just turn it in till you have no slop , too tight and stearing wheel will not return to center after a turn and wheel will drag too much to turn correctly .
when done correctly there will be a slightly firm feel when turning .
if wheel turns easily you need to be slightly tighter/ closer on the adjustments.
done mine about 3 years ago and love it .
i do have the 3rd gen track bar and stearing stablizer brace on the 98.
go almost every where with just one hand on wheel !
#11
Registered User
Thread Starter
I'm just getting back to the truck after an absence. Still need to go back to the shop, but I know 'me and I think they'll be willing to work with me...
Old blues, I never heard of an adjustment in the steering box. Hope you're not pulling my leg! Shouldnt I be able to make the same adjustment on my "new" steering box?
Guess a 3 rd gen track and steering stabilizer brace is needed. More homework to do. I just wanted to pay someone to do it right. Aftermarket parts are fine, I just wanted someone else to do this one job...
joem, I get your frustration. Let us know if something clicks. I know it will drive like a truck, not a sports car, but mine is scarry.. Couldn't get the you tube to play.?
Old blues, I never heard of an adjustment in the steering box. Hope you're not pulling my leg! Shouldnt I be able to make the same adjustment on my "new" steering box?
Guess a 3 rd gen track and steering stabilizer brace is needed. More homework to do. I just wanted to pay someone to do it right. Aftermarket parts are fine, I just wanted someone else to do this one job...
joem, I get your frustration. Let us know if something clicks. I know it will drive like a truck, not a sports car, but mine is scarry.. Couldn't get the you tube to play.?
#13
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I installed the dss on my old original worn box. When I replaced the box with the newer style, I still kept the dss just to protect it. These trucks are nose heavy so any protection is a bonus. Over the last few years, I replaced the box with the newer style, 3rd gen track bar, borgeson steering shaft and made my own drag link using the heftier GM ends and recently energy suspension bushings ( big improvement). One thing I ran into a few years back that made the steering wander like worn parts was actually binding ball joints.
I even went ahead and added a cooler to the power steering. Fit perfect on the shroud. Looks like something the factory should have done.
I even went ahead and added a cooler to the power steering. Fit perfect on the shroud. Looks like something the factory should have done.
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