Duallies verses Singles
03-25-2003, 05:36 PM
#31
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Re:Duallies verses Singles
WOW 
. Some people believe that I will be OK with what I'm doing while others believe that I may be making a big mistake by not moving into the Medium Truck range. I see that several people on this site are pulling the same weights that I am getting into, and they say they do not have a problem. If I get into a dually I thought that this would be helping the integrity of the truck. I guess the main problem here is money. To go into a medium duty truck you have to jump up to another 20 grand or more. It seemed as though Dodge was the only one who has a decent package with the most pulling power within it's class for the money. Don't get me wrong, I appreciate everyone's oppinions here and it is helping me alot. I realize that I will be approaching the max of 23,000 lbs. with everything combined. I guess I am looking at each payload seperately and then the combined weights. The info I get on Dodge's site tells me that the vehicle dry weight is 6,877 lbs. I am told that this is the dry weight of the dually, not the SRW even though you'll find this weight on both vehicles. Tell me that isn't confusing right off the bat. I hadn't noticed the GVWR before, why I don't know ??? stupid me. Maybe I am in the state of self denial. I will be visiting another dealer and will definately be pushing his buttons on this weight issue. Not that he's a genious just because he sells a product for a living that he may know little about. I will keep all posted on my overall decision. Thanks again for the input. It's a welcomed and apreciated.
. Some people believe that I will be OK with what I'm doing while others believe that I may be making a big mistake by not moving into the Medium Truck range. I see that several people on this site are pulling the same weights that I am getting into, and they say they do not have a problem. If I get into a dually I thought that this would be helping the integrity of the truck. I guess the main problem here is money. To go into a medium duty truck you have to jump up to another 20 grand or more. It seemed as though Dodge was the only one who has a decent package with the most pulling power within it's class for the money. Don't get me wrong, I appreciate everyone's oppinions here and it is helping me alot. I realize that I will be approaching the max of 23,000 lbs. with everything combined. I guess I am looking at each payload seperately and then the combined weights. The info I get on Dodge's site tells me that the vehicle dry weight is 6,877 lbs. I am told that this is the dry weight of the dually, not the SRW even though you'll find this weight on both vehicles. Tell me that isn't confusing right off the bat. I hadn't noticed the GVWR before, why I don't know ??? stupid me. Maybe I am in the state of self denial. I will be visiting another dealer and will definately be pushing his buttons on this weight issue. Not that he's a genious just because he sells a product for a living that he may know little about. I will keep all posted on my overall decision. Thanks again for the input. It's a welcomed and apreciated.
03-25-2003, 06:00 PM
#32
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Re:Duallies verses Singles
One more thing :P (I'm feeling a little long winded tonight), To move into a medium Duty truck, I know ford makes F450 or F550 that may take me into a better range. Chevy has medium duty trucks. I havent seen any medium duty trucks that are made by Dodge. Some of our discounts are the reason we are staying with Dodge. We are able to get some nice discounts through Dodge because we have immediate famliy working for DC so that's one of the reason we are going with Dodge. Not to mention that the Ram looks very impressive for what we want to do. Money...money...money. So, my next question is...does anyone know if Dodge makes a stronger pulling truck (medium duty) where all the numbers would fall into place? 
This whole thing is giving me an ulser.
This whole thing is giving me an ulser.
03-25-2003, 06:22 PM
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Re:Duallies verses Singles
Nagi,
You are buying one heck of a trailer I think you are going to love it. Don't get an ulcer over it, enjoy and think of all the fun you will have with it when you figure it all out.
My only comment was now you have the opportunity to buy what ever truck you want. You might as well get one that the manufacturer states can handle it.
Now that you know a little more about the weights of the truck, I think you should call Newmar direct and ask them what your trailer is going to weigh with the options you ordered.
You might as well figure it all out now that you have the opportunity and it is not going to cost you anything.
If I remember right the F-450 &550 can have up to a 30,000 lb GCVWR depending on how you set it up. I bet if you found a new F-450 or 550 with a 7.3 you could get a deal on it now that the 6.0 is out.
FWIW Randy
You are buying one heck of a trailer I think you are going to love it. Don't get an ulcer over it, enjoy and think of all the fun you will have with it when you figure it all out.
My only comment was now you have the opportunity to buy what ever truck you want. You might as well get one that the manufacturer states can handle it.
Now that you know a little more about the weights of the truck, I think you should call Newmar direct and ask them what your trailer is going to weigh with the options you ordered.
You might as well figure it all out now that you have the opportunity and it is not going to cost you anything.
If I remember right the F-450 &550 can have up to a 30,000 lb GCVWR depending on how you set it up. I bet if you found a new F-450 or 550 with a 7.3 you could get a deal on it now that the 6.0 is out.
FWIW Randy
03-25-2003, 06:53 PM
#34
Proprietor of Fiver's Inn and Hospitality Center
Re:Duallies verses Singles
Moss,<br><br>He may get a higher rating on that F450, but his back and rump will get a much lower rating at his doctors. They drive terrible in comparison to the new Dodge, and the ride is - - well - - it kinda rides like a truck. 
Yeh, I know, duhhhhh, it is a truck. :P There is no comparison in the comfort of our Dodge to an F450. There is no way I would want to drive some medium duty around to the store, site seeing, etc. <br><br>Nagi,<br>We looked at Newmar lines at first. Very good unit and well made. They were just too heavy. They have lightened them slightly in the past 1 1/2 years and made them a little more manageable. However, I would highly suggest you pursue the completed dry weight of your anticipated new fiver with all the accessories. Then, add about 1000 pounds for all the "stuff" you add. Then, make up your mind you will run with empty holding tanks and only a little water. If you can still hold it under 16000#, you will be fine with a dually. <br><br>Our Carriage is a 36' triple slide. I am around 15700# slightly wet. Our HO handles it fine. My truck is about 7660 pounds with the second fuel tank partially filled and the main tank filled. So, I am within my GCWR. If my holding tanks are full, water tank full and second fuel tank filled, I am overweight. <br><br>I would rather have a smaller fiver and drive the Dodge than have a larger heavier unit and have to push around a larger truck. My comfort and convenience driving is more important than another foot or two of trailer. <br><br>Bob
Yeh, I know, duhhhhh, it is a truck. :P There is no comparison in the comfort of our Dodge to an F450. There is no way I would want to drive some medium duty around to the store, site seeing, etc. <br><br>Nagi,<br>We looked at Newmar lines at first. Very good unit and well made. They were just too heavy. They have lightened them slightly in the past 1 1/2 years and made them a little more manageable. However, I would highly suggest you pursue the completed dry weight of your anticipated new fiver with all the accessories. Then, add about 1000 pounds for all the "stuff" you add. Then, make up your mind you will run with empty holding tanks and only a little water. If you can still hold it under 16000#, you will be fine with a dually. <br><br>Our Carriage is a 36' triple slide. I am around 15700# slightly wet. Our HO handles it fine. My truck is about 7660 pounds with the second fuel tank partially filled and the main tank filled. So, I am within my GCWR. If my holding tanks are full, water tank full and second fuel tank filled, I am overweight. <br><br>I would rather have a smaller fiver and drive the Dodge than have a larger heavier unit and have to push around a larger truck. My comfort and convenience driving is more important than another foot or two of trailer. <br><br>Bob
03-25-2003, 07:45 PM
#35
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Re:Duallies verses Singles
Thanks Fiver Bob; you de man... 8) Like that's what I'm talk'n about. Like I mentioned before. We have aleady taken off the generator and an air conditioner. We upgraded to a higher output airconditioner and according to Newmar, we didn't need to go with 2 airconditioners because these units have true central air systems. We are running an office as we run our business from the road. This involves some heavier printers and of course we love sea kayaking so with all of our equipment and kayaks that's 1000 lbs. right there. The dry weight of the fifth wheel is 13,025 lbs., added equipment with kayaks comes to 800 lbs. This stuff has already been weighed out. An additional 1000 lbs. as you mentioned for all of our house-hold stuff comes to 14,825. Like you said Bob, wet the tanks a little for emergencies on the road and I stand at about 15,000 lbs. I agree, the truck ain't gonna weigh no eight or 9,000 lbs. If it do, than I guess I'll just have to skip breakfast and feed on ex-lax while my wife runs along side of me. Thanks Bob, you just cured my ulser.
Thanks Bob, you just cured my ulser.
03-25-2003, 07:47 PM
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Re:Duallies verses Singles
Hi Nagi,<br>Welcome to the forum and hope to see ya around. I got to jump in and say a few words about daullies. I have a 25'TT but plan on upgrading to a 32' 5ver or so in a couple of years. Most 5ver's we have looked at are around 13-14k lbs. We opted to make the change to a daully now just to make sure we have enough truck, kind of "the horse before the cart". I have driven almost 5k miles with this truck pulling my TT. My old truck was a 94 Chevy SBEC 4x4 and we did a 3k mile trip with the same trailer. The daully is alot more stable and is wonderful pulling around semis at freeway speeds even with a 25' TT. Same TT, same hitch, just different truck. The difference was like night and day. The daully is very enjoyable to drive. I would agree, and also suggest a daully for the weight you are talking about. Pulling up to drive-up windows is an adjustment, but can be overcome very easily. Just my $0.02 Ken
03-25-2003, 09:15 PM
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Re:Duallies verses Singles
FiverBob,<br> Sounds great to me. <br> What is really neat is that the Newmar is longer and weighs 900 lbs less than your rig. I guess you learn something everyday.<br> No way I would want to drive a F-450 around either, perhaps unless I was pulling a 37" triple slide Newmar fiver around with a print shop on board to boot, fulltiming it.<br> Randy
03-25-2003, 09:24 PM
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Re:Duallies verses Singles
FiverBob,<br> I forgot I was finally glad to hear what a 2003 Dually really weighed in at ready to tow. I had been figuring it at 8000lbs. I am still going to weigh mine first chance I get. Subtracting for your aux fuel tank and some diesel in it maybe mine will come in at 7500lbs or a little less.<br> Randy
03-26-2003, 06:33 AM
#39
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Re:Duallies verses Singles
Yes, the length of 37' in a fifth wheel is somewhat of a concern. I have been pulling a 27' travel trailer around and with the proper hook-ups it wasn't to bad. I'm thinking that with about 6' of fifth wheel hanging over the bed of my truck, I'll have about 2 more feet of towing than I did with my 27 footer. So in all actuality, I will have approximately 32 feet of home following behind me, not a full 37 feet. As far as the extra length of what I'm alredy used to towing with a Ford Expedition, it will just be a matter of getting used to, kinda like walking and chewing gum at the same time. With the extra dually stability and extra diesel power, I have a hard time thinking that I will have anything but a sweet rig as I travel in comfort. The other thing that has been a concern of ours is what Bob had said, I think it would be less practical to be going to the grocery store and attempting to offload a couple of kayaks at a water's edge put-in with a F450 or F550 mini-tractor trailer rig minus the airhorns. :P<br>Nagi
03-26-2003, 11:22 AM
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Re:Duallies verses Singles
Nagi, good job of deciding to reasearch your original decision and adjust it. The dually will do just fine like Bob said. Enjoy your fifth wheel trailer and stop worrying at this point. Much of the towing restriction in these class trucks is the weakest point - stopping power. Since Dodge increased the size of the rotors and caliper pads, we can now hit the 16K tow weights, and the carry capacity was always there with the dual wheels. If I were to go into the 40' + category, I would then opt for a used Freightliner FL106 coming off a lease. My brother has been in that leasing business for a long time, and told me that a used one coming off lease, clean, good maintenance record could be gotten for about $34k, witharound 200k miles on it. That is plenty of life left, but you don't want to make grocery store and site seeing trips with it. Sorry for the long winded; point is you have made a good choice, and now enjoy it. ;D
03-26-2003, 08:24 PM
#41
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Re:Duallies verses Singles
Thanks again everyone for your replies. I took the first steps bringing this dream a little closer to reality. Today we started over fresh and placed a new order for our truck. We decided that if we were going to get a truck, why not go for top quality. We ordered the Ram 3500 Laramie, Cummins HO w/48RE Auto tranny, 4:10 rear ends, tow package, and did I forget to mention??? Yes I went with the duallies this time. The only problem that we ran into was that apparently this truck with the duallies only come in 4 color choices, so we went with the white and we'll match the graphics to the fifth wheel ourselves seeing how that's what we do. Thanks again everyone.
03-26-2003, 09:17 PM
#42
Proprietor of Fiver's Inn and Hospitality Center
Re:Duallies verses Singles
[quote author=moss2904 link=board=11;threadid=12613;start=30#120438 date=1048648547]<br>FiverBob,<br> Sounds great to me. <br> What is really neat is that the Newmar is longer and weighs 900 lbs less than your rig. I guess you learn something everyday.<br> No way I would want to drive a F-450 around either, perhaps unless I was pulling a 37" triple slide Newmar fiver around with a print shop on board to boot, fulltiming it.<br> Randy<br>[/quote]<br><br>Randy,<br>You almost have it right, but not quite. :
Newmar lists their dry weight without extras (as all manufacturers do). There is a whole bunch of "extras" on the Newmar (which add weight) that are standard on our Carriage and included in the listed "dry weight". We have added three batteries, a 6500 Onan, inverters, twin 40# bottles, etc etc that have brought the weight up some. Even with all that, I am still under the 16000 unless very wet. It is tough when you get into the better built units and try to keep the weight down. Even a 34'er weighs in close to our 36. We really struggled with that when purchasing. Chev had the highest towing cap up until this year. It was for sure I had to get something other than the 2500 V10. Pulled it but . . . : : Not a good idea. Much happier camper now.
Newmar lists their dry weight without extras (as all manufacturers do). There is a whole bunch of "extras" on the Newmar (which add weight) that are standard on our Carriage and included in the listed "dry weight". We have added three batteries, a 6500 Onan, inverters, twin 40# bottles, etc etc that have brought the weight up some. Even with all that, I am still under the 16000 unless very wet. It is tough when you get into the better built units and try to keep the weight down. Even a 34'er weighs in close to our 36. We really struggled with that when purchasing. Chev had the highest towing cap up until this year. It was for sure I had to get something other than the 2500 V10. Pulled it but . . . : : Not a good idea. Much happier camper now.
03-27-2003, 09:35 AM
#43
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Re:Duallies verses Singles
Nagi,<br><br>Here is what I posted earlier and what I see.<br><br>His truck dry weight of 6850lbs (web site). In my case I have 874lbs of fuel, hitch, passengers and stuff that would bring the Dually to (6850+ 874) 7724lbs. Add his 3000 pin weight it would bring his weight to 10,724. The GVWR of the Dually is 11,500lbs. That is of course if the weights are correct and he adds what I have. His GCW would be (7724 + 15000) or 22724lbs. GCWR = 23,000. He would be approaching his GCWR and have 776 left for the GVW<br><br>I don't see a MDT and like you, would not want to drive one around. Based on your information you are within limits for the Dually. Enjoy your new truck and RV.<br><br>
03-27-2003, 11:41 AM
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Re:Duallies verses Singles
"Use an exhaust brake for all 3500 manual transmission with Diesel applications with a trailer weight over 10,000 lbs."
My mistake there. Did not realize the auto was different than the standard.
If Newmar states it weigh's that they should know..
It is good that you have carefully calculated and "weighed " everything.
"His GCW would be (7724 + 15000) or 22724lbs. GCWR = 23,000. He would be approaching his GCWR and have 776 left for the GVW"
I guess I will go change my batteries.
Randy
My mistake there. Did not realize the auto was different than the standard.
If Newmar states it weigh's that they should know..
It is good that you have carefully calculated and "weighed " everything.
"His GCW would be (7724 + 15000) or 22724lbs. GCWR = 23,000. He would be approaching his GCWR and have 776 left for the GVW"
I guess I will go change my batteries.
Randy
03-27-2003, 12:29 PM
#45
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Re:Duallies verses Singles
There is a difference in what the truck will pull and what you liscense it for. I can only liscense for 20,00 here in Virginia but pull 26,000 (gross) on ocassion. The truck has no problems handling that weight but the liscense and DOT may have something to say about it.<br><br>Glad you went with a dually for that weight. I know you will enjoy it. These are great trucks for sure.