Wow! Only 9600 lbs. tow rating in a 1 ton dually??
07-31-2014, 10:55 PM
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Wow! Only 9400 lbs. tow rating in a 1 ton dually??
So I bought my 02 Ram 2WD 3500 DRW with a few mods and thought I was the big cheese.....
Wife and I currenly pull a 28' floorplan (31' overall pin to bumper) fifth wheel and love it....except on long steep grades. If I can keep my speed up and foot down while watching my EGT's I'm usually good to 50 MPH or so. Drop below that and I start slowing everyone down as the torque converter unlocks and I start churning trans fluid, having to drop to 3rd gear in rare occasion.
So a buddy who tows says to get a Commander and control TQ lock up. Says the reason I slow so much is due to TQ slip, not allowing for all that glorious torque from the Cummins to hit the rear wheels.
We're currently looking at upgrading to a larger trailer....somewhere in the 10,300 lb. dry weight range. Then I look up the Trailer Life tow rating guide which says for my 3.55:1 axle ratio, I got a mere 9400 lb. tow rating. What???? Guess who didn't check for axle ratio and assumed a 1 ton dually will pull anything I want before buying.
Don't get me wrong....I love my truck. But I'm left wondering what further mods might get me to a comfortable point where I can tow 11,000 lbs wet if I want.
TQ lock up control?
Change out Axle ratio?
Gear Vendors splitter?
With a 1 ton dually, what's the weak link with tow capacity?
Sure hope someone can enlighten me. We're fifth wheel shopping tomorrow.....
Wife and I currenly pull a 28' floorplan (31' overall pin to bumper) fifth wheel and love it....except on long steep grades. If I can keep my speed up and foot down while watching my EGT's I'm usually good to 50 MPH or so. Drop below that and I start slowing everyone down as the torque converter unlocks and I start churning trans fluid, having to drop to 3rd gear in rare occasion.
So a buddy who tows says to get a Commander and control TQ lock up. Says the reason I slow so much is due to TQ slip, not allowing for all that glorious torque from the Cummins to hit the rear wheels.
We're currently looking at upgrading to a larger trailer....somewhere in the 10,300 lb. dry weight range. Then I look up the Trailer Life tow rating guide which says for my 3.55:1 axle ratio, I got a mere 9400 lb. tow rating. What???? Guess who didn't check for axle ratio and assumed a 1 ton dually will pull anything I want before buying.
Don't get me wrong....I love my truck. But I'm left wondering what further mods might get me to a comfortable point where I can tow 11,000 lbs wet if I want.
TQ lock up control?
Change out Axle ratio?
Gear Vendors splitter?
With a 1 ton dually, what's the weak link with tow capacity?
Sure hope someone can enlighten me. We're fifth wheel shopping tomorrow.....
08-01-2014, 09:29 AM
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So....in addition to looking for fifth wheels, I guess we're gonna be looking into a gear ratio swap. Should I be considering trans shops, performance shops, diesel shops....?
Any idea how the truck will perform at 70 mph unloaded with 3:55's? I fear it will scream high rpms.....
08-01-2014, 09:43 AM
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3.5 gears in my '97 dually (came that way).
Another option is to install a switch that will let you lock the TC manually.
I think the TC locks in third if you turn the O/D off with the dash button.
3.5 gears @70MPH ~1900RPM
4.1 gears @70MPH ~2400RPM
Another option is to install a switch that will let you lock the TC manually.
I think the TC locks in third if you turn the O/D off with the dash button.
3.5 gears @70MPH ~1900RPM
4.1 gears @70MPH ~2400RPM
08-01-2014, 09:55 AM
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My 06 2 wd has 373 gears, short box quad cab has a tow rating of right around 13500, I tow a 36ft 5th wheel the slowest I go up hills is 50 mph, and thats my choice, your tow rating would be higher with 373 or 410 gear set, cheers
08-01-2014, 10:18 AM
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VIN Decoder @ end of post
It seems the newer trucks have higher tow ratings. I'm still lookin' to see if I can find a fifth wheel tow rating vs the bumper pull ratings that Trailer Life put out back in 2002, and deciding whether a TQ lock switch or ratio change is the better remedy.
It may also be that I simply back off on trailer weight when looking for our next rig. As I said earlier, we're at 8700 lbs now, and until I learn more I'm not sure I want to go much more....
I located a pretty cool VIN decoder online. Tells you everything you wanted to know about your vehicle following VIN # input:
http://fifthwheelst.com/tow_rating_other_resouces.html
Last edited by ProPerDoper; 08-01-2014 at 10:26 AM. Reason: New info found!
08-01-2014, 11:20 AM
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ProPerDoper:
I would not be too concerned about the "ratings" in Trailer Life reference to load ratings for an attached trailer.
Since 1992, I have been towing VERY HEAVY (10,000lbs+) with all of my Dodge CTD Pickups and they were all 2500's with the 3.55 axle ratios. The only exception to that was my 2006 which had a 3.73 ratio. I agree with what DTR Member macattack has told you. Try installing a lock-up switch or buy something like an ATS Co-Pilot to command lockup at any speed you want. The lock-up switch would be a cheaper route though.
The 3.55 gear ratio is NOT going to have your engine "screaming high rpms."
A 4.10 ratio would more likely make that happen as it is a lower ratio. I wouldn't change gear ratios. I don't know what size tires your running but a smaller tire will give you better throttle repsonse. You have a 2002, so you can add a lower H.P. fueling module like an Edge EZ or a programmer like a Smarty Jr. to help your power if you feel you need that.
On my 2002 Dodge CTD 24 valve, I had stock sized tires, a built ATS Tranny, A TST PM 3 Fueling Module and mild 50 HP injectors and NEVER had ANY trouble towing my 1996 Dodge CTD Drag Truck on a 24 ft "Kaufman" Flat Bed, Dual Axle Trailer with a weight of over 12,000 lbs! I could even do this going up the dreaded I-77 corridor through Va. and W. Va. with some 6 percent grades!
Hope this helps you Sir.
---------
John_P
I would not be too concerned about the "ratings" in Trailer Life reference to load ratings for an attached trailer.
Since 1992, I have been towing VERY HEAVY (10,000lbs+) with all of my Dodge CTD Pickups and they were all 2500's with the 3.55 axle ratios. The only exception to that was my 2006 which had a 3.73 ratio. I agree with what DTR Member macattack has told you. Try installing a lock-up switch or buy something like an ATS Co-Pilot to command lockup at any speed you want. The lock-up switch would be a cheaper route though.
The 3.55 gear ratio is NOT going to have your engine "screaming high rpms."
A 4.10 ratio would more likely make that happen as it is a lower ratio. I wouldn't change gear ratios. I don't know what size tires your running but a smaller tire will give you better throttle repsonse. You have a 2002, so you can add a lower H.P. fueling module like an Edge EZ or a programmer like a Smarty Jr. to help your power if you feel you need that.
On my 2002 Dodge CTD 24 valve, I had stock sized tires, a built ATS Tranny, A TST PM 3 Fueling Module and mild 50 HP injectors and NEVER had ANY trouble towing my 1996 Dodge CTD Drag Truck on a 24 ft "Kaufman" Flat Bed, Dual Axle Trailer with a weight of over 12,000 lbs! I could even do this going up the dreaded I-77 corridor through Va. and W. Va. with some 6 percent grades!
Hope this helps you Sir.
---------
John_P
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08-01-2014, 11:30 AM
#8
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Sir:
Here is a link on how to install a torque converter lock-up switch if you are interested:
http://www.dieselbombers.com/5-9l-12...ic-repost.html
--------
John_P
Here is a link on how to install a torque converter lock-up switch if you are interested:
http://www.dieselbombers.com/5-9l-12...ic-repost.html
--------
John_P
08-01-2014, 11:38 AM
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Very helpful....thx
ProPerDoper:
I would not be too concerned about the "ratings" in Trailer Life reference to load ratings for an attached trailer.
Since 1992, I have been towing VERY HEAVY (10,000lbs+) with all of my Dodge CTD Pickups and they were all 2500's with the 3.55 axle ratios. The only exception to that was my 2006 which had a 3.73 ratio. I agree with what DTR Member macattack has told you. Try installing a lock-up switch or buy something like an ATS Co-Pilot to command lockup at any speed you want. The lock-up switch would be a cheaper route though.
The 3.55 gear ratio is NOT going to have your engine "screaming high rpms."
A 4.10 ratio would more likely make that happen as it is a lower ratio. I wouldn't change gear ratios. I don't know what size tires your running but a smaller tire will give you better throttle repsonse. You have a 2002, so you can add a lower H.P. fueling module like an Edge EZ or a programmer like a Smarty Jr. to help your power if you feel you need that.
On my 2002 Dodge CTD 24 valve, I had stock sized tires, a built ATS Tranny, A TST PM 3 Fueling Module and mild 50 HP injectors and NEVER had ANY trouble towing my 1996 Dodge CTD Drag Truck on a 24 ft "Kaufman" Flat Bed, Dual Axle Trailer with a weight of over 12,000 lbs! I could even do this going up the dreaded I-77 corridor through Va. and W. Va. with some 6 percent grades!
Hope this helps you Sir.
---------
John_P
I would not be too concerned about the "ratings" in Trailer Life reference to load ratings for an attached trailer.
Since 1992, I have been towing VERY HEAVY (10,000lbs+) with all of my Dodge CTD Pickups and they were all 2500's with the 3.55 axle ratios. The only exception to that was my 2006 which had a 3.73 ratio. I agree with what DTR Member macattack has told you. Try installing a lock-up switch or buy something like an ATS Co-Pilot to command lockup at any speed you want. The lock-up switch would be a cheaper route though.
The 3.55 gear ratio is NOT going to have your engine "screaming high rpms."
A 4.10 ratio would more likely make that happen as it is a lower ratio. I wouldn't change gear ratios. I don't know what size tires your running but a smaller tire will give you better throttle repsonse. You have a 2002, so you can add a lower H.P. fueling module like an Edge EZ or a programmer like a Smarty Jr. to help your power if you feel you need that.
On my 2002 Dodge CTD 24 valve, I had stock sized tires, a built ATS Tranny, A TST PM 3 Fueling Module and mild 50 HP injectors and NEVER had ANY trouble towing my 1996 Dodge CTD Drag Truck on a 24 ft "Kaufman" Flat Bed, Dual Axle Trailer with a weight of over 12,000 lbs! I could even do this going up the dreaded I-77 corridor through Va. and W. Va. with some 6 percent grades!
Hope this helps you Sir.
---------
John_P
I do have an Edge tuner, CAI and modified exhaust. The only complaint I have is long steep grades, and many have opined that not getting the available engine torque to my wheels is the issue here.
I'm gonna research lock up controllers and/or DIY switches me thinks. Does anyone know of a low priced DIY switch kit made? It would get me started as a test to prove out function before investing in a full controller.
I've also got a call into Edge to see what parameters could be adjusted with the tuner to help TQ lock up performance. Curious about that one...
08-01-2014, 11:40 AM
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Awesome!
Sir:
Here is a link on how to install a torque converter lock-up switch if you are interested:
http://www.dieselbombers.com/5-9l-12...ic-repost.html
--------
John_P
Here is a link on how to install a torque converter lock-up switch if you are interested:
http://www.dieselbombers.com/5-9l-12...ic-repost.html
--------
John_P
Sweet! Thanks big time!
08-25-2014, 12:54 AM
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How I learned that I could tow more.....
So last week I had to take a load of worn roller coaster chain from an amusement park to the scrap yard. Over 500' of the stuff, weighing over 7500 lbs. That load, combined with a 5000 lb bumper pull dump trailer had me at 18780 lbs. GCVW, or 2780 over rating.
It tugged my truck around pretty good, and made for some real pucker experience towing on 101 S. in the SF Bay Area during commute traffic.
The truck did well though. Pulled with plenty of authority and did everything I needed it to do. Even so...I was so happy to dump that load of chain!
It tugged my truck around pretty good, and made for some real pucker experience towing on 101 S. in the SF Bay Area during commute traffic.
The truck did well though. Pulled with plenty of authority and did everything I needed it to do. Even so...I was so happy to dump that load of chain!
08-26-2014, 02:30 AM
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I've just spent some time driving a 02 built 47re truck.
The biggest problem you have IMO is the aweful gear split between 3rd and 4th gear. I towed about 7klbs with it and if you're pulling a big trailer I'd just wind er up in 3rd gear going up the hills unless you want to run 80 mph to keep the rpms up!
That, a TC lock up switch and a small tune and it will be a different truck. The tuner will make a huge difference if your trans is healthy and you watch temps
The biggest problem you have IMO is the aweful gear split between 3rd and 4th gear. I towed about 7klbs with it and if you're pulling a big trailer I'd just wind er up in 3rd gear going up the hills unless you want to run 80 mph to keep the rpms up!
That, a TC lock up switch and a small tune and it will be a different truck. The tuner will make a huge difference if your trans is healthy and you watch temps
08-26-2014, 09:07 AM
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I've just spent some time driving a 02 built 47re truck.
The biggest problem you have IMO is the aweful gear split between 3rd and 4th gear. I towed about 7klbs with it and if you're pulling a big trailer I'd just wind er up in 3rd gear going up the hills unless you want to run 80 mph to keep the rpms up!
That, a TC lock up switch and a small tune and it will be a different truck. The tuner will make a huge difference if your trans is healthy and you watch temps
The biggest problem you have IMO is the aweful gear split between 3rd and 4th gear. I towed about 7klbs with it and if you're pulling a big trailer I'd just wind er up in 3rd gear going up the hills unless you want to run 80 mph to keep the rpms up!
That, a TC lock up switch and a small tune and it will be a different truck. The tuner will make a huge difference if your trans is healthy and you watch temps
I think you're exactly right. 4th is too tall, 3rd is just a bit low.
I do have an Edge Tuner, CAI, Magnaflow exhaust installed, running the Edge on "Heavy Tow", one below the most aggressive "Performance" setting.
I've had many suggest that I should just tow with overdrive locked out, even on the flats, which puts me at about 2300 rpm. I can't seem to get used to that, as when in OD is so much quieter in the cab. I'm at ~ 1700 rpm and 900 degrees EGT in OD at 63 MPH towing, and ~2300 rpm and 700 degrees EGT at 58 mph in 3rd. Either gear should still have me at peak torque (over 1500 rpm) if I read the torque curves correctly. If I bump up my speed a bit in 4th it gets the rpm's up better, but I'd rather not tow more than about 65 mph max.
I think that a set of 3:73's would make towing in OD much more comfortable but bumping my rpm range a bit into the sweet spot for while towing. I'm just not sure the $900 or so would make a difference that significant because as you say, most steep grades I'm gonna be in 3rd anyway.
08-30-2014, 11:14 AM
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