I didn't mean you, me or us as individuals. I meant the people/companies doing the "studies" and producing the "results".

 

You think the oil companies spent their millions and got their additives package wrong??!?

 

Not at all.

I generally don't see a need for supplemental additives at all. Lube control doesn't so much fix something "wrong" with an oil as it extends the life of a typical oil. It also has a cleaning effect that even premium synthetic oils can benefit from.

I was skeptical of the Lube Control. I'm a natural skeptic. I ordered some of their additives based on the near-cultlike endorsement of them over on BITOG.

I added the oil additive to my Nissan Maxima, which had lived its whole life on premium synthetics (predominantly Redline, but also a lot of M1 and Amsoil, too). After 140K miles of premium syn, the inside of the engine was still pretty clean as far as sludge (not a drop of sludge). But there was varnish on the valvetrain, and on the dipstick as well. The varnish on the dipstick was a pretty thick coating, similar to what you'd see on cookware if cooking oil was left on it and it burned on-- it was a golden brown to dark brown and skinlike.

I ran some Rotella 10w-30 in the engine for an oil change and the varnish didn't improve at all. So when an OC came along, I used some Rotella 10w-30, and added the Lube Control to the oil as per the directions.

First thing I noticed: 1 mpg improvement consistently. I have well over 100K of mpg trends on this thing, so I knew what it got. The 1 mpg was for real.

Second thing: the engine ran smoother.

Third thing: The oil turned DARK very quickly! The darkening was much much faster than the previous Rotella change, even using the exact same oil (purchased at the same time, same store, even).

Within 1K miles, the varnish in the engine was completely gone.

I like the Lube Control a lot. It's the only oil additive besides the Torco MPZ that I'd consider using.

Justin

 

I like synthetic because: 1) it may give a tiny bit better fuel economy, 2) offers better cold start protection, and 3) keeps the engine cleaner.

Now it all boils down to cost. No way would I spend money on a premium synthetic like Amsoil or RP for engine oil. Just costs too much and I don't think over the life of the engine you'd get that money back (unless you double your oil change interval but I'm not a huge fan of that). I was actually contemplating running a blend of Rotella 5w-40 synthetic and Rotella 15w-40 dino. Like a 50/50 ratio, that way I get some of the benefits mentioned above as well as minimize added cost. I would also extend my OCI a thousand miles or two. I do have a Frantz bypass filter though, good for down to 1/10 of a micron.

 

If you have to start your truck below freezing very often, synthetic is the clear choice. A lot of people worry about running oils for longer because of soot but they forget that most of the wear occurs on cold starts. Your oil pressure will come up much faster with synthetic and it will lubricate better until the engine is up to temp. Not to mention, you will be saving your batteries and starter since the truck will start so much quicker.

As far as cost goes, in my opinion there is no real difference. If you assume that you will double your oil change interval with synthetic, the actual synthetic oil is likely to still cost you more than dino. However, you need to factor in the cost of performing the oil change from driving out and getting the oil to having to properly dispose of it and taking all of the time to do it. Sure the oil might be more expensive but if you put a price on time and the run to the parts store, synthetic might well be cheaper.

 

I agree to the better cold starts for synthetic. I however, do not agree to extended oil change intervals on heavily fueled trucks. The soot buildup will cause more wear and tear on the valve train, bearings, and TURBO! Not that an HX 35 is really expensive, but Brandon at HTT told me that he just got back from a training meeting/seminar at Borg Warner where a question was asked about synthetic oils. Borg Warner told them that due to synthetic oils not suspending soot, the soot is deposited. Soot is jagged and abrasive, it causes higher rates of wear in journal bearings, turbo shafts, seals, etc.

I personally, after talking with Brandon, run the cheaper rotella 15w40 in the summer and change it at or before 5K. I run a blend of 15w40 and a couple quarts of 5w40 synthetic in the winter for easier starts. I still have the dino oil for the soot retention, but a little thinner overall mix for easier starts.

I think that Hohn is on to something with this deposit remover oil conditioner stuff.

Just sharing what I was told, not saying it is right or wrong.

One question: How many of you are going to have the same CTD twenty years from now with 500K miles? I think any oil, even 1.20 a quart 10w30 car oil will get a CTD to 300K miles. How long do you want to have your old worn out truck? I've got 230K or so on mine. No way am I going to spend twice as much on oil changes and then run that abrasive sooty oil for 7-15K.

 

Hohn I bet you could do the same thing with a $4 can of seafoam in the oil a few miles before an oil change =P

Whats the point of an extended drain if you have big sticks and no bypass filtration? I'm not only concerned with soot, but with fuel in the oil. I run dino and change it often. I'm using a 3k interval personally.

 

Glad to hear that you had good results blending dino and synthetic BigBlue24. I didn't think about soot retention, so I guess dino has some benefits over synthetic in some aspects. I also agree that most people will trash their truck before the Cummins dies; and frankly, I think a lot of people would WANT their engine to die after a while so they have an excuse to either get it rebuilt with better parts or buy a new truck.

There's people who work these trucks to the bone with just regular dino and long oil change intervals. Yet they run just fine.

 

Perhaps the seafoam would work as well. But I don't like solvents in the oil. I have no way of knowing that they are all out.

I like the LC20 because it removes the deposits slowly, just like they accumulated. Thus, you have no big chunks of stuff in the engine. Second, instead of just "scraping" the engine clean, it "melts" the deposits, which ensures there are no abrasive particles. It dissolves carbonaceous deposits in the oil, and lets the engine either burn them off or filter them out if they agglomerate.

I'm not trying to convert anyone to using the stuff unless they think similarly as I do. I've proven to myself that even the best oils on the market (imo) cannot keep the inside of your engine perfectly clean (sludge AND varnish). So I use this product because it cleans the inside of my engines and keeps it clean. If the dipstick has varnish on it, how much worse are the pistons and ring grooves?

I do not use the LC20 to extend my drain intervals. I'd run 7500-10K on an OCI whether I was using it or not. But at the intervals I choose, it helps keep the engine cleaner, and improves the oils management of accumulated soot.

Justin

 

HOHN, can you add that stuff to gasser engine oil. My wife's Montero Sport has lots of tarnish on the dipstick, and I can only imagine what the valvetrain, rings, etc look like. Mileage has been dropping on her rig as well, but it only has 100K miles. Where do you buy the stuff anyway?

 

Sure. My earlier post mentioned using it in a Nissan Maxima.

You can order directly from www.lubecontrol.com OR you can just pick some up from Amazon.com

You'll be amazed at how it cleans up the engine's insides and darkens the oil as it melts the crud.

Try not to smell it too much either-- it might be the best smelling chemical ever put in a bottle

jh

 

I use Gunk Motor Flush every other oil change or so in our Honda Accord. It too has been on synthetic for all of its life. The Gunk says to use it for no more than 5 mins. When I talked to the parts guy at Napa he said if you run it too long then you could damage the varnish on internal engine parts like camshaft, etc. Thus, I'm a bit weary of super cleaning agents. Plus I never use motor flush on a high mileage engine that's been running dino for all of its life because I'm afraid I'd loosen up sludge and clog some small oil ports.

 

"Damage the varnish?" Was he joking?

Anyway, this is the type of reason why I don't like the hard solvents. The lube control can be run indefinitely-- no harsh solvents to harm anything in the engine. You add a little every 1K miles or so.

 

Yo.........I completly agree, my cus runs synthetic in his 98 12V and I just run delo 400 in mine. he's got alot to say about his synth.

But......... I can guarantee you that my Dadge won't last as long as that noisey thing that rattles away under the hood, no matter what oil I decide to pour in !!!

 

i think it is definately worth it with some synthetics being better than others....

http://www.turbodieselregister.com/TDR57_Oil.pdf