Could be...mine can do that sometimes...if it runs ok, its probably ok ??? Cant say for sure though. <br><br>Don~

 

[quote author=TxDieselKid link=board=7;threadid=10249;start=30#106991 date=1045766904]<br>So at a warm idle, with white smoke, and no other problems, white smoke would just mean the injector is flowing lots of fuel right?<br><br>thanks for answering my questions. <br>[/quote]<br><br>I've heard that the pulling trucks smoke white at idle. Even the 24 valvers.

 

[quote author=StakeMan link=board=7;threadid=10249;start=45#107005 date=1045768574]
I've heard that the pulling trucks smoke white at idle. Even the 24 valvers.
[/quote]

thanks Don for answering those, but why does it only do it sometimes? ??? If it's flowing that much fuel would it not do it all the time? ???

Stake, I know they do, I saw it at Muncie.

 

[quote author=Don M link=board=7;threadid=10249;start=30#106981 date=1045765713]<br> A bad stick will fill the cylinder with fuel and hydrolock the engine. <br><br>Don~<br><br><br>[/quote]<br><br>I don't know much about injecters, but isn't that just a teensy bit of an exageration???

 

[quote author=StakeMan link=board=7;threadid=10249;start=45#107005 date=1045768574]<br>[quote author=TxDieselKid link=board=7;threadid=10249;start=30#106991 date=1045766904]<br><br><br>I've heard that the pulling trucks smoke white at idle. Even the 24 valvers.<br>[/quote]<br><br>Stakeman, there is no such thing as a 24 valve pulling truck.[/quote]

 

[quote author=Sled Puller link=board=7;threadid=10249;start=45#107133 date=1045789833]<br>[quote author=Don M link=board=7;threadid=10249;start=30#106981 date=1045765713]<br> A bad stick will fill the cylinder with fuel and hydrolock the engine. <br><br>Don~<br><br><br>[/quote]<br><br>I don't know much about injecters, but isn't that just a teensy bit of an exageration??? <br>[/quote]<br><br>Yeah kinda but I have seen the combustion bowl filled completely up with fuel. The exhaust valve wil let most of it out though.<br><br>Don~

 

I've seen and heard a PSD hydraulic.<br><br>Not a real nice sound or result.

 

I just got my EDM's in the mail! Beautiful looking injectors. Very nice packaging and all arrived in one piece! I am happy with the look of them and they seem to be VERY high quality injectors. Nice looking units! Now onto the install ;D

 

<br><br>Sleddy, has finally lost it, he must be in a state of denial , Larry

 

<br>[/quote]<br><br><br> : :

 

[quote author=Don M link=board=7;threadid=10249;start=30#101872 date=1044637681]<br>Tim,<br><br>I will answer in two parts. First, the EDM injectors we have do not cause cylinder wash down. Even cold. Actually quite the contrary. Ours have a high combustion effeciency compared to the typical high HP injectors of the same power level.<br><br>Secondly, soot formation in diesel jets can be attributed to a large number of factors. These factors include but are not limited to the following:<br>1. Insuffecient air or oxygen to oxidize all the soot or soot precursors.<br>2. Insuffecient mixing of the air and fuel before the soot particles become too large for oxidation in the time available in-cylinder.<br>3. Poor ultilization of the the air in-cylinder in the outer area of the combustion chamber due to slow penetration of the fuel jets.<br>4. The fuel jet being too close to walls to allow air entrainment.<br>5. Liquid impingement on combustion chamber walls with insufficient air motion to mix the fuel off the hot cylinder walls<br>6. In-cylinder temperature hot enough to form soot, but low enough that the soot formation is slow.<br><br>We included these known conditions and few others (censored to keep the competition guessing) when we started this project back over a year and half ago.<br>Our injectors produce lower particulate matter, and grams of soot emitted per kg of fuel injected. We took into consideration the swirl ratio of the Cummins B series for the 12 and 24 valve engines as well. Swirl ratio is the speed of the air in-cylinder when compared to the crank rotational speed. The 24 valve has an air rotational speed of over 3000 cylinder revolutions per minute under some conditions and engine speeds. This number is constantly changing depending on if Bubba has ported the head wrong or if the boost numbers are increased with certain parameters in engine speed that can help or hurt combustion efficiency. <br>I bring up soot conditons because the same parameters needed to make the fuel oxidize and unzip the hydrocarbons efficiently go hand in hand with the conditions you need to not wash down cylinder walls. I have seen video and read reports of some of the EDM injectors that spit and splatter fuel so bad it burns yours eyes from the heavy unburned aromatics in diesel fuel. This is a prodcut of inefficient design, IMO. <br><br>Sorry so long winded in the reply. I just wanted to spell out that anyone can go and punch holes in an injector tip. &quot;Safely and effectively&quot; is another question all on its own.<br><br>Don~<br><br><br>[/quote]Do these EDM injectors perform just as well at higher altitudes like up here in Colorado, or does this even make a difference some of the mountain passes can exceed 10500 ft. Mike

 

Don,<br>How do you measure the swirl in the combustion chamber?? <br><br> If cams, turbos, and head work all effect the swirl for which your injectors were optimized, shouldn't we be careful on what injector we choose, when we have made changes like those mentioned?<br>

 

Mike,

They are still going to smoke at 10,000 ft, albeit less.

Your 20% injectors from ATS might be all you would want for that elevation. Maybe even some 10% injectors. There is not much air density to work with at 10K. We all know this already though.


Sled,

I cant measure the swirl ratio without a bench and swirl meter. I know what the heads both do stock and at stock pressures, so I can use this data to get my answer. Thats why the comments about &quot;Bubba porting the head can muck stuff up&quot; were made earlier.


The best I can do is CFD using WAVE/VECTIS or a similar solution.

Don~

 

[quote author=Don M link=board=7;threadid=10249;start=45#108034 date=1046022139]<br>The 24 valve has an air rotational speed of over 3000 cylinder revolutions per minute under some conditions and engine speeds. This number is constantly changing depending on if Bubba has ported the head wrong or if the boost numbers are increased with certain parameters in engine speed that can help or hurt combustion efficiency. [/quote]<br><br>Wouldn't if change even if Piers did the porting, and not just bubba, or depepnding on what kinda of box is doing the timming? ???

 

Yes to porting by anyone. No to timing directly on air swirl. <br><br>The conditions in-cylinder are an extremely complex process. Some of the computer models we run take literally 10 or more hours to complete with just a single crankshaft rotation being modeled. Changing anything from pressure, to intake runner volume and velocity can really make profound changes to the model. Porting out a chuck of material the size of an aspirin can change things enough to take away or add power.<br><br>Andrew, you might consult with your close colleagues in the injector business and see if they have any work or data in this area as well.<br><br>Don~<br><br>