Is anyone running a performance cam shaft? <br>Is anyone running one of the new Hotrod vp44 pumps?<br><br>

 

Lynn,<br><br> There are plenty of trucks out here in Indiana that are running the Hot Rod Vp-44. Contact Van Haisley for information on them. He and Patty (his wife) are good people and will steer you in the right direction.<br><br>J.R.

 

Thanks for the info.. I will give them a call. Know of any good pulling truck cams can you guess who I am helping research upgrades

 

They (Haisleys) have all of the goodies!! Almost ;D<br><br>J.R.

 

I have been told and would beieve 100% that the DD cam is the best.

 

[quote author=Jamie Attridge link=board=7;threadid=17214;start=0#161322 date=1058529358]<br>I have been told and would beieve 100% that the DD cam is the best.<br>[/quote]<br><br>Jamie,<br><br>just wondering why you think it's the best? <br><br>Andrew

 

DD cam is billet<br>PDR cam is good too if you look at the dyno graphs,<br><br>I have been running the EE cam for the 24V with fly cut pistons.<br><br>But, from speaking with some very prominent midwestern pros, they tend to agree that a really good extreme cam for the 24V has yet to be developed because of the lack of demand.<br><br>With the 24V being limited RPM wise, and fueling wise, there just has not been as big a call for the cam as in a 12V

 

My vote still goes to Diesel Dynamics camshaft. 12 or 24 valve. Many many hours of time and design went into it.
The cam was not just ground for more lift and duration ,etc. All kinds of parameters went into it.
They start with a cam from Chilled Ductle Iron ( A material superior to others ) It has been shot-peened behind the number 1 bearing journal to resist the cracking that was seen during Cummins testing and development of the higher rpm B engines. This cracking was also recently seen first hand by Mark Kendrick @ May Madness this year. The noses do crack off the stock camshafts when pushed hard that are not shot peened. An expensive mess Im sure.

It also uses a gear that not only presses on the shaft but also bolts on the shaft. The bolt also goes all the way to the second bearing journal for added support. This helps with engines that use P pumps requiring a pile of drive TQ to turn the pump. It also helps keep the gear on the shaft for higher rpm use.
Not only better material, but better design in the cam profile itself makes it the best so far IMO.

The next step is going to be a billet shaft and the billet goodies to go with them. Of course like the rest of camshafts compared we have now, the profiles of the shafts and the compatibility of the materials is paramount.

Finally, the piston/combustion bowl shape is very important in a cross-flow engine design, i.e. 24 valve. The swirl is generally lower in these engines and the rely on tumble for fuel/air mixing. From past flow bench testing, removing even a slight amount of material can drastically change the mixing conditions in-cylinder. Not only port changes but piston crown/top changes can get things heading the wrong or even perhaps the right direction. Generally the wrong.


Don~

 

[quote author=Don M link=board=7;threadid=17214;start=0#161473 date=1058553186]<br>My vote still goes to Diesel Dynamics camshaft. 12 or 24 valve. Many many hours of time and design went into it.<br>The cam was not just ground for more lift and duration ,etc. All kinds of parameters went into it. <br>They start with a cam from Chilled Ductle Iron ( A material superior to others ) It has been shot-peened behind the number 1 bearing journal to resist the cracking that was seen during Cummins testing and development of the higher rpm B engines. This cracking was also recently seen first hand by Mark Kendrick @ May Madness this year. The noses do crack off the stock camshafts when pushed hard that are not shot peened. An expensive mess Im sure. <br><br>It also uses a gear that not only presses on the shaft but also bolts on the shaft. The bolt also goes all the way to the second bearing journal for added support. This helps with engines that use P pumps requiring a pile of drive TQ to turn the pump. It also helps keep the gear on the shaft for higher rpm use. <br>Not only better material, but better design in the cam profile itself makes it the best so far IMO.<br><br>The next step is going to be a billet shaft and the billet goodies to go with them. Of course like the rest of camshafts compared we have now, the profiles of the shafts and the compatibility of the materials is paramount.<br><br>Finally, the piston/combustion bowl shape is very important in a cross-flow engine design, i.e. 24 valve. The swirl is generally lower in these engines and the rely on tumble for fuel/air mixing. From past flow bench testing, removing even a slight amount of material can drastically change the mixing conditions in-cylinder. Not only port changes but piston crown/top changes can get things heading the wrong or even perhaps the right direction. Generally the wrong.<br><br><br>Don~<br><br><br><br>[/quote]<br><br>What Don said he is the one that steered me onto the DD cam.

 

What should cost of the DD Cam And labor be?<br><br>What else should be done at the same time?<br><br><br>James<br>

 

The last price I heard from DD was 1500 bucks for the stick, lifters, gear, bolt, etc. Exchange I believe. I also recall they charge 1000 dollars in labor to install. Cummins service manuals call for 40 plus hours in labor to change one. Most guys get it done in less than that. You can purchase the cam over the counter and have it installed at any shop as well.<br><br>I sound like a salesman for DD, but actually I just like the product. You will not gain much, if any power. It will lower smoke and increase low end TQ. Not a cheap date, but the quality is there.<br><br>Billet goodies would be my choice for 4000rpm plus.<br><br>Don~

 

[quote author=Don M link=board=7;threadid=17214;start=0#161513 date=1058559682]<br>Billet goodies would be my choice for 4000rpm plus.<br><br>Don~<br>[/quote]<br><br>Don,<br><br>Not trying to start a war, but since the 24v's do not rev as high, or should a 12v'er have only a 3K spring kit, would the billit be nessasary? <br><br>Andrew

 

Andrew,<br><br>War? Come on...Im bored today. <br><br>Actually the stock stick the 24 valve cam is made of good material. P pump converted trucks should go to the bolt on gear. <br><br>Speaking of RPM on a 24 valve. Nates truck revs to 3500 easily. I think it needs a bolt on gear camshaft myself, but seems to be holding up well without. I also feel that Piers cam is helping the truck to make power. It gets more air in with the increased lift and inherent duration you get. No flycuts, but a thick gasket helped it not to bump the pistons.<br><br>Billet is overkill in nearly every truck I know of. <br><br>Don~<br>

 

Depends on your valve train. It has been determined that the harmonics of the valve train is what causes the breakage on the cams.
Up to 4400 rpm probably won't need it........But if you only tighten the springs on the 12V, or 24V for that matter you may want to go billet for safety.
In excess of the 4400 or 4500 rpm range, you may opt for billet even if you have addressed the valve harmonic concerns. Sometimes better safe than sorry
Anything over 5000 rpm, billet all the way even with valve train being addressed.

Forgot: The stock valve train...Obviously not made for this stuff. Also how much boost will you run? That will determine how much tension you will need on the springs and will put excess strain on the camshaft as well. If the spring tension is not right too much boost could blow the valves open when you don't want them open.
I just spent a bunch on a complete aftermarket custom valve train that adressed everything. Everything from cradle to grave on the 24V.
My cam is not billet, I will limit my rpms to 4400 for safety. My boost numbers will be very high. Everything in the entire setup has been customized and tested under extreme circumstances. The head will completely melt down and have holes punched in it before the valve train fails.

 

Harmonics.....I totally agree with that. Those dern drive gears are terrible. The clash alone causes major harmonics. If you ever get a chance, start your engine with the oil filler tube out of the front cover ( applies to 12 valve only I believe) You will be amazed at the racket those gears make. <br>The Echo common rail engines changed the gears to deal with the noise and some harmonics this year. <br><br>Also, the valvetrain is heavy. The retainers are gross in weight. No pun. They are heavy. The tulip valve is heavy and the whole thing just says &quot; farm tractor engine&quot; all over it in valve train design. More for the low rpm, low end power making. Not 4000 rpm plus. Heavy springs, yeah they help, but they still vibrate like mad. <br><br>The billet will just help hold that nose and gear on and take more abuse. Next to spending stupid amounts of cash to fix the vibes...you can just beef it up. Shortcut I guess. <br><br>Heck just put your hand on the engine and the vibes will surprise you. It shakes things apart and keeps those springs from keeping the tappet/lifter on the stick <br><br>Don~<br>