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Old Dec 17, 2009 | 09:18 AM
  #16  
Totallyrad's Avatar
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From: Birmingham, Alabama
I'm betting using multiples of the same unit mounted on several of the houses in the complex, feeding into a central storage unit. You might be able to obtain the systems at a better price buying several and by standardizing the systems, you can have a parts inventory on hand for failures. You'll also be able to keep the entire community up if one or two individual units go down.
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Old Dec 17, 2009 | 09:39 AM
  #17  
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From: St Paul , MN.
Originally Posted by Totallyrad
I'm betting using multiples of the same unit mounted on several of the houses in the complex, feeding into a central storage unit. You might be able to obtain the systems at a better price buying several and by standardizing the systems, you can have a parts inventory on hand for failures. You'll also be able to keep the entire community up if one or two individual units go down.
That's one reason , why if you can access the grid as part of your system , it should be part of it .
Also to my mind there are a couple of approaches , learning about the tech. , but from a larger perspective [ from what I have gathered from your posts ] .
The KISS factor , is the largest part of how I look at many things , and helps to keep cost down , reliability & efficiency high .
I am mostly self taught on this subject , which helps to think outside the box , as compared to learning in a group [ which can lead to accepting old or wrong concepts ] .
I would suggest a subscription to Home Power magazine , there are many sources of info , but from what I've seen most lead to higher cost systems that stay tied to someone income stream [ wasting you energy / money ] .
I ability to drop links into threads is broke , since a Firefox update .
If someone wants to do a site servery , you should on the correct road , if someone wants to sell you a system without a servery , send them packing .
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Old Dec 17, 2009 | 09:46 AM
  #18  
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Nice site John! http://www.homepower.com/home/
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Old Dec 17, 2009 | 09:48 AM
  #19  
Mexstan's Avatar
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It's my pot and I'll stir it if I want to. If you're not careful, I'll stir your's as well!
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From: Central Mexico.
Originally Posted by John Faughn
That's one reason , why if you can access the grid as part of your system , it should be part of it .
Also to my mind there are a couple of approaches , learning about the tech. , but from a larger perspective [ from what I have gathered from your posts ] .
The KISS factor , is the largest part of how I look at many things , and helps to keep cost down , reliability & efficiency high .
I am mostly self taught on this subject , which helps to think outside the box , as compared to learning in a group [ which can lead to accepting old or wrong concepts ] .
I would suggest a subscription to Home Power magazine , there are many sources of info , but from what I've seen most lead to higher cost systems that stay tied to someone income stream [ wasting you energy / money ] .
I ability to drop links into threads is broke , since a Firefox update .
If someone wants to do a site servery , you should on the correct road , if someone wants to sell you a system without a servery , send them packing .
Ah, the KISS factor, one of my favorites. Yes indeed, this will be a very strong factor and as a result may by default eliminate some of the newer technology.

I already have a subscription to Home Power. Lots of great info there.

I too think out of the box for may of the technical things and as this project is new and revolutionary for this part of the world (and to some extent, also the states) we have the freedom to do what many have shied away from. It is exciting to look at this from a different prospective. That is one reason I am doing extensive groundwork and then later may give parts of the project to engineers to design around our guidelines.
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Old Dec 17, 2009 | 09:57 AM
  #20  
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We've got a friend that owns a B&B north of me. It sits at the base of a small mountain. On that mountain, on their property is a LARGE spring. When the house was originally constructed by the previous owner, the entire water supply was a 2" pipe, stuck into a pool at the spring, about 200' above the house. As the story goes, the original owner blew the pipes in the house 3 times before they found a way to regulate (redneck) the water pressure. I've tried for years to get them to invest in a small hydro-generator to offset the cooling costs in the summer. When they converted it to a B&B they went on city water for the house, just to be safe. They still use the gravity system for their irrigation and pond in the front lawn.
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Old Dec 17, 2009 | 10:55 AM
  #21  
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From: Kalamazoo, Michigan
Originally Posted by Totallyrad
We've got a friend that owns a B&B north of me...
What's truly amazing is that... YOU HAVE A FRIEND!



J/K buddy!

chaikwa.
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Old Dec 17, 2009 | 11:18 AM
  #22  
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Yeah, but he doesn't have any friends.
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Old Dec 17, 2009 | 11:21 AM
  #23  
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From: Kalamazoo, Michigan
Originally Posted by Totallyrad
Yeah, but he doesn't have any friends.
That explains it!



chaikwa.
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Old Dec 17, 2009 | 01:26 PM
  #24  
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From: Ohio: Home of the disappointing sports teams
Originally Posted by chaikwa
That explains it!



chaikwa.
Hey!!! Dont be picking on my friend
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Old Dec 17, 2009 | 06:41 PM
  #25  
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From: Oklahoma/Texas
Originally Posted by Mexstan
For most of the year no A/C or heating is required. Perhaps for a few days a year some form of heat would be nice, but a sweater works too. Seldom do we have heat or cold more then 5 days in a row that requires A/C or a heater. Old folks however feel cold long before the average person, so that is why we are looking at some form of heat. Our average annual temps are generally between 60 and 72 degrees F. Only a few days a year goes above or below that.
I was expecting something a bit closer to the equator where its 80 to 90 year round. And as far as old folks feeling cold sooner than others, my draftsman is 70 and complains if the office gets above 72 degrees.

Originally Posted by Mexstan
Exactly. We are looking at this option too, especially if we use radiating floors. There are going to be about 500 houses in this complex, so we are looking at options such as one large "generating" station or three or four smaller stations. It is spread over about 74 acres in four "zones". Propane is readily available and fairly cheap. Natural gas is coming in but may not be available for where we finally build.

Water heating will be primarily by solar with a gas heater (probably in series) as a backup.

This is a very interesting project with franchise potential and we are looking for American and Canadian investors or partners.
500 houses at a meer 100 amps of 220 volt service is about 11 MW. I doubt you will find a single gen set commercially available. Have you considered a battery array similar to what parts of alaska uses. you loose a bit of overall efficiency, but it will let you store the power from the good times to use during the bad times without having to run a diesel gen set.
Another heat and power option (depending) is a biomass boiler. it will depend on the availabilty of biomass.
You also have methane scavaging from waste treatment (solids mostly).
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Old Dec 17, 2009 | 07:14 PM
  #26  
Chrisreyn's Avatar
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From: Lyndon KS
Are you in an area where you might be able to utilize wind turbines for your power? from that you could utilize a electric water heater for your radiant floor heat as well as house-hold water..
kill 3 birds with one stone..
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Old Dec 18, 2009 | 06:18 AM
  #27  
Mexstan's Avatar
Thread Starter
It's my pot and I'll stir it if I want to. If you're not careful, I'll stir your's as well!
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Joined: Dec 2002
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From: Central Mexico.
Originally Posted by Totallyrad
We've got a friend that owns a B&B north of me. It sits at the base of a small mountain. On that mountain, on their property is a LARGE spring. When the house was originally constructed by the previous owner, the entire water supply was a 2" pipe, stuck into a pool at the spring, about 200' above the house. As the story goes, the original owner blew the pipes in the house 3 times before they found a way to regulate (redneck) the water pressure. I've tried for years to get them to invest in a small hydro-generator to offset the cooling costs in the summer. When they converted it to a B&B they went on city water for the house, just to be safe. They still use the gravity system for their irrigation and pond in the front lawn.
I dream of having a large spring or any place with running water so that I could play with hydro electric stuff. In this state there is not much chance of that. There are two other states that I have looked at that has abundant running water, but at the moment can't move there for other reasons re this project.
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Old Dec 18, 2009 | 06:29 AM
  #28  
Mexstan's Avatar
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It's my pot and I'll stir it if I want to. If you're not careful, I'll stir your's as well!
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From: Central Mexico.
Originally Posted by Fronty Owner
I was expecting something a bit closer to the equator where its 80 to 90 year round. And as far as old folks feeling cold sooner than others, my draftsman is 70 and complains if the office gets above 72 degrees.
You get oddballs everywhere. Is he a DTR member?


500 houses at a meer 100 amps of 220 volt service is about 11 MW. I doubt you will find a single gen set commercially available. Have you considered a battery array similar to what parts of alaska uses. you loose a bit of overall efficiency, but it will let you store the power from the good times to use during the bad times without having to run a diesel gen set.
Another heat and power option (depending) is a biomass boiler. it will depend on the availabilty of biomass.
You also have methane scavaging from waste treatment (solids mostly).
Don't know anything about the Alaskan battery arrays, so will have to dig into that.

Presently looking into biomass boilers and some of the newer inventions that were primarily developed for the US army to turn garbage into electricity. We are planning on treating all the black and gray water produced. As water treatment is a bit of a unknown where we are going to build, we are considering going to a larger treatment plant than we need and treating some of the water from the local community to produce a bit of an income.
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Old Dec 18, 2009 | 07:10 AM
  #29  
Mexstan's Avatar
Thread Starter
It's my pot and I'll stir it if I want to. If you're not careful, I'll stir your's as well!
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Dec 2002
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From: Central Mexico.
Originally Posted by Chrisreyn
Are you in an area where you might be able to utilize wind turbines for your power? from that you could utilize a electric water heater for your radiant floor heat as well as house-hold water..
kill 3 birds with one stone..
This is a windy area at times. The problem is that we get days of reasonably brisk wind and then a few days of almost nothing. However, that does not totally rule out wind power and we are also looking into that.
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