Rebuilding Yanmar Diesel in a John Deer
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From: MidWest
Originally Posted by Wetspirit
I'm glad you found out it's fuel contamination and not a worn out engine.
Wetspirit
Wetspirit
The engine has 2619 hours and that hour meter hasnt worked until two weekends ago when I replaced the feeder cable to it.
Who knows how many hours it really has.
Id have to guess that if it were a leaking or stuck injector, Id be seeing a lot of black smoke and very rough running.
Niether exist.
I dont have the manual yet, so Im going to be pulling the pump with no prior knowlege of how the pump runs off the engine.
Id assume the pump can only go on one way into some kind of keyed or splined drive gear.
Guess I'll find out.
Rich.
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From: south of Kansas City 40 miles
Diesel...,
You might go to a site like "yesterdaystractors" and get some info. Those guys know the old machines, but their is always some who know more current machines also.
There is probably someone there who can guide you step by step right to the problem, much like what happens here with our trucks.
What side of Mo. you on?
You might go to a site like "yesterdaystractors" and get some info. Those guys know the old machines, but their is always some who know more current machines also.
There is probably someone there who can guide you step by step right to the problem, much like what happens here with our trucks.
What side of Mo. you on?
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Joined: Mar 2004
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From: port crane, NY
I'm going to finally see those manuals today, so I'll check on pump removal. The little yanmar in my 430 is pushing 3600 hours with zero issues. I would definitely suspect a pump seal before suspecting anything to be truly 'wrong' with the engine. Yanmar has really got it together, IMO. And the JD 1250 has the same engine with a t-t-turbo!
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From: MidWest
Got the injection pump off today. Pretty simple design.
The pump is ran off the cam lobes.
There are three plungers that get depressed by the cam lobe. I hope this makes timing it post pump replacement much easier.
I also pulled the injectors. They are a design that Im not familiar with.
While I did not see any standing fuel anywhere around, I did see what looks like broken O-rings.
I called the local Deer dealer and they quoted me $1030.00 for a new injection pump.
After I picked up myself off the floor, I decided to look around a bit more.
By the way, my fuel tank is almost empty and as I unscrew the dipstick, you can see the diesel fuel about 1-1/2 inches below the top of the dipstick cap.
Rich
The pump is ran off the cam lobes.
There are three plungers that get depressed by the cam lobe. I hope this makes timing it post pump replacement much easier.
I also pulled the injectors. They are a design that Im not familiar with.
While I did not see any standing fuel anywhere around, I did see what looks like broken O-rings.
I called the local Deer dealer and they quoted me $1030.00 for a new injection pump.
After I picked up myself off the floor, I decided to look around a bit more.
By the way, my fuel tank is almost empty and as I unscrew the dipstick, you can see the diesel fuel about 1-1/2 inches below the top of the dipstick cap.
Rich
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From: port crane, NY
I just looked at the service manual for the 650/750, but it looks like you already dove in. Yeah, it's pretty simple to pull the pump, as you found. I guess there's a special delivery valve adapter from john deere that you can $buy$ to time it when it goes back together, but if you don't move anything, you should be able to just drop it back in. If the thing ran, I'd think replacing any weak seals/o-rings should clear up your problem. Keep us posted...I just went back and took another hard look at a 650 with 2600 hours...think i wanna add it to the stable 
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From: Terre Haute,IN
Any links to pics of these type of tractors? You might give Scheid Diesel a call and see what they quote you on a rebuild, or parts. They always have odd ball injection pumps and injectors laying on the desk, drop-offs and pickups etc when I go in there. Definately not Dodge Cummins pumps/injectors. They are a fuel injection shop before all that Cummins truck pulling power etc. http://www.scheiddiesel.com/Ag_main.htm http://www.scheiddiesel.com/john%20deere.htm
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From: Saint Ignatius, MT
Originally Posted by DieselDaze
Got the injection pump off today. Pretty simple design.
I called the local Deer dealer and they quoted me $1030.00 for a new injection pump.
Rich
I called the local Deer dealer and they quoted me $1030.00 for a new injection pump.
Rich
That sounds about right. The compact tractor stuff is pricey. I have an 855 at work with only 800 hrs and it was built 20 yrs ago. I also have shop manual and parts manual on cd if you need something looked up.
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From: MidWest
***Update***
Turned out, the injection pump had a bad brass seal that was allowing diesel fuel to get past running or not.
They also found that the dv's and plungers were in very poor condition.
After getting it rebuilt and re-installed, I found it very difficult to prime, but once primed, I got it restarted and all seems ok.
A few things I noticed along the way:
1) I had to play tug-o-war with the fuel filter housing to get the fuel filter out. Im guessing the filter that was on it had been there for years.
It was plugged with black/purple slime/sludge.
Im actually impressed that the tractor ran in the first place.
2) I found the fuel return line had been dry-rotted and cracked in several places. Replaced this with new line.
3) I also pulled out and cleaned each injector.
4) And of course, strait piped with with new exhaust pipe and gaskets.
Results:
1) Tractor has much more power now than when I brought it home.
In areas where I use to have to drop to 1st gear can now be mowed easily in 2nd with power to spare.
2) The smell of the exhaust has changed and the quantity of black exhaust has dropped dramatically.
Not sure how to explain the smell as it still smells like diesel, but its not the same smell as when I bought it.
3) The amount of blow by (compared to when I brought it home, not when the pump seal went bad) has dropped by half or more.
One other thing, I did notice a heavy tap coming from the engine now.
I think its too light to be a considered a "knock". Its more of a heavy tapping noise.
Im wondering if running diesel diluted oil has caused something internal to wear.
Rich
Turned out, the injection pump had a bad brass seal that was allowing diesel fuel to get past running or not.
They also found that the dv's and plungers were in very poor condition.
After getting it rebuilt and re-installed, I found it very difficult to prime, but once primed, I got it restarted and all seems ok.
A few things I noticed along the way:
1) I had to play tug-o-war with the fuel filter housing to get the fuel filter out. Im guessing the filter that was on it had been there for years.
It was plugged with black/purple slime/sludge.
Im actually impressed that the tractor ran in the first place.
2) I found the fuel return line had been dry-rotted and cracked in several places. Replaced this with new line.
3) I also pulled out and cleaned each injector.
4) And of course, strait piped with with new exhaust pipe and gaskets.
Results:
1) Tractor has much more power now than when I brought it home.
In areas where I use to have to drop to 1st gear can now be mowed easily in 2nd with power to spare.
2) The smell of the exhaust has changed and the quantity of black exhaust has dropped dramatically.
Not sure how to explain the smell as it still smells like diesel, but its not the same smell as when I bought it.
3) The amount of blow by (compared to when I brought it home, not when the pump seal went bad) has dropped by half or more.
One other thing, I did notice a heavy tap coming from the engine now.
I think its too light to be a considered a "knock". Its more of a heavy tapping noise.
Im wondering if running diesel diluted oil has caused something internal to wear.
Rich
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 4,569
Likes: 40
From: League City, TX
Originally Posted by DieselDaze
***Update***
Turned out, the injection pump had a bad brass seal that was allowing diesel fuel to get past running or not.
They also found that the dv's and plungers were in very poor condition.
After getting it rebuilt and re-installed, I found it very difficult to prime, but once primed, I got it restarted and all seems ok.
A few things I noticed along the way:
1) I had to play tug-o-war with the fuel filter housing to get the fuel filter out. Im guessing the filter that was on it had been there for years.
It was plugged with black/purple slime/sludge.
Im actually impressed that the tractor ran in the first place.
2) I found the fuel return line had been dry-rotted and cracked in several places. Replaced this with new line.
3) I also pulled out and cleaned each injector.
4) And of course, strait piped with with new exhaust pipe and gaskets.
Results:
1) Tractor has much more power now than when I brought it home.
In areas where I use to have to drop to 1st gear can now be mowed easily in 2nd with power to spare.
2) The smell of the exhaust has changed and the quantity of black exhaust has dropped dramatically.
Not sure how to explain the smell as it still smells like diesel, but its not the same smell as when I bought it.
3) The amount of blow by (compared to when I brought it home, not when the pump seal went bad) has dropped by half or more.
One other thing, I did notice a heavy tap coming from the engine now.
I think its too light to be a considered a "knock". Its more of a heavy tapping noise.
Im wondering if running diesel diluted oil has caused something internal to wear.
Rich
Turned out, the injection pump had a bad brass seal that was allowing diesel fuel to get past running or not.
They also found that the dv's and plungers were in very poor condition.
After getting it rebuilt and re-installed, I found it very difficult to prime, but once primed, I got it restarted and all seems ok.
A few things I noticed along the way:
1) I had to play tug-o-war with the fuel filter housing to get the fuel filter out. Im guessing the filter that was on it had been there for years.
It was plugged with black/purple slime/sludge.
Im actually impressed that the tractor ran in the first place.
2) I found the fuel return line had been dry-rotted and cracked in several places. Replaced this with new line.
3) I also pulled out and cleaned each injector.
4) And of course, strait piped with with new exhaust pipe and gaskets.
Results:
1) Tractor has much more power now than when I brought it home.
In areas where I use to have to drop to 1st gear can now be mowed easily in 2nd with power to spare.
2) The smell of the exhaust has changed and the quantity of black exhaust has dropped dramatically.
Not sure how to explain the smell as it still smells like diesel, but its not the same smell as when I bought it.
3) The amount of blow by (compared to when I brought it home, not when the pump seal went bad) has dropped by half or more.
One other thing, I did notice a heavy tap coming from the engine now.
I think its too light to be a considered a "knock". Its more of a heavy tapping noise.
Im wondering if running diesel diluted oil has caused something internal to wear.
Rich
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 3,360
Likes: 5
From: MidWest
Well, I attacked the back yard tonight and it may be a slight knock.
Hard to tell.
It only makes the noise when under load.
Well the mower is whats placing the load on the engine and that mower is pretty loud itself. This makes it hard to find what is the cause of the tap/knock noise.
Seems to be most noticeable around 1200 ~ 1500 rpms (just about where I run it while mowing).
Its also most noticeable from the drivers seat. If I stand up and lean over the hood, I dont hear it.
Im guessing that something is starting to let loose due to the fuel in the oil issue.
I guess at this point, Im just going to run her and see how she does.
That Yanmar may still get rebuilt yet.
Thanks for everyones input.
Rich.
Hard to tell.
It only makes the noise when under load.
Well the mower is whats placing the load on the engine and that mower is pretty loud itself. This makes it hard to find what is the cause of the tap/knock noise.
Seems to be most noticeable around 1200 ~ 1500 rpms (just about where I run it while mowing).
Its also most noticeable from the drivers seat. If I stand up and lean over the hood, I dont hear it.
Im guessing that something is starting to let loose due to the fuel in the oil issue.
I guess at this point, Im just going to run her and see how she does.
That Yanmar may still get rebuilt yet.
Thanks for everyones input.
Rich.
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 4,569
Likes: 40
From: League City, TX
Originally Posted by DieselDaze
Well, I attacked the back yard tonight and it may be a slight knock.
Hard to tell.
It only makes the noise when under load.
Well the mower is whats placing the load on the engine and that mower is pretty loud itself. This makes it hard to find what is the cause of the tap/knock noise.
Seems to be most noticeable around 1200 ~ 1500 rpms (just about where I run it while mowing).
Its also most noticeable from the drivers seat. If I stand up and lean over the hood, I dont hear it.
Im guessing that something is starting to let loose due to the fuel in the oil issue.
I guess at this point, Im just going to run her and see how she does.
That Yanmar may still get rebuilt yet.
Thanks for everyones input.
Rich.
Hard to tell.
It only makes the noise when under load.
Well the mower is whats placing the load on the engine and that mower is pretty loud itself. This makes it hard to find what is the cause of the tap/knock noise.
Seems to be most noticeable around 1200 ~ 1500 rpms (just about where I run it while mowing).
Its also most noticeable from the drivers seat. If I stand up and lean over the hood, I dont hear it.
Im guessing that something is starting to let loose due to the fuel in the oil issue.
I guess at this point, Im just going to run her and see how she does.
That Yanmar may still get rebuilt yet.
Thanks for everyones input.
Rich.
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 4,569
Likes: 40
From: League City, TX
Originally Posted by DieselDaze
May try it.
I also hope to get the injectors rebuilt soon too.
Ive also heard/felt a miss in neutral.
I also hope to get the injectors rebuilt soon too.
Ive also heard/felt a miss in neutral.
