I currently have a 2007.5 6.7L auto Crew Cab LB dually, but I'm seriously considering upgrading to a 2010 if the specs listed are accurate. Mine only has a GCWR of 24k, but if the spec sheet (http://www.dodge.com/shared/2010/ram...duty_specs.pdf) is accurate, then the new dually is rated for 25,400. I could use the extra 1,400, as I've had to remove too many important tools and spares at the shop to get under 24k with my race trailer. But although the spec sheet says 25,400, this thread http://www.dodgetalk.com/forums/show...=264277&page=7 says 24,500 instead of 25,400.... So I'm wondering which is accurate. I tend to believe and hope the spec sheet with 25.4k is the truth. To get more capacity, I've considered the Ford 350 with their tow-boss package with a 26k GCWR, but the Ford 350's are over 1000 lbs heavier than the Dodge, so that really doesn't buy me anything.

I'd consider going to a 4500 Cab Chassis, but I'm not thrilled with the possibility of having to deal with the urea that the CC trucks supposedly have, and I don't like the fact that the CC trucks are detuned down to 305/610. I mainly use the truck for towing only, so we have no problems with keeping the DPF clean, I've never had an issue with it (fingers crossed!).

My current truck has a B&W turnover ball GN hitch, I wonder if the frame of the new truck can use the same hitch, or if the frame has changed at all? I'm also hoping I could swap my Firestone airbags over, but I also wonder if the frame and suspension points will allow that. Has anyone seen anything about frame changes that would affect a GN hitch or airbag mounting?

Has anyone heard if the beds will be different? I also have a Roll-N-Lock cover which I love, and would also like to put that on the new truck.

I'm looking forward to the new truck if the 25.4k number is correct. I'm a little lukewarm on the styling - I love the new dually flares, but don't like the front end so much.

Thanks for any info!

 

From what I gather there is no mechanical (frame, drivetrain, tires or otherwise) difference between your truck and the 2010s to justify the higher GVWR.

The increase was probably a result of the engineers, marketing and legal departments sitting down and wrangling out a higher number to be more competitive with Ford.

Unless you are upgrading solely to meet for DOT regulations, then I wouldn't do it. I'm guess you'll take a bath on your current truck.

 

Yeah, the more research that I do I'm leaning towards just continuing to run my current truck for the next few seasons. The truck does a fantastic job with the heavy trailer, so it's not a performance or safety thing. It manages that trailer like a champ, has never once even indicated it wasn't totally in charge of the trailer. And since we mostly just tow with it, I've never had a DPF problem, because it is getting PLENTY of heat in the exhaust and DPF. We only had one check engine light, fall of 2007, and it was a single software error that the dealer fixed in 30 minutes with a computer flash. Since then it has been flawless. Our mileage is very good, 17.x empty and 8.5-9.5 with the tall heavy 16k gooseneck at 65-70 mph, which isn't too bad IMHO.

So I may just keep the current truck and make sure I keep the overall weight under or right at the 24k limit. Not sure if I'll take a bath on it or not if I would sell or trade-in. If the book value (KBB, Edmunds, etc) are reasonably close to reality, then I'll be fine. If they are way, way off (like they sometimes can be), then maybe I'll have trouble. I owe $25k on it, book value "says" $26-30k, but like I said book value is just an interesting number sometimes. Personally I like the overall looks of my 2007.5 better anyway, although the new interior is nice. I'll keep an eye on things over the winter and see where I stand and make a decision. I do love that 6.7 and 68RFE seems to be working great. Thanks all....

 

according to the dodge specs website http://www.dodge.com/shared/2010/ram...duty_specs.pdf the 25,400 GCWR is for dual rear wheels only

 

Absolutely, I have a DRW now and would never ever consider ANYTHING less for what I tow - a very tall, 40' overall length gooseneck with an 18k gross - loaded with my car, ATV, tools, spares and stuff it is 16k, with about 13k on the three trailer axles and 3k on the pin (based on a good CAT scale at a Pilot truck stop). I would never tow it with a SRW, simply because I like the stability of the dually and the safety margin it offers (loss of a rear truck tire, etc). We constantly check our truck and trailer tires for pressures, usually at every stop, and definitely before any tow. Once, we had picked up a nail or screw in one of the inside rears, and it was down to about 25 lbs (wouldn't hold any more). We had towed for 3 hours like that and had never noticed any loss of stability at all. We of course immediately fixed it, but I love the fact that we basically lost (effectively, for that load) a rear tire and we didn't even notice any loss in capability. Dually's are just the best for heavy towing and peace of mind!! But the DRW rating from 2007-2009 was 24,000 and for 2010 it went to 25,400. I was curious what caused that increase - first of all, was it accurate, was the spec correct. And then, was it an engineering increase (did they do something different to the truck, etc) or was it simply a marketing increase (Ford's tow boss dually can do 26,000, so since our truck weighs about 800-900 lbs less then the Ford, we need to state a 25,400 number).

Given the stability, strength and confidence our truck gives us, I have no doubts that it is perfectly fine towing my rig. My guess is that the increase from 24,000 to 25,400 may be more marketing than real engineering, so I may stick with my current truck. Actually, I'll probably just finish this season up (only 1 more race to go, and it's only a 3-hour tow) and then see how much I could get for mine in the spring and make a decision then.

Cheers!

 

I am still not convinced that the numbers are as stated: 25,400.
According to Dodge's own website they are either 24,500 or 25,400...take your pick.

 

Yeah, that's what I'm wondering. On the Dodgetalk.com thread where the 2010 HD engineers were responding directly to questions posted, they repeatedly said 24,500. Then the "official" spec sheet pops up with 25,400. Since it doesn't sound like there have been significant engineering changes, it could just be something as silly as a transposition error with the numbers. I'm sure it will all shake out this winter/early spring and the truth will be confirmed/corrected. That's not a number you can just fudge or not have correct - that would give a Dodge lawyer a heart attack......

 

Must've been the same dyslexic engineer who spec'd my ball joints.

 

Well this is my "guess" and only a guess. Will the truck handle 25400 yes but... it really doesn't matter if it will do it it's what's on the plate that makes the difference to be leagal. I heard the new 3500's were supposed to go to 26k. I know how that sounds but that's what I read, heard somewhere. I need 24k min so I'm back and fourth between the 35 and 4500.

 

You have to have 4.10 gears also, don't forget that.

 

Yes, true, and what I was planning regardless, since the truck spends 80-90% of it's time towing anyway.

 

If you really break it down logically, it comes down to three main issues -1) Actual performance, capability, engineering, safety 2) DOT legality 3) Insurance & liability.

1) Actual performance: I have zero doubts that my current truck is perfectly fine, as any 1-ton diesel dually would be. I've done the calculations on the tires F/R, done the math, and I'm well within the limits of the truck IMO. It performs just fine, is stable as a rock and never puts a wheel wrong. And we've even had it in two emergency manuevers while towing loaded, because of idiots not paying attention, etc. In both of those instances, it was drama-free and the truck handled them fine, with no surprises. One of them also involved a full braking application, and it was fine, it stopped and controlled it fine even with full ABS braking on the truck and full trailer lockup. Towing my 16k trailer with a 2500 would be different, although I'm sure a CTD 2500 would pull it fine, I think it wouldn't be as safe, stable and wouldn't provide a safety margin at all.

2) DOT legality: When I registered my truck for PA class 8 and 24k GCWR, they asked me to prove that was according to manufacturer's specs. I gave them a Dodge brochure and showed them the towing/payload table, and all was good. But I have also heard that people have gotten 21-24k dually's registered for 25-26k without any hassle, maybe they weren't asked, or whatever. So they have a Class 8 truck that says 26k on the owner's card. From what I know, that registration card is what the DOT and law enforcement will judge and weigh you on if you would ever get questioned and weighed. So that really is separate from #1 for the most part.

3) Insurance and liability: This is where, heaven forbid, any incorrect info that you had given the gov't or any lies you told would really come to light. If you were ever involved in an accident serious enough for them (law enforcement and insurance companies) to really invesitigate, everything would come to light. Obviously, most people would never get to that step, but the consequences could be very serious, especially if there was a death or injury involved.

I have no doubts that my current 3500 is perfectly fine towing right at my 24k max from an engineering and mechanical standpoint. I even feel that it is probably fine at several thousand pounds above that 24k number to be honest. But I don't like pushing the limit, being right at the max. The DOT/legal issue doesn't bother me too much, but I do worry that if I was ever weighed, and if the scale was reading off a little or I had a little too much extra crap in my trailer, I could sneak above 24k. I'm careful not to put too much stuff in there, but it could happen. I would prefer to have a 1-2k weight buffer if possible. The insurance/liability thing does worry me too for the same reasons. So if I can verify that the 2010 3500 CrewCab 4x4 DRW 68RFE 4.10 actually has a 25.4k GCWR, I think I will upgrade in early spring.

The irony with the 4500 is that it only has a 26k GCWR manufacturer spec, so with the extra truck weight (it looks like from the specs it has a curb weight 500-600lbs more than a comparable 3500) you really don't gain any capacity at all. That 26k GCWR for the 4500/5500 trucks is laughable though, those things would actually be able to tow way more than that, probably 30-35k GCWR without a problem. But if you had to prove that to the DOT, to an insurance company, or in a court of law, I don't know how you would to that.

It is frustrating, because Ford states 34k GCWR for their F-450 with the 4.30 diff, but I don't want a Ford. Maybe with their new 6.7L and a real 6-7 speed trans someday, but I'm not sure when that will come out. And I wouldn't want to buy the first edition of a totally brand-new engine. Even the 6.7L Cummins is just a displacement increased 5.9 with emissions equipment, so the architecture is very sound.

I think I'm going to seriously look at a 2010 3500 CTD. Through my company I can get the supplier discount price for all the big-three brands, so I should be able to get one at a good deal even if they are not running any deep discounts.

Cheers!

 

The real reason for the 45 or 5500 as I see it, and you stated, is the over build of the truck and brakes. Yes they are "rated" the same but no question they are better built for hauling. I "personaly" would feel better in the 45 or 5500 when up in the 25k range.

While we are at it I have been lookin for the specs for these trucks and can not find the weights to save my life. Another question for ya is the design. Are the 2010's the old design or the new one?

 

Yes, you do have a point on the 45/5500's. They do have beefier springs, wheels, tires, brakes, and I think even frames. I love those facts about them, but I don't like their reduced power and I don't like the fact that they will have urea in the new model year. If I could register a 4500 at a higher GCWR legally, say 28-30k, then I would do that and live with the slightly reduced peak hp.

As for your 2010 question, do you mean the CC 35/45/5500 trucks or the 21010 3500 regular HD trucks? I don't know about the CC trucks for the new model year. Obviously the 2010 3500's have some minor changes - they do mention bigger brakes, but I'm not sure about any wheel, suspension or frame changes. Maybe with the bigger brakes, they decided an increase from 24000 to 25400 was OK?

 

For me the difference in HP isn't a real problem. As you can see below even with my mods I would be suprised if I was runnin 230hp at best. I don't know why they are detuned maybe for longer drivetrain life. Idono. The downside of the 45 and 5500 to me is the cost of repairs. I know not of what I speak but I would suspect that parts are probably a lot more expensive. Also working on it yourself may be more of a problem.

The changes I was talking about was the body style. I thought the 2010's were suppose to have the 09 1500 sheet metal. You know the new frontend with the new grill. Not sure I like it or not just wondering if they made the change this year like I thought. Nothin new around here in the way of trucks so I can't tell.

Someone mentioned the 410 gears in the 3500 for the higher weights. Has anyone put 285's on the 16" rims with the 410's and if so what changes in rpm did it make? Numbers if you have them. Maybe 410's with the 33" tires may be a good compromise. Again Idono, has anyone done it?