abc4yew

One last comment, While I agree that ABS isnt perfect, and have had the same issues some have had with long stops, I beleive the overall benefit FAR outweighs the downside of an occasional long stop. Besides, the fact that you much more likely to survive a rear end accident versus a roll over. $0.02


JC, It only takes one long stop at any intersection to get driver side t-boned and killed. With ABS you are more likely to have a roll over as one of the mentioned gov. studies implied as when you can brake and steer most idiots will steer into trouble. I had a friends son who was team driving a brand new Freightliner... Wrote off the Truck and a load of computers($$$$) steering to avoid a raccoon. I'd rather get rear ended in my truck any day as then it is definitely the **** bangers fault. With the ABS in these trucks you are never going to out stop anything but a Ford Superduty. ks

1sttruck

"With ABS you are more likely to have a roll over as one of the mentioned gov. studies implied as when you can brake and steer most idiots will steer into trouble."

No, the study in progress that I posted said the opposite, see below. We ended up with 4 wheel ABS on our trucks because there were too many complaints about locking up the front brakes on the earlier models.

"Two-wheel ABS has been effective in reducing the risk of nonfatal run-off-road crashes for almost every type of light truck. Nonfatal rollovers were reduced by 30 to 40 percent. Side impacts with fixed objects were reduced by 15 to 30 percent. Frontal impacts with fixed objects were reduced by 5 to 20 percent."

6 2 Carl

My biggest problem with ABS is that it makes the truck very unpredictable when it kicks in. With an unloaded truck it doesn't take much to lock up the back tires. A couple of bumps in a road will cause the ABS to kick in. On a non-ABS truck the tires might skid slightly, but as soon as the road sooths out full braking power will be restored. With the ABS the bumps cause the braking pressure to be reduced, and the recovery time is longer when the road smoothes adding precious distance to stopping times.

My Dodge is the first vehicle I have owned with ABS. I have had more potential close calls then I care to count due to the ABS on this truck. I pull the ABS fuse in the winter, but I get sick of staring at the ABS light, so I put it back in during the summer.

I am annoyed that I have ABS forced upon me. Just because the majority of drivers nowadays are idiots, why should I be forced down to their level?

For the argument that ABS allows you to steer around an obstacle, I can do this just fine without ABS if needed. But there are very few situations where steering around an obstacle is even option, besides these trucks are not sport cars, and really shouldn’t be swerving all around the road anyways.

a.c.kidd

The ABS in my truck doesn't kick in when I have my Drawtite brake controller set above "2" and the trailer on behind....is this how it is supposed to work?

04.5HO600

ill keep my ABS..its there for a reason..
if you bypass it ...something else will get ya
bad Karma
My .02

j-fox

Just remember , ABS means Anti - braking system.
Which requires ABBS. A big bumper system.

Guys the Idea of anti locking brakes is great. BUT, this system is not finished in the ENGINEERING department.

It is going to cost the owners some repairs.

Scotty

The ABS on these trucks in an inferior set up that repsonds much different when on ice and snow compared to non ABS equipped vehicles.
For folks that do not drive in this for about half of each year...keep your ABS intact. For folks that do...I just tried with the fuse out and there was MUCH more control.
Sorry but its not about EGO or Karma...KHARMA its about what I experienced firsthand with totaling a van that was in the wrong and I only hit him at less then 40 KMH. At that speed, even if I did lock up, with the weight of this truck, I would not have accelerated and slammed him that hard or even hit him. This is where ABS is flawed. Its great on dry pavement at higher speeds for the most part to avoid a high speed skid.
Now yesterday I was on some side streets with the fuse in. I accelerated to 40 kmh and then tried...TRIED to stop at the next corner...no luck. ABS kicks in and I go straight through. I did try to steer the corner and the front tires started to slide and plow straight...and at this point I was well under 20 KMH.
So I went back to the same spot, pulled the fuse, started out to 40 KMH, braked at the same light post and I tapped the brake a few times and STOPPED before the corner. Get that? I stopped, did not roll on through.
I then turned the corner and all was fine.
I tried this three times and got the same result.

Earlier in the week if I had rolled into that intersection all happy I had ABS and someone ran the light on the other side, I would have been hit.

Thats where I dislike ABS.

I also have to add that when I was in that collision this past Feb, I was not at fault yet I am still fighting with the insurance company over several items and I have pretty much given up and I plan to avoid any light fender benders as its too much hassle. Without ABS, I may have a truck that is just fine with no hassles stretching out to nearly a year with this claim. Even the head adjuster commented on the abs at slow speed and in the winter as creating more accidents. You'd think with all the years its been out there, they would figure it out but they rarely test on anything other then a dry track. They also rarely test it as thorough in all vehicles loaded or towing.

Thats it from me on this topic...to each his/her own.

Scotty

PourinDiesel

Preach on Brother!!

1sttruck

"Apperently some of you are forgetting that ABS DOES NOT activate until it actually sees tires slippage. It does absolutly NOTHING until then."

Yes. Big differences between ABS braking and non-ABS braking indicate marginal tires for the situation. The stock tires are marginal, even just in rain, and I got them to work a bit better with some additional siping. My experience so far is that that the ABS works fine, but I switch to winter tires when the first snow or ice hits.

On both cars and the truck the ABS has come in handy mainly on high speed panic stops, and I'd be leery about testing non-ABS braking with maximum braking from 70 mph in the rain or on mixed mixed traction surfaces.

rammtuff

I would question someones driving skills if they are engaging ABS at highway speeds for high speed panic stops. Skilled and trained drivers are always looking around them for a situation to occur and compensating before a panic stop at 70mph is required.
Just so everyone is clear about threshold braking:

Threshold braking

Maximum theoretical braking effort is obtained just before the point of wheel lock. Threshold braking is the subtle driver technique which attempts to approach this ideal as closely as possible. It will involve great sensitivity on the brake pedal. Thin soled shoes are a significant advantage. But knowing when wheels start to lock is more of a mystery. How can a driver know from the driving seat that wheels are close to locking?

We've never seen this in print anywhere, but we believe that the messages arrive through the steering wheel. As the front wheels tend to lock small tugs can be felt through the wheel actually pulling away from the locking road wheel. When these tugs are felt is the right time to ease off the brake pedal a fraction and stay at the threshold without exceeding it.

You're unlikely to be able to learn effective threshold braking on the road. On the skid pan it is possible, but things tend to be rather gentle and the maximum braking force is pretty small in the slippery conditions of a skid pan. A better option is to learn threshold braking under instruction on a race circuit.

ABS provides a close approximation of threshold braking, and in an ABS equipped vehicle you might as well normally plant the brake pedal and leave it to the electronics. That said, good threshold braking is better than ABS and can stop you shorter. However, although it is possible to threshold brake in an ABS equipped car, sometimes the ABS will interfere with the subtle steering messages and actually make threshold braking harder.

If your driving skills are at the level that ABS works well for you than use it. Some people have superior driving skills and ABS will hinder their driving abilities.

Hounddog

So driving SKILLS come into play(when braking) when out of nowhere at HI speeds someone without a SIGNAL just swaps lanes in front of you(so close their tag is hidden OR deer/animal/person etc) and hits the brakes.Don't get me wrong I KNOW some SKILL is involved but I bet MUST of US mortals don't have THAT kind.I'll LEAVE my ABS fuse just where it is thankyou.I don't CARE to WONDER who's GOT that kind of skill.In FACT this FORUM willNOT allow posts about diabling EMMISION equipment and I've been wondering WHY this thread has been allowed to continue.This SEEMS(thread/posts about disabling ABS) a LOT bigger issue then a little smog.

PourinDiesel

I don't think anyone is telling you to remove your abs fuse.
No one has told me to?

Hounddog

No but obvisouly SOME are driving with it removed!

Heater

I guess there are pros and cons to Abs. I only chose to disable it when in very slick conditions. When I worked laying gas pipe in steep mountains of WV you were a fool to be on the right of way with that fuse in. The brakes would "growl" all the way over the hill until the trees stopped you.

On the other hand I have had people to make some really stupid moves that were avoided with abs. There was NO time to use proper braking methods, it was slam on the breaks and try to avoid. Sometimes the stopping distance really doesn't mater (even if you could cut your distance in half you would still hit) control will at least let you chose what you are going to hit and where.

The saying that they let you hit what you are aiming at is very true, I have had to make that choice a couple of times, and I would rather waste some guys fence and lawn decorations and not slam a small car with filled with people NO QUESTION. The down side to that is that IDIOt drives away having no idea or not caring that you just saved his life and you are left to deal with the mess.

I say don't just remove it because your buddy did. I could be the idiot that you get a split second to make a controled crash into a porch, mailbox, parked car, and not hit and kill my family. I would appreciate you having that choice.

SolarYellow05

It is sad when my 5000 lb. 1/2 ton truck on 38.5" swampers, stock disc front/ drum rear will stop faster and handle better without abs than my 6800 lb 05 ram with 4 wheel disc and much larger brakes does with ABS. I will have to agree that ABS is another way to idiot-proof a vehicle. Same idea as an idiot light on the dash. I don't want to know I have LOW oil pressure. I want to know what my oil pressure is. Studies may show that ABS has reduced accidents. But that is only when these accidents were caused by people that shouldn't be on the road in the first place. The majority of the accidents I see (I see a lot of them being a firefighter in a city with two major interstates going through it) are caused by somebody that is not paying attention to road conditions, traffic conditions, or anything else for that matter. You should try driving a fire truck that has ABS compared to one without, trying to dodge people that don't know they're supposed to pull over to the right. Some stop in their tracks, some move left, and some move right. Having that extra stopping distance can make the difference between wrecking a $300,000 to $1,000,000 vehicle and possibly seriously injuring someone or making it to the call we're going to. Some of you will say that we should make our following distance longer to compensate for the braking distance, but that's not always possible because you never know what other people are gonna do. If you leave enough stopping distance to be safe, somebody that thinks big trucks stop like sports car will fill up that distance with his/her car.