Airdog 150 install
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From: Southern IL
Airdog 150 install
So I am going ahead and replacing my GFS392 with a AD150 due to me getting ready to go dual cp3s and i have been seeing alot of talk about 1/4 tank issues and draining fuel canisters if returning to the filler neck. My question is what is the best way to go about doing this on a 2003 with no intank lift pump? I want to do it once and do it right so i figured i could pick some brains of some guys that have done this multiple times. Right now i am returning to the filler neck using the OEM pickup tube and have no issues below 1/4 tank. so any information is helpful.
Thanks
Dustin
Thanks
Dustin
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From: Lloydminster, Alberta, Canada
Dustin,
There are so many opinions on this. Just do a search and you have reading for days.
The 1/4 tank issue is only an issue when draw straw length is not done correctly. You have it easy with no in tank pump, but I would suggest that you switch the return from your vent tube to right into the canister.
You're gonna get many, but one option is the way I did mine - click the link in my sig. I have no low level issues tested to about only a depth of =/<3/4" of fuel level in my tank. This is approximately the level I completed my install at. You just have to chose what you feel is right for you or do a combination of many. I researched and then made up my mind on what I thought I would have no issues with. So far, I'm happy with what I chose to do.
There are so many opinions on this. Just do a search and you have reading for days.
The 1/4 tank issue is only an issue when draw straw length is not done correctly. You have it easy with no in tank pump, but I would suggest that you switch the return from your vent tube to right into the canister.
You're gonna get many, but one option is the way I did mine - click the link in my sig. I have no low level issues tested to about only a depth of =/<3/4" of fuel level in my tank. This is approximately the level I completed my install at. You just have to chose what you feel is right for you or do a combination of many. I researched and then made up my mind on what I thought I would have no issues with. So far, I'm happy with what I chose to do.
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Dustin,
There are so many opinions on this. Just do a search and you have reading for days.
The 1/4 tank issue is only an issue when draw straw length is not done correctly. You have it easy with no in tank pump, but I would suggest that you switch the return from your vent tube to right into the canister.
You're gonna get many, but one option is the way I did mine - click the link in my sig. I have no low level issues tested to about only a depth of =/<3/4" of fuel level in my tank. This is approximately the level I completed my install at. You just have to chose what you feel is right for you or do a combination of many. I researched and then made up my mind on what I thought I would have no issues with. So far, I'm happy with what I chose to do.
There are so many opinions on this. Just do a search and you have reading for days.
The 1/4 tank issue is only an issue when draw straw length is not done correctly. You have it easy with no in tank pump, but I would suggest that you switch the return from your vent tube to right into the canister.
You're gonna get many, but one option is the way I did mine - click the link in my sig. I have no low level issues tested to about only a depth of =/<3/4" of fuel level in my tank. This is approximately the level I completed my install at. You just have to chose what you feel is right for you or do a combination of many. I researched and then made up my mind on what I thought I would have no issues with. So far, I'm happy with what I chose to do.
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From: Southern IL
Festus where did you get that corrugated pipe you used for draw straw and return? Why didnt you go with the draw straw provided? I seen one install where a person used leftover blue hose for the return but im kinda worried about that since the hose probably isnt submersible approved.
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From: Surrey BC Canada (it's not that bad eh!)
i have the AD 100 and it isnt big enough and i want to upgrade to the 150 AD......i would like to get this same thing done to mine...do you think my canister looks simular to youres???also where did you get youre draw straw's and youre 90* elbows..could you give me a parts list of what i need to get so i could do mine like youres????thanks
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So I think im gonna try what a few threads I read said and put the 1/2 draw straw in the stock canister touching the bottom with a 23* angle cut on it and see how that works. I would like to keep my return line in the filler neck because to me it seems if i put another tube down in the canister to help keep it full when the tank is full that would put a bigger strain on the pump thus reducing volume potential. any opinions?
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From: Surrey BC Canada (it's not that bad eh!)
If you draw from the canister you'll have problems when you get low on fuel like I did until I put the return into the canister as well.
You won't be putting anymore strain on the pump.
You won't be putting anymore strain on the pump.
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From: Lloydminster, Alberta, Canada
i have the AD 100 and it isnt big enough and i want to upgrade to the 150 AD......i would like to get this same thing done to mine...do you think my canister looks simular to youres???also where did you get youre draw straw's and youre 90* elbows..could you give me a parts list of what i need to get so i could do mine like youres????thanks
However, before you spend that kind of money, make sure as Fisherguy kinda stated and be sure you actually need it.The internals of the canister should be close, however the top of the canister on the tank may be slightly different. The unfortunate part is having to get a look at it for sure to see. In some of the other threads, someone may have inserted a pic of a 2003 canister or at least the top of the tank. Search here, or Google it before removing the bed.
I used a portion of the draw straw - it came from Vulcan Performance - it was ordered additionally as I thought I was going to use it in its entirety until research changed my mind - if I knew exactly what I was doing at the time, I would have just used the supplied portion of the straw supplied with the AD150.
The 90* fittings came supplied with the AD150 I believe. I modified the bracket for mine to sit parallel to the frame instead, so I needed straight in fittings instead of the 90*'s supplied - so, I just re-used the 90* fittings on the bulkhead fittings instead. If you need additional, any good hydraulic shop should be able to supply you with JIC fittings. That is where my bulkhead fittings, machine bushings, and nipples for the bottom side of the bulkhead fittings to connect the teflon hose all came from. I used a place named Red L Distributors up here.
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From: Lloydminster, Alberta, Canada
Why didnt you go with the draw straw provided?
I seen one install where a person used leftover blue hose for the return but im kinda worried about that since the hose probably isnt submersible approved.
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From: Lloydminster, Alberta, Canada
I additionally drilled some strategic holes in the bottom of my canister so it will fill more efficiently from the bottom of the tank.
So I think im gonna try what a few threads I read said and put the 1/2 draw straw in the stock canister touching the bottom with a 23* angle cut on it and see how that works.
Well, many were having trouble getting the draw straw to the correct length, especially when they dropped the tank. Also, to do this, little fuel was going to be in the tank so, not knowing what effect the weight of fuel had on the position of the bottom of the tank at different levels of fuel, I devised a plan. This plan brought into the consideration that the OE canister position arms are spring loaded, so there must be some movement of the tank bottom at different fuel levels or they would have made those arms fixed.
My plan......oh....it's scary: Come up with a draw straw that is in a fixed position inside the canister / bottom of the tank, but yet will move up/down with expansion or contraction if required. The only way to do this is to have it extend in the middle if the canister drops, or bend in the middle if the canister comes up in the tank. Thus............corrugated hose. Since teflon won't degrade in diesel, that is the way I chose to go. I figured there was a reason the engineers designed it with corrugated hoses in the first place, so I just took their design and made it better.
I really only needed to do the suction side that way, but decided to do the return side as well so it will never move and I'm returning fuel to the same spot in the canister all the time. The spot I'm returning kind of acts like a demister pad in say, an inlet pressure vessel, so returned fuel is de-aired before ever hitting the suction line again.
My plan......oh....it's scary: Come up with a draw straw that is in a fixed position inside the canister / bottom of the tank, but yet will move up/down with expansion or contraction if required. The only way to do this is to have it extend in the middle if the canister drops, or bend in the middle if the canister comes up in the tank. Thus............corrugated hose. Since teflon won't degrade in diesel, that is the way I chose to go. I figured there was a reason the engineers designed it with corrugated hoses in the first place, so I just took their design and made it better.
I really only needed to do the suction side that way, but decided to do the return side as well so it will never move and I'm returning fuel to the same spot in the canister all the time. The spot I'm returning kind of acts like a demister pad in say, an inlet pressure vessel, so returned fuel is de-aired before ever hitting the suction line again.
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Yes, I see by your sig that you may be getting beyond the power range of the AD100 - let me know if your letting it go "cheap" - I might have a future application for it. However, before you spend that kind of money, make sure as Fisherguy kinda stated and be sure you actually need it.
whats a reasonable price for it????I will sell it as soon as i get my AD150 kit and get my AD100 taken off...I perty much know that I need the AD150
The internals of the canister should be close, however the top of the canister on the tank may be slightly different. The unfortunate part is having to get a look at it for sure to see. In some of the other threads, someone may have inserted a pic of a 2003 canister or at least the top of the tank. Search here, or Google it before removing the bed.
we always just lower the tank
I used a portion of the draw straw - it came from Vulcan Performance - it was ordered additionally as I thought I was going to use it in its entirety until research changed my mind - if I knew exactly what I was doing at the time, I would have just used the supplied portion of the straw supplied with the AD150.
The 90* fittings came supplied with the AD150 I believe. I modified the bracket for mine to sit parallel to the frame instead, so I needed straight in fittings instead of the 90*'s supplied - so, I just re-used the 90* fittings on the bulkhead fittings instead. If you need additional, any good hydraulic shop should be able to supply you with JIC fittings. That is where my bulkhead fittings, machine bushings, and nipples for the bottom side of the bulkhead fittings to connect the teflon hose all came from. I used a place named Red L Distributors up here.
However, before you spend that kind of money, make sure as Fisherguy kinda stated and be sure you actually need it.whats a reasonable price for it????I will sell it as soon as i get my AD150 kit and get my AD100 taken off...I perty much know that I need the AD150
The internals of the canister should be close, however the top of the canister on the tank may be slightly different. The unfortunate part is having to get a look at it for sure to see. In some of the other threads, someone may have inserted a pic of a 2003 canister or at least the top of the tank. Search here, or Google it before removing the bed.
we always just lower the tank
I used a portion of the draw straw - it came from Vulcan Performance - it was ordered additionally as I thought I was going to use it in its entirety until research changed my mind - if I knew exactly what I was doing at the time, I would have just used the supplied portion of the straw supplied with the AD150.
The 90* fittings came supplied with the AD150 I believe. I modified the bracket for mine to sit parallel to the frame instead, so I needed straight in fittings instead of the 90*'s supplied - so, I just re-used the 90* fittings on the bulkhead fittings instead. If you need additional, any good hydraulic shop should be able to supply you with JIC fittings. That is where my bulkhead fittings, machine bushings, and nipples for the bottom side of the bulkhead fittings to connect the teflon hose all came from. I used a place named Red L Distributors up here.
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From: Southern IL
ok i believe i have a solution I am going to mod my canister like Festus did and just to cure my worries about the return tube hindering the volume due to higher head pressure during full tank I was thinking of putting a T in the return line close to the canister and running one return line to the canister and one up to the filler neck since i already have the filler neck cut for my current walbro setup. This way if the pressure was high on the canister return it could flow to the filler neck instead. any opinions on this setup?
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From: Lloydminster, Alberta, Canada
I like it! No.......er check that......less back pressure on the AD return side. When hydrostatic pressure subsides, gravity should take over and return fuel should hit the canister.
Give it a shot. I don't think anyone has tried something like that. Be sure to give us an update when it's tested at low fuel levels.
Give it a shot. I don't think anyone has tried something like that. Be sure to give us an update when it's tested at low fuel levels.
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From: Southern IL
Yeah In my head it seems like it should work perfect! when tank is low it will flow through canister return due to filler neck return having slight uphill rise and when tank is full the canister will have enough head pressure on it to change paths to filler neck. no check valves or anything nice and "simple"! haha well as simple as some of these liftpump installs get!
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See Fisherguy's thoughts on that. I do not disagree at all. I believe you'll thank us for it.
I additionally drilled some strategic holes in the bottom of my canister so it will fill more efficiently from the bottom of the tank.
This could work. From another thread, this is my explanation of why I went with the flex of the corrugated hose:
I additionally drilled some strategic holes in the bottom of my canister so it will fill more efficiently from the bottom of the tank.
This could work. From another thread, this is my explanation of why I went with the flex of the corrugated hose: