maybe368

Ok, let's do a poll about radial tire rotation. I have always been taught that you cannot rotate radials side to side:

old wives tale


not old wives tale


who cares

Sorry, I don't know how to do a poll...Mark

james1

My BF Goodrich tires have been rotated in a criss-cross pattern for more than 40,000 miles with no apparent ill effects. For my next set of new tires I would like to include the spare and go to a 5-tire rotation pattern.

But I am willing to be guided by those who know more about radial tires than do I. If this is you then please speak up.

TIA

ChrisLib

I`ve worked for 3 separate car mfg`s and every one at some point in time has issued a TSB regarding suspension/tire pull. In each of those bulletins cross rotating the tires side to side is the 3rd step in process (after verifying the complaint and ck`ing the tire psi), so I would say not to worry. I`ve done it on my own personal veh`s and never had any issues.

Jklawinsky

With a good front end and tires wearing evenly, I don't see how it could make a difference. I could be wrong.

maybe368

I found this on ehow.com...


Determine if your steel belted tires have a directional pattern. There will be an arrow or the word "directional" stamped on the sidewall of the tire. You will also be able to see the tread on either side of the tire pointing inward to the center of the tread. If they do, this will dictate or supersede any crisscross-recommended rotation pattern for the tires. You will not be able to crisscross them and will have to rotate them front to back only.

I know this is true on motorcycle tires, but I didn't realize it for car tires...Mark

Before anyone jumps on this, I mean for install only on mc's...you obviously cannot rotate mc tires, they are almost always different sizes anyway ...Mark

BILTIT

Directional tires can be swapped side to side but you would have to remount them on the rims to keep the direction of rotation proper, thus we just do front to back.

GIT-R-DONE

I havent seen any arrows on my tires for years now. I too was always told from the "Old Timers" that you didnt cross the tires , they were to go front to back.
The reason I was told, was because of the belts were used to going one direction and it wasnt good to change the direction because of the belts.

Last week I just rotated my tires with the cross pattern and have had no problems with it at all.

My queston is ....why was a tire made to just go one direction ?

soulezoo

Not exactly an old wives tale, but is a lesson that "old timers" don't keep up with times...

In the old days of radials, they were made in such a fashion that they "wore in" in one direction. Rotating side to side would cause the belts and casing to separate resulting in catastrophic failure. Not too good.

Changes in radial tire construction eliminated this problem some years ago, so no problems.

Most "directional" tires (and those are mostly performance or certain mud tires or ice weather tires) have uni-directional tread patterns that are more effective in their designed direction. It doesn't mean that it can't be used the other way.

The old wrangler radials on military HUMMVEES come to mind. Goodyear Eagles on Corvettes also...

Crossy's son

Directional tires usually perform better in rain and stuff because of the siping, an open lug tire like most non directionals usually don't sipe as well. I had these Goodyear Fortera tires on my old GMC pickup and they were amazing, and I think they make them in 8/10 ply in our sizes to use on our trucks.

This is a directional Tire


I have seen mud terrains like MICKEY BAJA CLAWS that are directional as well, but thats for off road performance as well.

My old style Wrangler MT/R tires are not directional, but the new style they have out now is.

Crossy's son

directional tires usually don't have the option of a white letter side either, which makes sense if you think about it.

BearKiller

Go ahead and flame me, but I highly recommend AGAINST tire rotating, for whatever reason.

I have never seen it cure any problems; whereas, I have many times seen it bring on a host of problems and make an unhappy customer out of what before was a very satisfied customer.

At our shop, for the last twenty-years or so, we have done a complete rotate and balance for the pittance of $25.

Even at that pitiful amount, it doesn't take very many rotates to have two more brand-new tires paid for.

If you have weird wear problems, all rotating the tires will accomplish is to ruin the other three tires.

I have all the equipment at my FREE disposal and at my convenience and, currently owning seven road-ready trucks, I have never rotated a set of tires on any of my trucks ever and doubt that I ever will.


They last longer as a whole by just leaving them alone.

If a truck has a situation that is causing weird wear patterns, it is much better to spend your time and effort addressing the cause, instead of attempting to mask it with a rotation.


Besides, if you don't do this rotating in the safety of your driveway at home, and instead let some idiot at a tire-shop do the work, you are opening yourself up for warped rotors, cross-threaded nuts/studs, broken studs, stripped threads, over-zealous use of air-impact-wrenches on your lug-nuts where I adamantly refuse for them to be, plus the possibility of a wheel or wheels getting left un-tightened when the tire-dummy happens to get a cell-phone call in the middle of your project.



As for switching directions of radial tires, regardless of whatever the manufacturers may say, I do not recommend it; I have seen perfectly good tires slip a belt soon after having a direction change --- several times a week --- so I don't believe that hogwash about the manufacturers having their problems worked out.

I believe that they are actually trying to design their way out of the problem by developing so many one-sided tread designs and directional tires for cars.

It is not uncommon at all to see four tires that are specifically labeled for the four corners of the car.

Plus, many car manufacturers are now putting specific FRONT and REAR wheels/tires of differing sizes that cannot be switched front to rear, plus having RIGHT and LEFT wheels.

The auto manufacturers and tire manufacturers both are trying to design their way away from the popular practice of tire rotation, DUE TO THE MANY PROBLEMS THAT IT BRINGS ABOUT.


Tire rotation was the brain-child of such concerns as (I started to name some popular names, but let's just say the big chain-gang do-it-all shops) as a gimmick to get your vehicle up on the hoist and point out several hundred dollars worth of stuff that you had better let them fix while they have your wheels off; many times, the tires end up back on the four corners where they were all along and you get to pay for a rotate that never happened, once they get you for what they actually intended all along; if you get a "Lifetime Free Rotate", you had best beware, because they have every intention of cleaning your clock, once you show up for your "FREE" work.


Leave well enough alone; we have enough problems without creating more.

maybe368

I was hoping you would jump into this, I only rotate mine, front to back, when I have the wheels off for some other reason., like doing the brakes or something. I agree about not paying somebody else to do it. At this point in my life, I replace my tires based on time on the vehicle, not mileage, with sites like tirerack.com, among others, tires have almost become a throw away item, like cheap tools or computers. I have had tires with lots of tread left, that looked really good, come completely apart in the AZ heat..Mark

BearKiller

The tire companies for years dwelt on making the elusive 100,000-mile passenger tire.

For a few recent years, it was not unusual to see big old Buicks and Oldsmobiles getting 85,000 plus miles on a set of tires, PROVIDING THEY DID IT QUICK.


This high-mileage tread then started to haunt the manufacturers.

Back in the good old BIAS tire days, it was drilled in everyone's head to judge the safety of their tires by the depth of the tread.

The old BIAS casings were tough as iron and age didn't seem to matter, so long as there were a few 32nds of tread left.


Not so with steel-belted radials.

With all the wonderful technology and them fooling the American people into believing they had even been to the moon, they still can't come up with a lasting adhesive that is compatible with steel cable and synthetic rubber.

After about five years, regardless of tread depth, that adhesive has outlasted it's life and catastrophic failure is imminent.

Now, go out and have a close look at your three-year-old radial tires, looking at all of those age-cracks that are between all the little tread patterns.

Each and every one of those little age-cracks go plumb to the steel cord.

Every drop of rain you drive through works it's way down through those cracks and into the steel cord.

Rust sets in and soon destroys the integrity of the steel cable.

When the rusting cable starts to swell with corrosion, it starts pushing apart the already stressed adhesive and soon separates the cable from the surrounding rubber.

If only a little section separates first, then the belt will slip, the tire will knot up, the vehicle will shake and lurch at slow speed, and you will immediately replace the tire before it flies apart.

If a large portion of the rubber separates from the steel, the entire tread will sling off, taking mirrors, fenders, door-handles, tail-pipes, fuel-tanks, and anything else that may be in it's path, until the long strip of tread finally turns loose.

Those hundred-thousand-mile tires were fine for a travelling salesman who was putting that many miles on his car each year; but, not so good for us ordinary Joes who live maybe two miles from work and cannot afford the fuel to go anywhere else; when our tires are ten years old, they ain't yet started to even show wear, but they are subject to fly all to pieces at any moment.


All they have accomplished is to make the tread-life outlast the integrity of the casing.


Five years is the outer limits of radial casing life.



As a result, I see more and more tires with shallower tread depth and quicker wearing compounds, all in an effort to design the tread to be completely worn away long before the possibility of casing failure.


Customers who had gotten used to getting 60,000-miles on a new set of tires are lucky now to get 20,000.

apwatson50

I never bought the big chain stores saying to rotate every 6000 miles and it will extend the life of the tire. I will rotate the tires on my vehicles when the rears are more worn then the fronts. Basically my goal is to have all 4 tires worn the same at the end of their life. As long as that happens I don't see how it matters if you rotate every 6000 miles or 12000 miles.

The one exception is our 97 jeep cherokee, driving up our canyon it feathers (front of tread is worn more than the back) the front tires to where when you get up to highway speed they vibrate a little. So it gets rotated when I feel the vibration. Of course I have c rated LT tires on it so the tread is barely even half worn after 30k miles and 3-4 years.

BILTIT

Yup same here, I only rotate to get even wear.