Well I went and bought a set of injectors from the guy on e-bay. I emailed a couple of people who had bought them and they said they didn't put out the power expected which is what I wanted. These things have 4 holes, larger than stock. Guess my pop pressure was dropping off cause I had to set the idle up quite a bit. Road tested it and it ran great but smoked a lot. I ended up turning the smoke screw all the way out, backed the power screw out a half turn, backed the star wheel off half a turn, and backed the diaphram out about a quarter turn. Still smokes some until the turbo picks up but I didn't want to adjust all the power out. I think I need to check my motor mounts, I get a roughness on heavy acceleration now like they are grounding out. I think the PWs would have been better but I missed out buying them at a reasonable price. I have to drive a little sensible now if I want to keep tires on the back and gears in the trans.

 

Depending on the nozzles you bought (your symptoms suggest you bought the LUCAS aka POD injectors) you may want to:

Make sure you used the thinnest washers available for the injector... usually a twenty thousandths washer.
Next, some rough idle can often be cured by loosening off the injector line nut, reposition in perfectly flush with the injector top, hold in place while tightening the nut back up.

At the very least you should burp the lines to clear away any possible air that may have remained trapped, though that is uncommon after running the engine a bit.

Next, the injectors will in all likelyhood require a bit higher timing on your injector pump.

Your idle on an auto should be roughly 800 RPM in "D" with the AC on high. This leaves sufficient RPM to maintain a decent idle quality and also sufficient oil pressure and water flow, although the latter is not a big issue.

These are some of the things to look for/work on.
You should have gotten those tips from whomever you bought the injectors from. You should also have gotten at least two sets of washers of different thicknesses to work with.

Pastor Bob....

 

Bushey;
Could you please give me a little more imfo. on the efects of the different washer thickness. Thank You

ramguy

 

Hey DJ -- what are the markings & numbers on those injectors that you bought? The fellow claims that they are Bosch injectors, doesn't he?

Just curious, Thanks,

Alec

 

The pods I bought came with 2 sets of washers, but both where .060 thick, and new banjo gaskets. I've also been told to use a thinner washer, but no one can tell me if I'll stick the injector into the top of the piston. But if I won't poke a piston, where do I get the thinner washers. I did all the same changes to injector pump, but put the old injectors back in because of the smoke and bad fuel mileage. Now have a 16cm housing coming and might try the pods again after that. But they where a REAL kick in the pants when I stomped on it, but at 1450* egt, couldn't stay in it long. I've contacted Rod @ wildcat diesle about a set of edm injectors that he says don't smoke as bad. Now all I have to do is be a good boy and beg momma for the money

 

Aslitch, the injectors are Bosch. There is a number 9351 near the top, Brassil KDAL 59P5 182 08 on the side and the part number on the box is 0 432 131 837. I think whoever owned the truck before me had the pump set up. I hadn't set everything up that much. If I had more boost at lower rpm (like a 12 housing) I think they would be very good. At about 6-8 psi the smoke clears a few seconds later I'm at governed speed and have to shift, hard to believe it weighs 6500 lbs.

 

There are a couple common reasons for the smoke issues...
It can be the spray angle of the holes in the tips, it can be that plus timing being too retarded, it can be the tip design which may cause some "dribble" at the end of the injection cycle and so forth.
You should not have any problem with using the thinner washers.
This basically places the tip just a tad further down in the bore and helps to keep more of the fuel cloud in the piston bowl, rather than have some of it cross the piston top.
I am using the .020 washers in mine and no probems so far.
I know many who are using them as well, again no problems have been reported. The only thing that might be an issue is if the particular injector you have, has a longer tip, and I highly doubt that is the case for you.
If you need a set of washers you can go/call any Bosch dealer and ask for them by thickness. They can't be but a couple bucks at the most.

Hope that helps.

Bob.

 

DJ --

Thanks for the info from the injectors.

I think that Bob's suggestions are very reasonable. Good luck setting them up -- wish I had useful info for you.

Alec

 

They 1st gen POD's really can lay down the smoke and stink. This is not the fault of anything more than trying to get a gob of power from a pump with low injection pressure (compared to todays standards) Its hard to have your cake and eat it too. More power from an engine using that low of an injection pressure requires a hole size pretty large. This larger hole size coupled to a low pressure pump has a difficult time getting the fuel mixed well at low rpm and boost conditions. Unfortunantly the large hole size also will have some smoke at high rpm/boost as well.

Its just tough to have the power and super controlable smoke with a 1st gen using the current injectors.

What we did was to begin making injectors with more holes of a smaller diameter. Up to 10. This works well to help control smoke down low and clean up the idle stink and smell. TQ was up on the low end as well. The trade off is the high rpm power was getting clipped off. Back to the drawing board. Now we have what I feel is a good compromise between hole size and number of holes. Smoke control is better and power is better, but not an end-all solution. Currently we have a 4, 5, 6, 7 and 8 hole injector for the 1st gen. Depending on what you want to do with them, most guys can find a solution to their troubles. The Bosch injectors and the POD injectors from Ebay are a 4 hole design and not a bad price IMO, but the smoke control will not compare to an EDM. An EDM injector will cost a good amount more than an Ebay special for certain. Basically double in some cases. I guess it all depends on how bad the smoke issue is to you and yours and how much you are willing to spend to have a less smokey rig.


The use of a thinner washer will not hurt a thing. It wont help much either, but may in some cases with the PODS on idle smoke control. The large holes are still going to form large fuel droplets no matter where the injector sits. The idea is to try and impinge more of the fuel spray into the bowl to help promote mixing, but the mixing of the rather large parcels of fuel from a large hole is still the problem. Its a catch 22 because the large holes work best with lower pressure. This is why in the past 10 years injection pressure has climbed so high and the hole size is down so low in the newer engines. Some of the newest diesels run over 35,000 PSI. The very near future will have a pressure upwards of 45,000 PSI.

Don~

 

I put a set of 370'1 in my 94 and used the thicker washers. should I buy the thinner ones and would it be worth it to change them?

PS my 93 needs PODS hehe
DM01

 

My new 16cm housing just arrived this afternoon, gonna get it installed and try the pods one last time, if they don't do any better, Dodgeman, I'll make you a GOOD deal on them if interested. They've only got about 400 miles on them now, so it should only take another 10-15 more to see if they stay or go bye bye. Hopefuly they go bye bye, and I can buy me a set of the edm injectors

 

Don,
Is there bad side to having alot of smoke?...other than "having alot of smoke" and not getting the best mileage? My 89 can lay down a mean cloud, although its not too much compared to the big boys. Just curious if im hurting anything while im having so much fun!
Brian