Mopar1973man

It cannot be oil or friction modiifiers... Both of those are HAZMAT chemicals. If its toxic to life it MUST be listed. Even diesel fuel and engine oils are listed in the MSDS sheets. So it would have to some sort of chemical that is non-toxic.

If its toxic to human and/or animal it must be listed here in the MSDS sheets. This is why emerency personal (fire fighters like myself) use these listings. Yes... I'm also a Captain of a fire Department...

Ace

So yeah anyway, 2-stroke oil is great to run for an additional lubricity add, and it's also not a bad idea to use some sort of conditioner/cleaner like Powerservice, Fuel Power, or others. I've heard the Shaeffers Diesel Treat is also great stuff.

Mopar1973man

Not really...

I got a thread over on the diesel garage about that right now... But I'll pull a chunk from my web page...

A Cetane rating of 40 is recommended at temperatures above 32 degrees
A Cetane rating of 45is recommended at temperatures below 32 degrees

There is no benefit to using a higher cetane number fuel than is specified by the engine's manufacturer.The ASTM Standard Specification for Diesel Fuel Oils (D-975) states, "The cetane number requirements depend on engine design, size, nature of speed and load variations, and on starting and atmospheric conditions. Increase in cetane number over values actually required does not materially improve engine performance. Accordingly, the cetane number specified should be as low as possible to insure maximum fuel availability." This quote underscores the importance of matching engine cetane requirements with fuel cetane number!!!
So adding cetane boosters are not going to improve the performance of the engine and/or fuel.
Cetane improvers modify combustion in the engine. They encourage early ignition of the fuel. They encourage premature combustion and excessive rate of pressure increase in the combustion cycle.
Look at the materials they use in most cetane boosters. Mineral Spirits, Xylene, and Naptha none of these chemicals are even close to the diesel fuel family. They also have very low flash points like gasoline! Every one of them are used for degreasing and cleaning solvents.
Cetane Number is a measure of the ignition quality of a diesel fuel. It is often mistaken as a measure of fuel quality. Cetane number is actually a measure of a fuel's ignition delay. This is the time period between the start of injection and start of combustion (ignition) of the fuel. In a particular diesel engine, higher cetane fuels will have shorter ignition delay periods than lower cetane fuels.
Cetane booster tend to advance the timing of ignition. Hence the ignition knock that you hear. The lower the cetane number the less ignition knock you'll hear. Also the flash point and the auto-ignition temps of the fuel is reduced greatly.
Cetane number should not be considered alone when evaluating diesel fuel quality. API gravity, BTU content, distillation range, sulfur content, stability and flash point are very important. In colder weather, cloud point and low temperature filter plugging point may be critical factors.
All of the cetane boosters on the market tend to reduce the BTU content of the fuel. Hence it reduces the MPG and the HP/TQ numbers. Sulfur content is been reduced national to 520 HFRR (<15 PPM Sulfur) which mean less lubricity of the fuel. Cetane boosters tend to de-stabilize the flash point. Go back to my Chemical definition page and look at the flash points of the different chemicals.

Now let check the certane rating of diesel fuel...
http://www.cpchem.com/enu/tds_unsecu...el_summary.pdf

43 to 47 Cetane number... Hmm... that's already above the Cummins requirement so no fuel conditioners and/or cetane boosters are needed.

dpuckett

I thought it had been established that the sulfur in diesel fuel didnt, in itself, add lubricity, but that the process to remove sulfur also removed lubricity.

ALso, just because it meets the minimum standard doesnt mean it is ideal, or that the engine wont perform better with a higher rating. That goes for just about anything. An 8 second ride will get a cowboy a score, but a wilder ride will get him a higher score.

Daniel

Ace

Who's talking about cetane??

jimlj

Why the wally world oil in the summer and Injex in the winter? I run wally oil in my snowmobiles with no problems. Sure beats the $25 plus my buddys are paying for Polaris oil. I have had people tell me the wally oil won't go through the injection pump when cold, but I guess -10 isn't cold is it?

Mopar1973man

Correct... The 520 HFRR (ULSD) is todays standard of fuel but my truck was designed around a fuel that was 250-350 HFRR (LSD) which had more lubricants in it. So like I said PS just meets the ULSD standard but can't exceed it where 2 cycle oil exceed the standard in lubricants...

I get some really extreme cold winter at times I'm trust the Injex a bit better for quality and pour point compare to Wally wolrd Super Tech... Last winter it was -20.2*F here and that was on the Injex... I'm not the type that wants to walk home in -20*F weather...

I've run some super-tech and a had a few cold days at about 0*F without to much problems...

Mopar1973man

PowerService is a Cetane booster like most other brand out there...

dpuckett

There are some test results floating around (might be in a TDR magazine) that show that most additives actually have little effect on cetane rating. How true this is, I have no idea, nor do I know enough chemistry to know if someone is pulling the wool over my eyes or telling the truth.

DP

Ace

I wouldn't worry about cetane levels unless you're doing megadoses of the stuff. It's not gonna make enough difference for the engine to notice at all. I just use some of the white bottle Powerservice in my winter fuel add blend for the anti-gel properties. Thats all I use it for.

Mopar1973man

Well think about it... PS is mixed at 400:1 ratio or in other words for every 30 gallons of fuel you need 9.6 ozs of PS. So that means there is 9.6 ozs of PS in 3,840 Ounces of fuel... Not going to make a huge difference in my eyes really...

jimlj

We get -40 here for a few days each winter, the worst I have ever seen is -52. I just have never rode my snowmobile in colder than -10. Thats an oil injected engine, not pre mix. I would think that you would never have a problem mixing the oil when you fill up.

Mopar1973man

Same here I've never really rode a sled below about -10*F... But I know that most sled oils must exceed -30*F to -40*F for artic operation. So it should be excellent for anti-gel.

There is a AMSOil 2 cycle oil that is good down to -52*F but its synthetic. I do have some people testing the AMSOil currently to see if you can run it without problems.

GasganoFJ60

Can adding 2-stroke cause your fuel filter to clog up early?

hfletcher

So, is this correct. We don't want to add cetane boosters - the lower the cetane rating the better. But, typical additives contain cetane boosters, but we dilute them so much their effect is negligible. I am still confused about the use of 2-cycle oil as a lubricity enhancement. Should we use it or not, and if we should, how much should we use per 30 gallon tank of diesel fuel? Is 2 cycle oil a cetane booster?