Amount of time for labor??? Calling Diesel shop mechanics
10-25-2006, 09:08 AM
#31
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West Coast, There could be more to the story then being presented, but every business spends a portion of their budget to attract new business by telephone, newspaper, internet, or others. This cost tells the customer they care (to some degree) to stay in business.
One cost effective and time effective tool you have is to approach the owner (you need to go to the top of the food chain) and tell them your situation from beginning to end. Try to negotiate with him. Always negotiate before you litigate!
Ask the owner, "What would you do if you were in my position?" Let him answer.
If he does not, will not, support assisting you with a solution you have to move on. One powerful tool you have to to LET HIM KNOW you will contact the local TV stations for a consumer news story. (They, TV stations, are all looking for stories of interest to their viewers). This begins to register in his pocket book, bottom line, 'cause he knows he's spending money to get new customers in....not run them off.
Be calm, be patient, have your facts together, and don't exaggerate anything, take whatever evidence you have in writing with you. Be prepaired.
Solve your problem with this guy out in the open with him, and clearly communicate everything you need to tell him. If you go to another shop without him understanding what's going on you're digging yourself a deeper(more costly) hole.
Good luck, stay calm!
One cost effective and time effective tool you have is to approach the owner (you need to go to the top of the food chain) and tell them your situation from beginning to end. Try to negotiate with him. Always negotiate before you litigate!
Ask the owner, "What would you do if you were in my position?" Let him answer.
If he does not, will not, support assisting you with a solution you have to move on. One powerful tool you have to to LET HIM KNOW you will contact the local TV stations for a consumer news story. (They, TV stations, are all looking for stories of interest to their viewers). This begins to register in his pocket book, bottom line, 'cause he knows he's spending money to get new customers in....not run them off.
Be calm, be patient, have your facts together, and don't exaggerate anything, take whatever evidence you have in writing with you. Be prepaired.
Solve your problem with this guy out in the open with him, and clearly communicate everything you need to tell him. If you go to another shop without him understanding what's going on you're digging yourself a deeper(more costly) hole.
Good luck, stay calm!
10-25-2006, 09:44 AM
#32
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It never ceases too....
The time that some of the shops charge for. To re:re vp-44 and injectors. With me ordering the parts was 15 hours. Boy has this truck EVER been trouble since NEW and VERY EXPENSIVE.
10-25-2006, 10:08 AM
#33
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15HOURS to R&R a VP44 and injectors? They give you any KY with that? I'd think the average 3rd grader with a book could do it that fast. I do a VE and injectors in under 3 hours. I do know some shops "punish" the customer if they bring in their own parts.
DP
DP
10-25-2006, 10:14 AM
#34
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dead cylinders
Can anyone tell me how a truck would act if I had cold or dead cylinders? What would the sypmtoms be???
D2 I have already spoke with the owner. He is very sorry for this issue. But I told him "Sorrys" do not fix my truck. After $2700.00 and my truck runs worse than when I brought them the truck I told him " Where do we go now" ??? A also told him I am not giving him a penny more. I will give him a chance to fix this mess. But I also told him I have no problem taking this to a higher power. example: Bureal of Automotive. Or better yet, the internet.....
My biggest issue is after all that has been done to my truck and I find that I have a bad/weak cylinder. Mis diagnosing of my truck has cost me dearly.
Thanks.....
Dave
D2 I have already spoke with the owner. He is very sorry for this issue. But I told him "Sorrys" do not fix my truck. After $2700.00 and my truck runs worse than when I brought them the truck I told him " Where do we go now" ??? A also told him I am not giving him a penny more. I will give him a chance to fix this mess. But I also told him I have no problem taking this to a higher power. example: Bureal of Automotive. Or better yet, the internet.....
My biggest issue is after all that has been done to my truck and I find that I have a bad/weak cylinder. Mis diagnosing of my truck has cost me dearly.
Thanks.....
Dave
10-25-2006, 12:55 PM
#35
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Sorry to hear of all your truck troubles - I hate when that happens! 
I think the shop(s) where you had your rig serviced might not have been "top shelf"...
Everyone should realize that it's nearly impossible to "look" at a vehicle (or any other piece of machinery) and always know what all needs to be repaired before disassembly; often more problems or issues (that may not be detectable through operator use) surface and need to be addressed.
We handle this paradigm by informing the customer of what we think the problem might be, until such time as disassembly reveals what the problem IS, and always leave the decision to repair, replace or not with the customer.
It's also common to discover additional - even unrelated problems - during the diagnosis/repair process. I think the key is to communicate with the customer and let them be in "control" of the repair job... after all, it IS their property.
I think the shop(s) where you had your rig serviced might not have been "top shelf"...
Everyone should realize that it's nearly impossible to "look" at a vehicle (or any other piece of machinery) and always know what all needs to be repaired before disassembly; often more problems or issues (that may not be detectable through operator use) surface and need to be addressed.
We handle this paradigm by informing the customer of what we think the problem might be, until such time as disassembly reveals what the problem IS, and always leave the decision to repair, replace or not with the customer.
It's also common to discover additional - even unrelated problems - during the diagnosis/repair process. I think the key is to communicate with the customer and let them be in "control" of the repair job... after all, it IS their property.
10-25-2006, 01:07 PM
#36
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update
New head gasket is blown. I have milkly white susbstance in my oil. Valve covers are puking oil. Truck has no power. Rear two cylinders against firewall are very cold compared to the other 4. Heavy white smoke at any RPM.
I explained to the shop that what I have now is a labor issue. Poor craftsmanship and lack of good judgement. Shop still sticks with the same story. I have bad cylinders. Well, I took my truck to Rocky Mountain Cumming last month for a lift pump replacement. Rocky Mountain said my trucked screamed expect for the poor idle.
New push rod tubes, valves adjusted, and new head gasket and now my truck runs worse and I have cylinder issues? Go figure....
So I need t find another shop close to Reno, Nevada that I can take my truck to. Rumaruk I might need to come to Sacramento. I have to get my truck fixed ASAP. I will deal with this other company through the Better Business Bureal.
I am very worried about the damaged that could have already been caused from water/anti freeze entering my oil and making contact with my bearing surface. What is the price of a shop rebuilding my motor? That to me is my only option.....??
600 HP here I come at the expense of one lame diesel shop in Reno, Nevada.....
Dave
I explained to the shop that what I have now is a labor issue. Poor craftsmanship and lack of good judgement. Shop still sticks with the same story. I have bad cylinders. Well, I took my truck to Rocky Mountain Cumming last month for a lift pump replacement. Rocky Mountain said my trucked screamed expect for the poor idle.
New push rod tubes, valves adjusted, and new head gasket and now my truck runs worse and I have cylinder issues? Go figure....
So I need t find another shop close to Reno, Nevada that I can take my truck to. Rumaruk I might need to come to Sacramento. I have to get my truck fixed ASAP. I will deal with this other company through the Better Business Bureal.
I am very worried about the damaged that could have already been caused from water/anti freeze entering my oil and making contact with my bearing surface. What is the price of a shop rebuilding my motor? That to me is my only option.....??
600 HP here I come at the expense of one lame diesel shop in Reno, Nevada.....
Dave
10-25-2006, 01:11 PM
#37
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I wouldn't wish your past few weeks on an enemy of mine.
Maybe the headgasket is blown on the 5 and 6 cylinders, then they would have lower compression( or coolant pouring in). I would think lower compression (or coolant pouring in) would mean a weak burn causing cold temps in those cylinders.
Brian
Maybe the headgasket is blown on the 5 and 6 cylinders, then they would have lower compression( or coolant pouring in). I would think lower compression (or coolant pouring in) would mean a weak burn causing cold temps in those cylinders.
Brian
10-25-2006, 02:21 PM
#38
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Even if you do have bad cylinders it shouldn't be running worse than before. Something else is wrong if they messed the head gasket up putting it on I think that should be fixed on thier dime, and its easy to mess one up the deck and the head has got tobe clean and when you think its clean clean it some more it also has to be checked for flatness and machined properly but I think I read that the head was checked. Did they adjust the valves after the new pushrods were put in? It really sounds like serverly slipped timming. When you first started all this I really thought you would find that it was a dropped valve seat, bent valve stem or valve spring it sure don't sound like a bad cylinder that I have ever heard but theres a first time for everything.
10-25-2006, 02:34 PM
#39
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Westcoaster, wow, they sure messed up your truck. I hope you get this fixed.
Geneos garage, has a section on "the good, the bad and the ugly." This is one place to post your experience.
Thanks for sharing your experience.
Davey
Geneos garage, has a section on "the good, the bad and the ugly." This is one place to post your experience.
Thanks for sharing your experience.
Davey
10-25-2006, 05:13 PM
#40
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update
I have now taken my truck to Rocky Mountain Cummins. It now will be fixed right...!!!!
A local diesel performance shop in Reno was the old shop. They did a liquid test on the cylinders.
A liquid leak down test?
Ever hear of it?
Head is off and they poor water into the cylinders to see if leaks down.
That is there whole theory on how they came up with #5 and #6 are bad/dead.....
Cummins has never heard of such a thing...
Bottom line. Local diesel performance shop was into something that was out of their league. I have caught them in several lies and mixed storys.
Time for a lawyer......
Thanks again everyone for the input and help....
Dave
Edited By Moderator
A local diesel performance shop in Reno was the old shop. They did a liquid test on the cylinders.
A liquid leak down test?
Ever hear of it?
Head is off and they poor water into the cylinders to see if leaks down.
That is there whole theory on how they came up with #5 and #6 are bad/dead.....
Cummins has never heard of such a thing...
Bottom line. Local diesel performance shop was into something that was out of their league. I have caught them in several lies and mixed storys.
Time for a lawyer......
Thanks again everyone for the input and help....
Dave
Edited By Moderator
10-25-2006, 05:20 PM
#41
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Wow, an old-fashioned Hydro-Test... what are they using for a service manual - the Farmer's Almanac? 
Their incompetence is exceeded only by their ignorance!
No wonder they're called local diesel performance shop ... that's probably the usual customer feedback.
Edited by Moderator
Their incompetence is exceeded only by their ignorance!
No wonder they're called local diesel performance shop ... that's probably the usual customer feedback.
Edited by Moderator
10-25-2006, 05:32 PM
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I have now taken my truck to Rocky Mountain Cummins. It will not be fixed right...!!!!
local diesel performance shop in Reno was the old shop. They did a liquid test on the cylinders.
local diesel performance shop in Reno was the old shop. They did a liquid test on the cylinders.
10-25-2006, 08:22 PM
#43
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update
Rocky Mountain Cummins is going to do a oil analysis and send it to out local CAT shop. Then check the compression.
Also when the original shop changed my oil to get rid of all the "voodo liquid" they used to check for bad rings. They never changed my oil filter. The left the lift hook that is bolted on the head loose and it was against my starter motor ready to fall onto the road. They left numerous bolt loose or missing.
How fast can anti freeze in oil ruin bearings??
Any lawyers in hear that can give me some free advice?? If so, please pm me...
Thanks...
Dave
Also when the original shop changed my oil to get rid of all the "voodo liquid" they used to check for bad rings. They never changed my oil filter. The left the lift hook that is bolted on the head loose and it was against my starter motor ready to fall onto the road. They left numerous bolt loose or missing.
How fast can anti freeze in oil ruin bearings??
Any lawyers in hear that can give me some free advice?? If so, please pm me...
Thanks...
Dave
10-26-2006, 02:11 AM
#44
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Head Studs
What are the chances I am getting a coolant leak now because of the ARP head studs that where installed?
Shop torqued them to 107. Piers told me 120, then back them off a 1/4 turn. Then back to 120 again? Shop tried to tell me that 13 more foot lbs of torque would not make a difference?
Just trying to figure out what the shop could have done to cause a leak at the head other than the gasket?
Shop torqued them to 107. Piers told me 120, then back them off a 1/4 turn. Then back to 120 again? Shop tried to tell me that 13 more foot lbs of torque would not make a difference?
Just trying to figure out what the shop could have done to cause a leak at the head other than the gasket?
10-26-2006, 02:20 AM
#45
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Is that the torque spec for the studs themselves or for the nuts?
Since your troubles seem to have started with the HG failure, I'd look at the studs being improperly installed, if that was directly prior to the problems. Preloading/stretching studs and bolts is not to hard to screw up if you don't follow proper procedure, such as clean threads, proper lubricant, correct washers/seating face, etc.
Since your troubles seem to have started with the HG failure, I'd look at the studs being improperly installed, if that was directly prior to the problems. Preloading/stretching studs and bolts is not to hard to screw up if you don't follow proper procedure, such as clean threads, proper lubricant, correct washers/seating face, etc.