Let's clear up the mysteries of the Dana 61 front
05-02-2008, 09:26 PM
#1
Registered User
Thread Starter
Let's clear up the mysteries of the Dana 61 front
In a recent post there was some controversy regarding the Dana 61.
My questions and knowledge of them are as follows:
Any Cummins powered Dodge equipped with the 3 spd non overdrive(727) automatic received a D61 with 3.07 ratio.
A 3.07 ratio model 61 has an offset pinion because of that particular configuration.
There are model 61's out there with a ratio of 3.54, found in early first gens.
There are rumors that 3.07 D61's have no parts availability as of recent.Aftermarket or otherwise.
What spline counts were the 61's equipped with?
Are all 61's offset?
What makes them so undesireable?
What year range were the 61's offered and in what vehicles? Were gas models equipped with such?
What, aside from the offset pinion were the physical differences between a D60 and a D61?
What ratios aside from 3.54 were they equipped with? It was mentioned that you could put as low as 4.10 in them.
Please feel free to correct me where I'm wrong, we are here to learn.
Any facts, even if you have only one answer are appreciated. I am trying to clear up the mysteries of Chrysler's many renditions of the Dana front and rear axles, and get it here in one place once and for all. Stay tuned next time when I pick your brains about the 60 front and eventually the 60 and 70 rears. In the meantime I will post my findings from the various models in my driveway. Eventually my goal is to compile one fact sheet including appropriate axle nut sockets by p/n and mfg.
My questions and knowledge of them are as follows:
Any Cummins powered Dodge equipped with the 3 spd non overdrive(727) automatic received a D61 with 3.07 ratio.
A 3.07 ratio model 61 has an offset pinion because of that particular configuration.
There are model 61's out there with a ratio of 3.54, found in early first gens.
There are rumors that 3.07 D61's have no parts availability as of recent.Aftermarket or otherwise.
What spline counts were the 61's equipped with?
Are all 61's offset?
What makes them so undesireable?
What year range were the 61's offered and in what vehicles? Were gas models equipped with such?
What, aside from the offset pinion were the physical differences between a D60 and a D61?
What ratios aside from 3.54 were they equipped with? It was mentioned that you could put as low as 4.10 in them.
Please feel free to correct me where I'm wrong, we are here to learn.
Any facts, even if you have only one answer are appreciated. I am trying to clear up the mysteries of Chrysler's many renditions of the Dana front and rear axles, and get it here in one place once and for all. Stay tuned next time when I pick your brains about the 60 front and eventually the 60 and 70 rears. In the meantime I will post my findings from the various models in my driveway. Eventually my goal is to compile one fact sheet including appropriate axle nut sockets by p/n and mfg.
05-03-2008, 12:29 AM
#2
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Vancouver island
Posts: 690
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Heres what Ive found.
http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billav...%20Shafts.html
Heres a quote from page 2 of the dana 60 bible from pirate 4x4.
http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billav...%20Shafts.html
Heres a quote from page 2 of the dana 60 bible from pirate 4x4.
What's the deal with the Dana 61?
With mileage and emissions concerns rising, at some point Dodge and / or Ford decided they wanted to be able to offer gears higher than the current highest ratio of 3.54 available in the D60. However, because of the design of the D60 the pinion head could not be made big enough to achieve a higher ratio. Hence, the birth of the Dana 61, which has a different casting that moves the pinion over 0.25"-0.437" (conflicting reports) - this allowed for a 3.07 axle ratio. The Dana 61 also uses 3.5" axle tubes. Other than that, it is very similar to the Dana 60. The Dana 61 was common in Dodge front ends and Ford van rears.
The difficulty with the Dana 61 is very limited gear and locker choices. However, you can use a combination of ring gear spacer and thick gear set to allow the use of differentials and gear sets intended for the Dana 60.
Slagburn reports: to run a 4.88 I had to go with series 3 carrier, series 1 being 4.10 and down, series 2 being 4.56 and up, then the series 3. PLUS a .160" spacer. That's the problem, nobody makes a full case locker for a 61, but it could be doable with a thick ring gearset AND a spacer.
Reider racing< Randy's R&P, and other sources make ring gear spacers for the Dana 61 .
http://www.reiderracing.com/ringspacer.htm
With mileage and emissions concerns rising, at some point Dodge and / or Ford decided they wanted to be able to offer gears higher than the current highest ratio of 3.54 available in the D60. However, because of the design of the D60 the pinion head could not be made big enough to achieve a higher ratio. Hence, the birth of the Dana 61, which has a different casting that moves the pinion over 0.25"-0.437" (conflicting reports) - this allowed for a 3.07 axle ratio. The Dana 61 also uses 3.5" axle tubes. Other than that, it is very similar to the Dana 60. The Dana 61 was common in Dodge front ends and Ford van rears.
The difficulty with the Dana 61 is very limited gear and locker choices. However, you can use a combination of ring gear spacer and thick gear set to allow the use of differentials and gear sets intended for the Dana 60.
Slagburn reports: to run a 4.88 I had to go with series 3 carrier, series 1 being 4.10 and down, series 2 being 4.56 and up, then the series 3. PLUS a .160" spacer. That's the problem, nobody makes a full case locker for a 61, but it could be doable with a thick ring gearset AND a spacer.
Reider racing< Randy's R&P, and other sources make ring gear spacers for the Dana 61 .
http://www.reiderracing.com/ringspacer.htm
05-03-2008, 09:37 AM
#4
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Western Washington
Posts: 65
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Big Stinky posted some very good info..
I have a few specifics to add if anyone cares
D60 4.10 case holds D61 3.00 to 3.31 R/P
D60 4.56 case holds D61 3.54-4.10 THICK R/P
D61 tall case holds D60 3.33 to 4.10 R/P
They are the same spline count as a D60 - they are a D60 with an offset pinion, which limits locker, gear ratio, and gearset choices. But like posted above getting creative with them can result in a full range of ratios and lockers. FYI all parts and pieces of the front axle will be the same as a normal D60, including pinion and carrier bearings.
I have a few specifics to add if anyone cares
D60 4.10 case holds D61 3.00 to 3.31 R/P
D60 4.56 case holds D61 3.54-4.10 THICK R/P
D61 tall case holds D60 3.33 to 4.10 R/P
They are the same spline count as a D60 - they are a D60 with an offset pinion, which limits locker, gear ratio, and gearset choices. But like posted above getting creative with them can result in a full range of ratios and lockers. FYI all parts and pieces of the front axle will be the same as a normal D60, including pinion and carrier bearings.
05-03-2008, 08:02 PM
#6
Registered User
I have a brake question- were the early selectro external hub front axle's brake rotors/pads/calipers any different than the later axles with internal hubs?
05-03-2008, 08:23 PM
#7
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Vancouver island
Posts: 690
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Try pirates site
Everything you need to know about the 60... and some things you wont ever care to know...
http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billav...ont/index.html
Everything you need to know about the 60... and some things you wont ever care to know...
http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billav...ont/index.html
Trending Topics
05-04-2008, 06:01 PM
#10
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Vancouver island
Posts: 690
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I cant believe nobody wants em....
Theres nothing wrong with them, I would buy one. For my chevy even!
Everybody around here wants at least 1500 bucks for their poo (as in needs help) chevy 60s, rebuilts go for more. Dodge ones seem to be easier to come by, but they still bolt in (chevys).
Theres nothing wrong with them, I would buy one. For my chevy even!
Everybody around here wants at least 1500 bucks for their poo (as in needs help) chevy 60s, rebuilts go for more. Dodge ones seem to be easier to come by, but they still bolt in (chevys).
09-23-2019, 07:05 AM
#11
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Big Stinky posted some very good info..
I have a few specifics to add if anyone cares
D60 4.10 case holds D61 3.00 to 3.31 R/P
D60 4.56 case holds D61 3.54-4.10 THICK R/P
D61 tall case holds D60 3.33 to 4.10 R/P
They are the same spline count as a D60 - they are a D60 with an offset pinion, which limits locker, gear ratio, and gearset choices. But like posted above getting creative with them can result in a full range of ratios and lockers. FYI all parts and pieces of the front axle will be the same as a normal D60, including pinion and carrier bearings.
I have a few specifics to add if anyone cares
D60 4.10 case holds D61 3.00 to 3.31 R/P
D60 4.56 case holds D61 3.54-4.10 THICK R/P
D61 tall case holds D60 3.33 to 4.10 R/P
They are the same spline count as a D60 - they are a D60 with an offset pinion, which limits locker, gear ratio, and gearset choices. But like posted above getting creative with them can result in a full range of ratios and lockers. FYI all parts and pieces of the front axle will be the same as a normal D60, including pinion and carrier bearings.
09-23-2019, 03:06 PM
#13
Registered User
Few other big diffs that take 3.07:
- Dana 61 rear (certain 77-84? F250/350) For whatever reason, the Ford 61's could have almost any ratio from 3.07-4.10.
- 10.25" Sterling (might be tough to find the r&p, but did exist)
- Dodge Dana '71' (actually 70-U2A) which is 3.07. Found in almost all the non-intercooled cummins/auto trucks. Change perches. Width is the same. Bendix 12" brakes just like Ford too.
09-23-2019, 06:40 PM
#14
Registered User
I put a D61/D71 combo in my RC as I wanted a truck that parted with the NV4500 would sip fuel driving the RC loaded with six adults and tailgating gear to Morgantown WV for WVU games. In hindsight if I had known when I was building the truck that I would eventually run 36" tires during the Summer I probably would have went with 3.54's. But I can run 76mph at 1650rpms LOL. Now if I was building a truck to run everyday with a tire no bigger than a 255 that would never really tow then I would absolutely run the 3.07 in it. For a truck that tows very heavy then I would stay away from anything higher than a 3.54.
09-24-2019, 09:29 AM
#15
Registered User
mr gasket has a ring gear spacer at .160" thick, i think i have a number for the carrier bearing spacer too, but dont remember thickness, been 3 years since front build.