Death Wobble....Now I need new shorts!
06-09-2008, 06:37 PM
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Death Wobble....Now I need new shorts!
Experienced death wobble for my first time today. I was going down hill, on a back road near my parents house, maybe doing around 45 around a gentle left hand bend, and hit a bump mid turn. All heck broke loose after that. The truck shook so bad I could hardly hold onto the wheel, and the truck did not want to turn for the hard right hander that was coming up fast. I finally got it slowed down enough that it stopped shaking and I was able to make the turn. Pulled over and did a quick visual, nothing appeared loose or ready to fall off.
My question is, where do I start looking? I replaced my track bar with SS adjustable 3rd gen style about 9-10,000miles ago, did all 4 balljoints about 12,000miles ago, and personally did the state inspection myself less than 4,000miles ago. I had a slight bit of play in the passenger side balljoints, barely noticeable, a slight bit in the driverside unit bearing, and a descent bit in my passenger side tierod end, but it still passed inspection. I have a Lukeslink to take care of the tierod end if you guys think that could be the cause of it. I've had a clunking in my steering wheel for quite sometime now, which is usually a track bar, but I figured it was just the lower steering columb bushing since the clunking would actually go away in the winter time. Could it be control arm bushings? I havn't really checked them out to good. I thought maybe it was my shocks (i've got a set of bilsteins I havn't gotten around to putting on yet), but I would think they would have to be all but blown out to make the truck shake that bad over a bump. I'd appreciate any advice or help you guys can give me. Thanks.
My question is, where do I start looking? I replaced my track bar with SS adjustable 3rd gen style about 9-10,000miles ago, did all 4 balljoints about 12,000miles ago, and personally did the state inspection myself less than 4,000miles ago. I had a slight bit of play in the passenger side balljoints, barely noticeable, a slight bit in the driverside unit bearing, and a descent bit in my passenger side tierod end, but it still passed inspection. I have a Lukeslink to take care of the tierod end if you guys think that could be the cause of it. I've had a clunking in my steering wheel for quite sometime now, which is usually a track bar, but I figured it was just the lower steering columb bushing since the clunking would actually go away in the winter time. Could it be control arm bushings? I havn't really checked them out to good. I thought maybe it was my shocks (i've got a set of bilsteins I havn't gotten around to putting on yet), but I would think they would have to be all but blown out to make the truck shake that bad over a bump. I'd appreciate any advice or help you guys can give me. Thanks.
06-09-2008, 08:51 PM
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It's quite an event isn't it? I thought for sure I was going to DIE- I was doing 65 on a straight downhill section of mtn road. Hit that bump....and didn't think I was going to get slowed before the turn either. I didn't think my heart could beat that fast!
Mine was still warranty so I wrapped a few choice words up as presents for the dealer and heated up a couple of Managers until they basically redid everything! Since then I have found through research that if the common suspects have been fixed you need to REALLY be careful of tire inflation. I posted Dodge's safety bulletin on the forum somewhere if you are interested- yes, they know about it and yes, they know what to check/fix to TRY to keep it from happening!
Glad you are alright. Scary as **** though, huh? !!
Mine was still warranty so I wrapped a few choice words up as presents for the dealer and heated up a couple of Managers until they basically redid everything! Since then I have found through research that if the common suspects have been fixed you need to REALLY be careful of tire inflation. I posted Dodge's safety bulletin on the forum somewhere if you are interested- yes, they know about it and yes, they know what to check/fix to TRY to keep it from happening!
Glad you are alright. Scary as **** though, huh? !!
06-09-2008, 10:01 PM
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Your darn right its scary! I've never experienced anything like that in my life! Could sway bar links really cause that? Mine do look like they could use replacing. MtnDodge, let me know where I can find that safety bulliten. I have my rear tires set to 70psi, and my RF at 75 while I have the LF at 80. My LF has a slow leak, so I usually put about 5lbs. more in it so I don't have to air it up quite as often. I'm planning on getting new tires soon, so I figured I'd just deal with it a little while.
I did have a chance to check the front end out a bit tonight at my buddies house. The pass. side tierod end is worse than I thought. I need to either replace it, or put that lukes link on it that I have laying around. The trackbar bushings have about 1/8" play in them, I don't know if that is normal. I started the truck up and quickly worked the wheel back and forth while my buddy watched the trackbar, so I'd imagine that kind of force on it would cause them to flex a little bit. The control arm bushings seem good and solid yet. I stood on the brake and rode the clutch in 1st and Reverse to get the body to rock back and forth. He watched and said they didn't have any movement in them. I'll check the balljoints and wheel bearings tomorrow when I get somemore time, but I don't think I'll have any problems with them.
I did have a chance to check the front end out a bit tonight at my buddies house. The pass. side tierod end is worse than I thought. I need to either replace it, or put that lukes link on it that I have laying around. The trackbar bushings have about 1/8" play in them, I don't know if that is normal. I started the truck up and quickly worked the wheel back and forth while my buddy watched the trackbar, so I'd imagine that kind of force on it would cause them to flex a little bit. The control arm bushings seem good and solid yet. I stood on the brake and rode the clutch in 1st and Reverse to get the body to rock back and forth. He watched and said they didn't have any movement in them. I'll check the balljoints and wheel bearings tomorrow when I get somemore time, but I don't think I'll have any problems with them.
06-09-2008, 10:24 PM
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An 1/8" of play seems like a lot.
After I had my "Oh s**t" moment on the Baltimore beltway. I added one of the bearing/bar setups that goes on the end of the steering box. That helped a lot. It was a fairly cheap, easy add-on.
- Craig
After I had my "Oh s**t" moment on the Baltimore beltway. I added one of the bearing/bar setups that goes on the end of the steering box. That helped a lot. It was a fairly cheap, easy add-on.
- Craig
06-10-2008, 07:01 AM
#7
This is what I did, but it doesn't seem like there is any one fix for all the trucks. Replaced my Y-type steering to T, got the PSC steering stabilzer, Bilsteins and finally Thuren's track bar (that things BUILT)...
Each of these steps seemed to have fixed it for a while, then it came back. Biggest impact was I had too much toe-in after my tie-rod replacement. But it still had that uneasy feeling over any road imperfections.
Thuren's bar is the last thing I put on a few weeks ago, and everything seems more solid. I still have some play in the steering box, and the sway bar links probably need replacement (as well as the control arm bushings I bought because I had finally figured I'd swap just it all out).
Getting new tires and an alignment tomorrow. Mechanic should like it, everything is new and clean now....
Each of these steps seemed to have fixed it for a while, then it came back. Biggest impact was I had too much toe-in after my tie-rod replacement. But it still had that uneasy feeling over any road imperfections.
Thuren's bar is the last thing I put on a few weeks ago, and everything seems more solid. I still have some play in the steering box, and the sway bar links probably need replacement (as well as the control arm bushings I bought because I had finally figured I'd swap just it all out).
Getting new tires and an alignment tomorrow. Mechanic should like it, everything is new and clean now....
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06-10-2008, 04:53 PM
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I ordered the Suspensionmaxx swaybar links today, will probably put those on wednesday or thursday night along with the lukeslink on the tierod end. I'm gonna do all 4 shocks tonight and the trackbar bushings and check my wheelbearings and balljoints out good. I just cant believe that tierod end is that bad in this short amount of time. Thats the last thing i buy anything from NAPA again.
06-10-2008, 11:22 PM
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Ok, here's what I have saved from my research. Some comments from others and then the safety bulletin. Hope it's useful!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>(from an engineer)
Actually, It has to do with the general design of the front end.
The steering box is mounted to the frame, and the control arms are mounted to the frame, but can pivot up and down, and left and right very easily. If the axle moves left/right the tires will turn the opposite direction (since the steering box did not move).
The only front end part that keeps the axle from moving left/right is the trac bar.
The Steering stabilizer slows down the left/right motion of the tires.
All it takes is a loose track bar, allowing the axle to move left/right, and is extremely exaggerated with a worn steering stabilizer.
What will happen, is when you hit a bump, the wheels take a small turn, moving the axle over 1/4", and in turn, the wheels turn the opposite direction, and the axle takes off that direction, and turns the wheels the other way, this happens very fast,, back and forth making the truck hop up and down and move left to right while making you feel like you have no control,, and until you slow down enough, the wheels continue to turn left/right and the axle moving back and forth until you slow down enough the truck can catch up with the left/right movements and the wheels no longer turn left/right, and you can continue on your way again, untill you hit just the right size bump again.
This phenomenon can happen on any year Dodge from '94 - '04+ (I have heard of a couple accounts of DW on '03 trucks.)...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>______________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I want to start off by saying this is not a fix all to front end shimmy. This is not a slight vibration but is to address a harsh, hard to control, cant keep the truck on the road kind of shimmy. If your truck has this you will with out a doubt have no confusions if this applies to you. If you just have a vibration or shimmy, this does not apply to you...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.
*Tsb 22-005-06 2003 - 2007 2500/3500*
SUBJECT: Front end shimmy on 4x4 Vehciles when traveling over rough surfaces in the road.
OVERVIEW: This bulletin involves verifying the condition of the vehcile front suspension and steering components, and adjusting the front tire pressure.
MODELS: 2003 - 2007 (DR/DH/D1/DC) Ram Trucks (2500-3500)
NOTE: This bulletin applies to four wheel drive (4x4) 2500 and 3500 model vehicles.
DIAGNOSIS:If the customer experiences the above condition perform the Repair Proceedure.
PARTS REQUIRED:
qt. 1 52106909ae Steering Damper
qt. 1 05086146ac Outer Tie Rod Package
qt. 1 05086144ac Tie Rod and outer link
qt. 2 06505623aa Nut and Washer
This repair should be properly diagnosed by the Dealership. The decision to do the repairs should come after it has been properly diagnosed by the dealership.
The first thing the dealership will check is to verify that the tire pressure is as follows.
On LT235/80R17E or LT245/70R17E tires the front tire pressure should be at 65psi, REGARDLESS OF THE LOAD BEING CARRIED BY THE VEHICLE.
On LT265/70R17E or LT285/70R17E tires, the front tire pressure should be at 60psi, REGARDLESS OF THE LOAD BEING CARRIED BY THE VEHICLE.
On the rear tires: Refer to the Tire Inflation Chart brochure in the Owners manual or to the Placecards located either on the face of the drivers door or on the drivers "B" pillar.
(The rest of the diagnosis proceedure is 3 pages long of measure this and measure that kind of thing )
_____________
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>(from an engineer)
Actually, It has to do with the general design of the front end.
The steering box is mounted to the frame, and the control arms are mounted to the frame, but can pivot up and down, and left and right very easily. If the axle moves left/right the tires will turn the opposite direction (since the steering box did not move).
The only front end part that keeps the axle from moving left/right is the trac bar.
The Steering stabilizer slows down the left/right motion of the tires.
All it takes is a loose track bar, allowing the axle to move left/right, and is extremely exaggerated with a worn steering stabilizer.
What will happen, is when you hit a bump, the wheels take a small turn, moving the axle over 1/4", and in turn, the wheels turn the opposite direction, and the axle takes off that direction, and turns the wheels the other way, this happens very fast,, back and forth making the truck hop up and down and move left to right while making you feel like you have no control,, and until you slow down enough, the wheels continue to turn left/right and the axle moving back and forth until you slow down enough the truck can catch up with the left/right movements and the wheels no longer turn left/right, and you can continue on your way again, untill you hit just the right size bump again.
This phenomenon can happen on any year Dodge from '94 - '04+ (I have heard of a couple accounts of DW on '03 trucks.)...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>______________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I want to start off by saying this is not a fix all to front end shimmy. This is not a slight vibration but is to address a harsh, hard to control, cant keep the truck on the road kind of shimmy. If your truck has this you will with out a doubt have no confusions if this applies to you. If you just have a vibration or shimmy, this does not apply to you...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.
*Tsb 22-005-06 2003 - 2007 2500/3500*
SUBJECT: Front end shimmy on 4x4 Vehciles when traveling over rough surfaces in the road.
OVERVIEW: This bulletin involves verifying the condition of the vehcile front suspension and steering components, and adjusting the front tire pressure.
MODELS: 2003 - 2007 (DR/DH/D1/DC) Ram Trucks (2500-3500)
NOTE: This bulletin applies to four wheel drive (4x4) 2500 and 3500 model vehicles.
DIAGNOSIS:If the customer experiences the above condition perform the Repair Proceedure.
PARTS REQUIRED:
qt. 1 52106909ae Steering Damper
qt. 1 05086146ac Outer Tie Rod Package
qt. 1 05086144ac Tie Rod and outer link
qt. 2 06505623aa Nut and Washer
This repair should be properly diagnosed by the Dealership. The decision to do the repairs should come after it has been properly diagnosed by the dealership.
The first thing the dealership will check is to verify that the tire pressure is as follows.
On LT235/80R17E or LT245/70R17E tires the front tire pressure should be at 65psi, REGARDLESS OF THE LOAD BEING CARRIED BY THE VEHICLE.
On LT265/70R17E or LT285/70R17E tires, the front tire pressure should be at 60psi, REGARDLESS OF THE LOAD BEING CARRIED BY THE VEHICLE.
On the rear tires: Refer to the Tire Inflation Chart brochure in the Owners manual or to the Placecards located either on the face of the drivers door or on the drivers "B" pillar.
(The rest of the diagnosis proceedure is 3 pages long of measure this and measure that kind of thing )
_____________
06-10-2008, 11:33 PM
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I was driving down the road the other day and I saw a 2nd gen 3/4t doing a dw just driving down the road not braking or anything, it looked like the tire was about to fly off the truck, and he kept driving down the road like nothing was going on 
06-11-2008, 06:15 AM
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Well, I got the Bilsteins on last night. Man does that thing ride nice now. Its probably better than new. I think I found the source of the clunking through my steering wheel too. The RF upper shock mount was loose, allowing the threaded part at the top to move up and down through the metal washer over the top bushing. The threads were all chewed up at that section. Hopefully the swaybar links come today and I can get them on and do the trackbar bushings and the tierod end.
06-11-2008, 09:02 PM
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I just had the death wobble for the first time three days ago. I've almost got the front end rebuilt now all I need is shocks and the DT profab track bar.
06-11-2008, 10:40 PM
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Funny, I have gotten a clunk in the wheel as well. New front shocks, sway bar links too. I noticed the bottom mount for my front shocks, the threads were worn on the bolt, shocks moving up and down.. Anyhow, now that is done, its still there. But the trick is only after the truck is running for a while which seems to me that it might be the steering box.. I can't get any significant movement out of the track bar or control arm bushings..I am stuck for what to do..
06-11-2008, 10:51 PM
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Funny, I have gotten a clunk in the wheel as well. New front shocks, sway bar links too. I noticed the bottom mount for my front shocks, the threads were worn on the bolt, shocks moving up and down.. Anyhow, now that is done, its still there. But the trick is only after the truck is running for a while which seems to me that it might be the steering box.. I can't get any significant movement out of the track bar or control arm bushings..I am stuck for what to do..
06-11-2008, 11:26 PM
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Well I had the DW and after scrubbing the stain out of the drivers seat I crawled under her to find out what was going on. Took a good look at the steering box and saw that the frame rail had broke all the way around except for the top. Put a fish plate on it and welded it up real good and thankfuly I haven't had it again.